Rendezvous

[paul_c]

Just remind us what you're trying to do (ie what does the contract say?), how many crew you have on the vessel, and how many crew it can accommodate.

[Anonymous49]

31 minutes ago, paul_c said:

Just remind us what you're trying to do (ie what does the contract say?), how many crew you have on the vessel, and how many crew it can accommodate.

the contract says "Explore Kerbin"

[paul_c]

Ok......what does it ask you to do specifically? I can't remember what "explore Kerbin" entails.

[Anonymous49]

rendezvous two capsules in orbit around kerbin

[Spricigo]

1 hour ago, Anonymous49 said:

the structural tube is what i call a "temporary seat".

For your own good, please stop. There is a part, EAS-1_External_Command_Seat, and you may  confuse people trying to help,  making them assume this part may be present in the tube.

 

1 hour ago, Anonymous49 said:

I have bob kerman grabbing on a battery where as ksp thinks that it is a ladder. so i cannot timewarp. All the "pressurized seats" INSIDE are filled.

 Kerbals cannot grab to random things, are you sure he is not grabbing the ladder in the command pod?

In any case,  Bob Kerman cannot get inside since all the seats are filled. Either someone get out first, or Bob go back to where it came from. There is really no way around it.

 

5 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

rendezvous two capsules in orbit around kerbin

If the kerbal dangling outside came with a different craft than the contract is already complete. Now its a matter to get him back to the craft he came from.

Edited January 18, 2021 by Spricigo

[Anonymous49]

1 minute ago, Spricigo said:

For your own good, please stop. There is a part, EAS-1_External_Command_Seat, and you may  confuse people trying to help,  making them assume this part may be present in the tube.

 

 Kerbals cannot grab to random things, are you sure he is not grabbing the ladder in the command pod?

In any case,  Bob Kerman cannot get inside since all the seats are filled. Either someone get out first, or Bob go back to where it came from. There is really no way around it.

 

If the kerbal dangling outside came with a different craft than the contract is already complete. Now its a matter to get him back to the craft he came from.

The command seat,waiting for it, not enough science.

The command pod is miles away when he was grabbing on a battery.

Yes I know, so I EVA a kerbal to the structural tube so Bob can get in, then the EVA'd crew got back in

[Spricigo]

2 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

Yes I know, so I EVA a kerbal to the structural tube so Bob can get in, then the EVA'd crew got back in

How do you expect him to get back in if Bob took his seat??!

You are in the same situation: one kerbal  without a seat dangling outside.

[Anonymous49]

bob is not an extra kerbal

there is a empty seat in the crew cabins that's all. So Val got into it and eva'd a crew so bob could get inside the pod and transfer himself to the cabin and Val can transfer himself to the pod so the eva'd crew could get inside

[Spricigo]

2 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

bob is not an extra kerbal

then an extra seat is required

[Anonymous49]

did you see those grey rectangles inside the structural tubes? They are actually batteries, just that they are facing the other way. B0b grabbed into 0ne of these and got inside

[paul_c]

At some point you'll have to get them home, via Kerbin's atmosphere so 1-actual-enclosed-proper seat per Kerbal is a good minimum. No grabbing of batteries or sitting inside a tube needed. My Kerbals are either on a surface, on a jetpack EVA or inside a spaceship.

All that rendezvous requires is 2 craft near each other and at a slow closing speed, no need for EVA activity. It can all be done from the map view, its 99.9% knowledge of orbital mechanics. I am sure the tutorials cover it but put simply:

1. Decide which vessel is going to be the target and which one is doing the maneouvring
2. Match the orbits roughly - same planet, vaguely similar Ap/Pe, vaguely similar inclination
3. Personally, I like to match the inclination fairly precisely now
4. Put the maneouvring vehicle into a circular orbit with Ap/Pe the same as (one of the) Ap/Pe of the target, if that doesn't have a circular one.
 

Then its: smaller/lower orbit is 'faster' so it will catch up if its behind. larger/higher orbit is slower. Just do a bunch of orbits to close up the gap. 

When you're close, nearly-but-not quite match the Ap or Pe, ie within say 1km or 500m so its a very similar speed, slow approach. Do a bunch more orbits, take note of approx how much it closes each orbit and on the last orbit....opposite the closest approach, do a bunch of tweaks to get the closest approach distance to a minimum.

ALL that can be done with small burns at the right time/direction. No big burns needed, no 250m/s+ approaches, no EVA stuff, no Kerbals in tubes.

Yes, that's 138mm (millimetres)....the vessels approached very gradually at about 0.2m/s and grazed each other! It was a Kerbal rescue mission, let's just say not much EVA monopropellant was needed!

Edited January 18, 2021 by paul_c

[Anonymous49]

Just now, Spricigo said:

then an extra seat is required

why?

1 minute ago, paul_c said:

At some point you'll have to get them home, via Kerbin's atmosphere so 1-actual-enclosed-proper seat per Kerbin is a good minimum. No grabbing of batteries or sitting inside a tube needed. My Kerbals are either on a surface, on a jetpack EVA or inside a spaceship.

All that rendezvous requires is 2 craft near each other and at a slow closing speed, no need for EVA activity. It can all be done from the map view, its 99.9% knowledge of orbital mechanics. I am sure the tutorials cover it but put simply:

1. Decide which vessel is going to be the target and which one is doing the maneouvring
2. Match the orbits roughly - same planet, vaguely similar Ap/Pe, vaguely similar inclination
3. Personally, I like to match the inclination fairly precisely now
4. Put the maneouvring vehicle into a circular orbit with Ap/Pe the same as (one of the) Ap/Pe of the target, if that doesn't have a circular one.
 

Then its: smaller/lower orbit is 'faster' so it will catch up if its behind. larger/higher orbit is slower. Just do a bunch of orbits to close up the gap. 

When you're close, nearly-but-not quite match the Ap or Pe, ie within say 1km or 500m so its a very similar speed, slow approach. Do a bunch more orbits, take note of approx how much it closes each orbit and on the last orbit....opposite the closest approach, do a bunch of tweaks to get the closest approach distance to a minimum.

ALL that can be done with small burns at the right time/direction. No big burns needed, no 250m/s+ approaches, no EVA stuff, no Kerbals in tubes.

Yes, that's 138mm (millimetres)....the vessels approached very gradually at about 0.2m/s and grazed each other! It was a Kerbal rescue mission, let's just say not much EVA monopropellant was needed!

well yeah how do I swap seats without crew sitting in tubes?

4 minutes ago, paul_c said:

At some point you'll have to get them home, via Kerbin's atmosphere so 1-actual-enclosed-proper seat per Kerbal is a good minimum. No grabbing of batteries or sitting inside a tube needed. My Kerbals are either on a surface, on a jetpack EVA or inside a spaceship.

All that rendezvous requires is 2 craft near each other and at a slow closing speed, no need for EVA activity. It can all be done from the map view, its 99.9% knowledge of orbital mechanics. I am sure the tutorials cover it but put simply:

1. Decide which vessel is going to be the target and which one is doing the maneouvring
2. Match the orbits roughly - same planet, vaguely similar Ap/Pe, vaguely similar inclination
3. Personally, I like to match the inclination fairly precisely now
4. Put the maneouvring vehicle into a circular orbit with Ap/Pe the same as (one of the) Ap/Pe of the target, if that doesn't have a circular one.
 

Then its: smaller/lower orbit is 'faster' so it will catch up if its behind. larger/higher orbit is slower. Just do a bunch of orbits to close up the gap. 

When you're close, nearly-but-not quite match the Ap or Pe, ie within say 1km or 500m so its a very similar speed, slow approach. Do a bunch more orbits, take note of approx how much it closes each orbit and on the last orbit....opposite the closest approach, do a bunch of tweaks to get the closest approach distance to a minimum.

ALL that can be done with small burns at the right time/direction. No big burns needed, no 250m/s+ approaches, no EVA stuff, no Kerbals in tubes.

Yes, that's 138mm (millimetres)....the vessels approached very gradually at about 0.2m/s and grazed each other! It was a Kerbal rescue mission, let's just say not much EVA monopropellant was needed!

how do i kill my velocity

[paul_c]

If you have a 2-seater craft and 2 Kerbals in it, its not possible to swap them over easily. This is deliberate....because the space capsules are cramped! A bit of forethought before launching can have the correct Kerbal sitting in the correct seat for a mission (eg pilot in the capsule, scientist in the science lab, etc). Or, build a spaceship with 3 seats so they can do swapsies.

What led up to them all being in the wrong seat?

[Anonymous49]

uh mines is one of the largest crew-cargo resupply missions, weight is no problem, my resupply craft is meant to lift heavy payloads, launches in air vertically, I need to bring as much crew-cargo in it. And also crew can carry cargo so I needed to fill all the crew's in it.

3 minutes ago, paul_c said:

If you have a 2-seater craft and 2 Kerbals in it, its not possible to swap them over easily. This is deliberate....because the space capsules are cramped! A bit of forethought before launching can have the correct Kerbal sitting in the correct seat for a mission (eg pilot in the capsule, scientist in the science lab, etc). Or, build a spaceship with 3 seats so they can do swapsies.

And also I filled the station during launch, uh because it is a station

and because I needed to do swapsies, I placed empty structural tubes, no, with radial z-100 batteries so crew could stay there.

10 minutes ago, paul_c said:

If you have a 2-seater craft and 2 Kerbals in it, its not possible to swap them over easily. This is deliberate....because the space capsules are cramped! A bit of forethought before launching can have the correct Kerbal sitting in the correct seat for a mission (eg pilot in the capsule, scientist in the science lab, etc). Or, build a spaceship with 3 seats so they can do swapsies.

What led up to them all being in the wrong seat?

the pilot needed to be inside the pod or no SAS and prograde & retrograde markers. I only placed a stayputink there as shown

[paul_c]

16 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

 

 

how do i kill my velocity

The more "similar" an orbit is, the more similar the velocity. For example if one ship is orbiting 80,000m x 80,000m and the other is rendezvousing and its penultimate orbit is 79,900 x 80,000 it will do so very slowly and safely, all nicely under control.

The properties of an orbit and the velocity of a vehicle are linked, by the laws of physics.

For a rendezvous, you don't need to dock, so you don't need to worry about the other aspects, just do it all with orbital mechanics.

But to directly answer the question.....you'd turn the ship around and burn the main engine (or use reverse on RCS thrusters if you have them).

16 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

uh mines is one of the largest crew-cargo resupply missions, weight is no problem, my resupply craft is meant to lift heavy payloads, launches in air vertically, I need to bring as much crew-cargo in it. And also crew can carry cargo so I needed to fill all the crew's in it.

And also I filled the station during launch, uh because it is a station

I'm confused.....the contract is for a rendezvous?

[Spricigo]

15 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

why?

 

2 hours ago, Anonymous49 said:

All the "pressurized seats" INSIDE are filled.

 

7 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

I filled the station during launch

What else can I say?  It seems you are fully aware that your station cannot hold any extra kerbal.

 

 

[paul_c]

[Anonymous49]

20 minutes ago, paul_c said:

The more "similar" an orbit is, the more similar the velocity. For example if one ship is orbiting 80,000m x 80,000m and the other is rendezvousing and its penultimate orbit is 79,900 x 80,000 it will do so very slowly and safely, all nicely under control.

The properties of an orbit and the velocity of a vehicle are linked, by the laws of physics.

For a rendezvous, you don't need to dock, so you don't need to worry about the other aspects, just do it all with orbital mechanics.

But to directly answer the question.....you'd turn the ship around and burn the main engine (or use reverse on RCS thrusters if you have them).

I'm confused.....the contract is for a rendezvous?

yup

18 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

 

 

What else can I say?  It seems you are fully aware that your station cannot hold any extra kerbal.

 

 

im doing a swao

[Spricigo]

1 hour ago, Anonymous49 said:

im doing a swao

yes, I got it.  The craft that brought the new  kerbals there have an empty crew space?  Otherwise you just have 2 craft with the same limitation.

[Anonymous49]

33 minutes ago, Spricigo said:

yes, I got it.  The craft that brought the new  kerbals there have an empty crew space?  Otherwise you just have 2 craft with the same limitation.

both are filled with crew, but since i have TWO structural tubes I found a way to keep on swapping

[Anonymous49]

guys i "cheated" science by completing super easy contracts. Now I have 100 science, which part should I go next

[Spricigo]

 

32 minutes ago, Anonymous49 said:

guys i "cheated" science by completing super easy contracts. Now I have 100 science, which part should I go next

your game, your decision. But I think all that trouble with rendezvous made a strong case for getting Advanced Flight Control (RCS systems) as fast as possible.

Propulsion System is good for satellites and micro-landers for Mun and Minmus.

Heavy Rocketry (engines) and Fuel System (tanks) will be useful when you want to build something bigger. You probably don't need to rush it.

Aerodynamics for planes, same deal.

Landing is probably the least needed of the 90 nodes with Space exploration being close.

Again:  just my opinion. You may have different priorities.

[paul_c]

Personally I went for "Space Exploration" (90 science) then "Advanced Exploration" (160 science and needs ~$900k R&D upgrade too), the reason being it allows the Science Lab which is the gateway to a ton more science. Just having a little trouble launching it....but that's part of the fun, right?

[Spricigo]

13 hours ago, paul_c said:

Personally I went for "Space Exploration" (90 science) then "Advanced Exploration" (160 science and needs ~$900k R&D upgrade too), the reason being it allows the Science Lab which is the gateway to a ton more science. Just having a little trouble launching it....but that's part of the fun, right?

Well, you only have trouble until you find a reliable way to do.  And science gathering parts will quickly pay for the investment if you can afford the uncial cost.

Personally, I don't mind to wait  a bit more for the lab, but tend to rush the science experiments for that reason.

 

[Anonymous49]

also any mod to calculate the payload weight possible?

to a certain orbit