Can someone help this Kiwi fly?

[Harfish]

So I bought KSP over the weekend and have already sunk many hours into it, including a weird rocket/jet hybrid that achieved a circular orbit, re-entry and then the command module slammed into a mountain killing all aboard.

What I can\'t seem to get working is the space planes, I\'ve built one I really like but I can\'t get it to take off. So I built a really simple plane and that won\'t take off either. I can get them up to around 100m/s but when I pitch up, the control surface on the wing moves but the nose doesn\'t rise.

Here\'s the Helios, I know it\'s heavy but it should take off under jet engine power only. It\'s designed to fly up thru the lower atmosphere before igniting its rockets to enter orbit.

And here\'s my simple plane which also doesn\'t take off

[Guapo]

Looks better than mine... My rig looks like the chief designer was Wile E. Coyote...

[Capt'n Skunky]

Welcome to the KSP Forums!

Happy Launching!

Arrr!

Capt\'n Skunky

KSP Community Manager

[pushingrobot]

Grab a book or other solid object. That\'s your \'plane\'. Rest it on a pair of pencils at the front and back. Those are your \'landing gear\'.

Now, push down (your \'control surface\') on the back of the \'plane\', right on top of the rear \'landing gear\'. Notice that the \'plane\' doesn\'t tilt up.

Play around a bit and you\'ll figure out how to position your landing gear and control surfaces to provide much better leverage.

[Harfish]

Looks better than mine... My rig looks like the chief designer was Wile E. Coyote...

I\'ve had a few of those. Was showing my workmate the Artemis Mark 2 rocket which has eight wing mounted engines. Because of the torque from the engines the entire fuselage flexes and it kinda looks like a snake slithering thru the air. At least until the vibrations shake it to pieces and the Kerbinauts plummet to their fiery deaths.

[princessjane]

So I bought KSP over the weekend and have already sunk many hours into it, including a weird rocket/jet hybrid that achieved a circular orbit, re-entry and then the command module slammed into a mountain killing all aboard.

What I can\'t seem to get working is the space planes, I\'ve built one I really like but I can\'t get it to take off. So I built a really simple plane and that won\'t take off either. I can get them up to around 100m/s but when I pitch up, the control surface on the wing moves but the nose doesn\'t rise.

Here\'s the Helios, I know it\'s heavy but it should take off under jet engine power only. It\'s designed to fly up thru the lower atmosphere before igniting its rockets to enter orbit.

And here\'s my simple plane which also doesn\'t take off

Ok, so the first spaceplane... if you designed the same thing in the VAB and launched it you we see that all the thrust is high up on your center and thus forcing the craft to nose dive, secondly you do not have enough wing to generate the lift required for that kind of weight. Some tips from what I have learned in space plane design...

1. try keeping your weight and your thrust as close to center as you can.

2. if you are not getting lift off then you need more lift generation (ie. wings) or less weight

3. using shift + qweasd to angle the engines very slightly up or down can help balance out the craft if the weight/ thrust is far from center.

Hope that helps

[pushingrobot]

You\'ll never get to orbit unless your spaceplane is very balanced, both left-right and top-bottom. Once the atmosphere really starts to thin (around 30km) and control surfaces lose their effectiveness, even a small offset between the longitudinal axes of your center of mass and thrust will send you tumbling. Since your craft\'s center of mass will shift around as fuel tanks are emptied, the easiest way to keep a space plane vertically balanced is to put all the heavy parts in one flat plane (pun intended).

I should really make the time to finish and post my air/space plane tutorial. It goes into all of this. (Though I\'ll need to update it for 0.16, assuming I can ever download it 8) )

[T-Bouw]

To add to pushingrobot\'s landinggear tip:

What helps for me, is to position the rear landinggear slightly higher on the plane. So what I mean is instead of putting them directly under your plane\'s fueltanks, place them on the sides and angle them down.

Your plane\'s rear will now be slightly lower than the front witch in turn angles the nose upwards to help liftoff.