How will modded parts fit into the campaign and tech tree?

[CyclonicTuna]

After I saw the interview at PAX I was really excited for the new .22 update, but I'm also wondering, just as a big fan of the mod community, how this would fit in with excisting and future mod packs.

Will there be some way for modders to assign when you unlock their parts. Is there gonna be a separate tech tree for modded parts? How is this gonna work out. Because it would seem to me that it would be kinda unfair if you have superpowerfull modded parts at the very beginning of your space career. The fun and replay value is the keep improving your spaceprogram by unlocking parts as a result of the missions you complete and the science you operate.

Is there gonna be some sort of measure by which modded parts are rated to define where they are placed in the tech tree? For instance if you have a very powerfull effecient KW Rocketry engine, the game measures what grade it gets based on cost, power, specific impulse etc, to assign it a place in the tech tree. And based on that grade it gets a place early or late in the tech tree.

I would like to know...

[khalidibn]

I'm not sure, I would appreciate if a dev could clarify how career mode would interact with mods. I'd expect that career mode would have an option to disable mods because they could be terribly unbalanced.

[shand]

I would imagine each tech would have a name/code and each part .cfg would have a prerequisite line. so the mod maker could say you need x researched to use that part. equally i imagine there would be scope for modders to add tech nodes allowing a mod branch of the tech tree.

the question would really be - if a part didnt have the prerequisite line, would it be allowed or disallowed. IE: if a modder didnt take tech into account, could you use it? personally i'd say no.

[rkman]

Will there be some way for modders to assign when you unlock their parts.

Yes. (i don't have a source right now but Harvester has said something to that effect)

Because it would seem to me that it would be kinda unfair if you have superpowerfull modded parts at the very beginning of your space career.

There's probably no way to prevent a modder from creating a mod that adds a powerful part early in the techtree.

But to who would it be unfair? Would it be unfair to players who are playing their own game completely independent of other players - as is the case for all KSP players, because this is a solo game?

Either way, depending on what a mod changes/adds, integrating a mod into the techtree can amount to having changed KSP to the point where it is to different from stock to be comparable - it would in effect be a (minor) overhaul of KSP. A career in one could not be compared to a career in the other. You'd be playing a different game that's based on KSP.

[CyclonicTuna]

But to who would it be unfair? Would it be unfair to players who are playing their own game completely independent of other players - as is the case for all KSP players, because this is a solo game?

Well maybe unfair isn't the right word. What i meant was that it would seem to kinda defeat the purpose of the game in my opninion. The fun, for me at least, would lay in the fact that you expand your space program from very small beginnings and discover new things. If you want that big cash you get for that manned mission to a moon of Jool, than its a lot more rewarding if you have to do this in steps and have to improve your technology and expand your knowledge first before you can undertake such an endeavour. If the first thing you do immediatly gets you loads of money and no more big goals to accomplish the game could get really boring really quick.

[Van Disaster]

f the first thing you do immediatly gets you loads of money and no more big goals to accomplish the game could get really boring really quick.

Because it's so utterly tedious as it is right now?

I would suggest as some sort of guidelines that mod parts a) don't work in career mode unless they have tech tree entries, and there's some sort of organised review area for discussion about how mods fit in the tree. Even if it's just in here and threads are tagged for review. In the end it's nobody's business except the mod author how it fits, and end users are quite able to change how parts fit in if they don't agree, but it's nice just to be able to install things as they are.

I have the problem that I've removed half Squad's parts, which would probably bash large holes in any part development prerequesites... and we don't know enough about how the tree works yet, some part sets may not actually fit in the structure that well.

[Beeman]

Harvester mentioned how it works in a thread in general recently. I forget which specifically, but I think he said it's simply a little flag in the part's CFG that lets the game know which tech node it belongs to. Or something like that.

So either the modder or the user would have to customize the mod parts individually to fit into a certain tech level and obviously some mods will give you powerful things too early or others might give you mediocre things too late, but eventually things will probably balance out.

Either way, there'll still be sandbox mode. Things like money and R&D shouldn't apply to sandbox 'cause...well, that's the point of sandbox mode while restrictions and progression are why people want career mode.

[Eric S]

the question would really be - if a part didnt have the prerequisite line, would it be allowed or disallowed. IE: if a modder didnt take tech into account, could you use it? personally i'd say no.

It would be disallowed and never become available. The devs have already stated this. Which, if nothing else, will encourage modders to update their stuff when 0.22 comes out.

My semi-related question is will modders be able to add to the research tree? I can see where someone doing something like a SABER engine wouldn't want to hang it off an existing node of the research tree. I belive that they'll be able to do this, but I haven't seen a definite statement.

[DaRocketCat]

Harvester answered this himself:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/44915-About-the-Tech-tree?p=589661#post589661

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/44915-About-the-Tech-tree?p=589954#post589954

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/44915-About-the-Tech-tree?p=591345#post591345

You should go to HarvesteR's profile and look at his posts, lots of interesting info there.

EDIT:

And another mechjeb-career related one:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/44915-About-the-Tech-tree?p=591987#post591987

Edited September 4, 2013 by DaRocketCat