[0.25]KSP Interstellar (Magnetic Nozzles, ISRU Revamp) Version 0.13

[Fractal_UK]

With the advent of the large microwave receivers, I've decided to make life a little bit more complicated. I don't like that at the moment, with a single microwave receiver, you can receive power from sources both in front of and behind the receiver. It makes sense that you would actually have to point the dish, at least partially, at the transmitter. So, that's what I've added.

The power will dimish proportional cos(theta) from being directly pointed at the transmitter. To demonstrate how this works, I'm going to use my low kerbol orbit solar power transmitter because a low kerbol orbit satellite will always be basically in the direction of the sun and that makes it very obvious what its position in the sky will be. So here we go:

Look at the position of the sun and how it affects the amount of power we receive.

[Ashtoruin]

Then you will need antimatter. Using nuclear reactors, especially unupgraded ones is counterproductive. You will need both high Isp and thrust to capture into orbit with burns costing 5000 m/s dV, and lasting longer than some encounters. My Prometheus craft that is orbiting Moho now? I had to warp three times ahead of the planet so i could bleed some velocity each time when i got encounter lasting barely couple of minutes. It was very messy mission, and i wouldn't be able to finish it without an engine with 1000 thrust and Isp 2000+. Warp saves a lot of time, yes. But in no way it's cheating - dV cost can easily be higher than during conventional flight. And proper navigation is even harder, since you basically have to eyeball everything.

How would you reccommend doing this to start then? a few nuclear plants in kerbal orbit hooked up to science labs making antimatter?

[Fractal_UK]

How would you reccommend doing this to start then? a few nuclear plants in kerbal orbit hooked up to science labs making antimatter?

If I were you I'd keep antimatter factories at ground level on Kerbin because that potentially lets you generate antimatter useful for performing launches from KSC. In Kerbin orbit, you can use space station arms full of antimatter collectors and dispense with the ludicrous power requirements.

[Xentoe]

You can too use the LazTec Resource Transfer Laser.

Makes life mutch easier (yes yes it is not very relaistic but....)

[Ashtoruin]

If I were you I'd keep antimatter factories at ground level on Kerbin because that potentially lets you generate antimatter useful for performing launches from KSC. In Kerbin orbit, you can use space station arms full of antimatter collectors and dispense with the ludicrous power requirements.

Yeah, but then I would have to find a way to transfer the fuel to a ship on Kerbin... Which I've never actually had to deal with before, It almost seems easier to perform refueling maneuvers in space. But I shall overcome it.. after this physics class.

Edited October 2, 2013 by Ashtoruin

[Donziboy2]

KAS works pretty well for fuel transfer, but I noticed they just came out with a new version and its pretty buggy.

I usually send up a basic probe lander with an AM tank and dock it in space, fill it with AM and then land it near KSC. Drive my fuel truck out and pick up the AM, then fuel rockets when I need to.

[Donziboy2]

With the advent of the large microwave receivers, I've decided to make life a little bit more complicated. I don't like that at the moment, with a single microwave receiver, you can receive power from sources both in front of and behind the receiver. It makes sense that you would actually have to point the dish, at least partially, at the transmitter. So, that's what I've added.

The power will dimish proportional cos(theta) from being directly pointed at the transmitter. To demonstrate how this works, I'm going to use my low kerbol orbit solar power transmitter because a low kerbol orbit satellite will always be basically in the direction of the sun and that makes it very obvious what its position in the sky will be. So here we go:

Look at the position of the sun and how it affects the amount of power we receive.

OK, I can see that working, its true its a direct beam so if your not hitting the receiver dead on your going to loose some energy.

[Makeone]

I am interested of how the ElectricCharge production is calculated, ie. what generates it, generator? I noticed this, when i tried to operate a ion powered tug that had 8 10kN engines (from the triangular pack, orange flat tanks etc.) and one 2.5m reactor with proper generator and it couldn't keep up with power needs that seemed odd. I tested it with 4 1.25m reactors and they were able keep the ElectricCharge up, if i recall it correctly. I sometimes wonder how the fuel usage is been calculated, are they given per second at 100% thrust or? In the engine descriptions that is.

Keep up the nice work mister Fractal_UK...

[Fractal_UK]

I am interested of how the ElectricCharge production is calculated, ie. what generates it, generator? I noticed this, when i tried to operate a ion powered tug that had 8 10kN engines (from the triangular pack, orange flat tanks etc.) and one 2.5m reactor with proper generator and it couldn't keep up with power needs that seemed odd. I tested it with 4 1.25m reactors and they were able keep the ElectricCharge up, if i recall it correctly. I sometimes wonder how the fuel usage is been calculated, are they given per second at 100% thrust or? In the engine descriptions that is.

Keep up the nice work mister Fractal_UK...

In 0.5.1, each generator would generate 1000 units of stock ElectricCharge (I assume these have units of 1KW for the purposes of the mod) and anything leftover would be converted into the Megajoules resources. In the next version that system has changed and the generators will attempt to fill your Electric Charge bar immediately, once that is full, they will turn anything leftover into Megajoules.

[Ratzap]

I sometimes wonder how the fuel usage is been calculated, are they given per second at 100% thrust or? In the engine descriptions that is.

Do you mean the actual usage of the engine itself? Ions (and hybrids) catch people out frequently as the electric charge usage on the engine is purely the proportional amount. The real amount used per second is calculated based on ISP, throttle position and the density of fuels. The plugin I wrote to calculate charge enlightened me on this issue while I was getting it to work correctly on ions. From the source:

foreach (ModuleEngines.Propellant prop in tmpEng.propellants )
	{
	if (prop.name == "ElectricCharge") {
		usesCharge = true;
		ecratio = prop.ratio;
	}
	sumRD += prop.ratio * PartResourceLibrary.Instance.GetDefinition(prop.id).density;
	}
if (usesCharge)
{
	float massFlowRate;
	if (tmpEng.isOperational && tmpEng.currentThrottle > 0)
	{
		massFlowRate = (tmpEng.currentThrottle * tmpEng.maxThrust) / (tmpEng.atmosphereCurve.Evaluate(0) * 9.81f);
		am_use += (ecratio * massFlowRate) / sumRD;
	}
}

The easy answer is get Fusebox, put the Ions on in the VAB and it will tell you how much charge per second they want at full throttle. If you're feeling adventurous, plus the values into that equation.

[Ashtoruin]

I usually send up a basic probe lander with an AM tank and dock it in space, fill it with AM and then land it near KSC. Drive my fuel truck out and pick up the AM, then fuel rockets when I need to.

WHY?????????????????????????

It seems like it would be easier to use a launcher to launch the Rocket you need antimatter for into space and fuel it there. But 6 to one, Half a dozen to the other I guess.

Also @Fractal How often do you usually update this mod? or can we get an ETA on the new Receiver dishes?

[Fractal_UK]

Also @Fractal How often do you usually update this mod? or can we get an ETA on the new Receiver dishes?

I can't really give a timescale, most of the development work for the update is done, I just need to dot a few products cross a few vectors, etc. It all depends upon how smoothly this goes.

[Ashtoruin]

I can't really give a timescale, most of the development work for the update is done, I just need to dot a few products cross a few vectors, etc. It all depends upon how smoothly this goes.

Opossum, keep up the good work.

Also, is the fact that the 2.5m Nuclear Reactors never seem to use fuel a known bug?

EDIT: and I just realized that my Thermal Rockets have to be attached to a Reactor Directly... Fack.

[Fractal_UK]

Opossum, keep up the good work.

Also, is the fact that the 2.5m Nuclear Reactors never seem to use fuel a known bug?

They do use fuel, it's just totally invisible in normal useage because the consumption rate is so low. The 2.5m reactor will last for 1924.5 days (5.27 years) at full power or 17.56 years at its minimum 30% power level. If you go on a long mission with a nuclear powered ship, you'll probably see a fuel change after the interplanetary portion of the journey, after you've been max time accelerating.

[Ashtoruin]

They do use fuel, it's just totally invisible in normal useage because the consumption rate is so low. The 2.5m reactor will last for 1924.5 days (5.27 years) at full power or 17.56 years at its minimum 30% power level. If you go on a long mission with a nuclear powered ship, you'll probably see a fuel change after the interplanetary portion of the journey, after you've been max time accelerating.

Ah, yeah my flights tended to have an explosive end after a day or two...

Edit: I feel kind of bad for the endless slew of questions, but what do most people use for their Thermal Rockets, Liquid Fuel/Liquid Fuel Oxygen/Kethane? The Rocket's only use more or less is going to be stopping it when it comes out of Warp, so I'm thinking LFO as it has higher thrust, but is the extra thrust really worth the Specific Impulse loss to you guys?

Edited October 2, 2013 by Ashtoruin

[DaveStrider]

Ah, yeah my flights tended to have an explosive end after a day or two...

Edit: I feel kind of bad for the endless slew of questions, but what do most people use for their Thermal Rockets, Liquid Fuel/Liquid Fuel Oxygen/Kethane? The Rocket's only use more or less is going to be stopping it when it comes out of Warp, so I'm thinking LFO as it has higher thrust, but is the extra thrust really worth the Specific Impulse loss to you guys?

I use liquid fuel only, lower thrust is fine even when doing post-warp braking (the only time it's a problem is when you're in the SOI for less time than the burn needs, in which case you warp retrograde and keep burning). For conventional use there's absolutely no point using LFO since nobody could ever need that much thrust.

[Donziboy2]

WHY?????????????????????????

It seems like it would be easier to use a launcher to launch the Rocket you need antimatter for into space and fuel it there. But 6 to one, Half a dozen to the other I guess.

Also @Fractal How often do you usually update this mod? or can we get an ETA on the new Receiver dishes?

Because most AM rockets if your using the thermal rocket have godly amounts of thrust and can launch very large ships into orbit easily on a small amount of AM.

Like this one I built and used several times, if I dont limit the speed it actually made Flame effects going up. Its 310T and almost 2TWR, uses LFO, the Liquid fuel only version was a little smaller, and heavier on parts since the tanks are smaller.

[Ashtoruin]

Because most AM rockets if your using the thermal rocket have godly amounts of thrust and can launch very large ships into orbit easily on a small amount of AM.

Like this one I built and used several times, if I dont limit the speed it actually made Flame effects going up. Its 310T and almost 2TWR, uses LFO, the Liquid fuel only version was a little smaller, and heavier on parts since the tanks are smaller.

Yeah... I just realized this after hacking in a full AM tank for testing purposes, Mother of...

[BlazingAngel665]

Just letting you know fractal: I fell in love with your mod over the past two weeks. I didn't really notice it but all of a sudden there were massive (8 kerbals is massive for me) research bases on places like Eeloo and Pol (aka places I never go) to see if I could get more research there. It is some great prep work for .22 Thank you!

[agentexeider]

@Fractal_UK

I was wondering would you consider adding a jumpdrive to your mod, much like the HyperJump System mod a few versions back worked, except not sucking like it did. I have been really wanting to see a return of this mod, and since you seem to be the current FTL guru, I forward my request to you.

-Æ

[theSpeare]

I just need to dot a few products cross a few vectors, etc.

It's sad I got that.

[Ashtoruin]

It's sad I got that.

No its not and anyone know what the 30% power life of a 1.25m Nuclear reactor is?

Edited October 3, 2013 by Ashtoruin

[zzz]

Sort of jet

http://www./download/dmtaeagjannotlf/ThermalTurbojet.7z

By the way, how someone can use it? I tried to build something during testing, no need of fuel is nice, but it's produce so tiny thrust so can't lift anything, at least with basic parts. Maybe only to propel rovers

[Fractal_UK]

I was wondering would you consider adding a jumpdrive to your mod, much like the HyperJump System mod a few versions back worked, except not sucking like it did. I have been really wanting to see a return of this mod, and since you seem to be the current FTL guru, I forward my request to you.

It's an option for the future but I'm currently focusing on things other than more FTL systems, we don't really have many places to go with FTL craft just yet, so I don't think the need for a variety of methods is all that strong. I may come back to something like this in the future though.

Sort of jet

By the way, how someone can use it? I tried to build something during testing, no need of fuel is nice, but it's produce so tiny thrust so can't lift anything, at least with basic parts. Maybe only to propel rovers

Looks good as ever, zzz.

Use it with an antimatter reactor and you will instead ask, "This this has so much, what can't it lift?"

I'd like for it to be flyable with the nuclear reactors as well because nuclear powered aircraft have been tested in reality but the balance is really hard to get right.

[zzz]

Antimatter will make it much better, I expect it, but it hard to get, I tried with small(as most suitable for planes) nuclear reactor and it's produce only 2kN with it, so you can't just build and fly(I was need to use hack gravity for test ). Maybe there some trick?

Edited October 3, 2013 by zzz