Who won the Space Race? Community poll

[Jokurr]

In the terms of rocket technology. Example: The engines designed for the Soviet N-1 Moon Rocket. The Soviet Union was on top. But when it comes to getting the first man outside of the earths sphere of influence and entering the moons. The Americans came up on top.

Considering the N1 never had a successful launch that hardly puts the Russians on top. It's one thing to design some grand rocket, it's another to actually put it into space.

[Dispatcher]

Like a probe that has done fly-bys of nearly all of Saturn's moons, including approximately 70 fly-bys of Titan and a surface probe that landed there? Or a probe that has passed the heliopause and is transiting through interstellar space? Or a probe that circled Vesta and is headed toward Ceres? Or another probe that will reach Pluto in a couple years? A spacecraft that orbited and landed on Eros? Another that orbited Jupiter for 8 years? Etc etc etc

Much planetary science has been done using robotic probes that could never ever have been directly by human observers. These missions are relatively cheap and far less risky than crewed expeditions. We know much more about the solar system having focused on this type of mission than we would have had we tried to "conquer" space in person.

I'm well aware of these programs. In my opinion, we (the world) would have an extended human presence (you may call it "conquest" [hmmm, The Conquest of Space, good movie]) if you like. It is also my opinion that we (humanity) would have an even more extensive set of probe missions. Some of our current and ongoing probe missions would, in my opinion, have already been completed and followed up on.

[Piwa]

Lol http://images.vfl.ru/ii/1380644805/054a53ca/3211191_m.jpg' alt='3211191_m.jpg'>

Quote: Image 1 - During the first flights into space Americans invented the pen, ink, which does not lead to a state of weightlessness (development cost of $ 1,000,000). Image 2 - Russian solve the problem in a different way.

[Piwa]

Won the friendship !

[Mr Shifty]

Quote: Image 1 - During the first flights into space Americans invented the pen, ink, which does not lead to a state of weightlessness (development cost of $ 1,000,000). Image 2 - Russian solve the problem in a different way.

False:

http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp

[hugix]

Lol http://images.vfl.ru/ii/1380644805/054a53ca/3211191_m.jpg' alt='3211191_m.jpg'>

Quote: Image 1 - During the first flights into space Americans invented the pen, ink, which does not lead to a state of weightlessness (development cost of $ 1,000,000). Image 2 - Russian solve the problem in a different way.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Writing_in_space

And to be fair, Graphite in a zero G environment surrounded by electrical devices doesn't sound like a good plan.

[Shuttle]

Considering the N1 never had a successful launch that hardly puts the Russians on top. It's one thing to design some grand rocket, it's another to actually put it into space.

3 of 4 N1 launches failed because of the unreliable turbopump assembly. Launching a rocket with unstable engines was like playing Russian roulette, one of OKB-1's lead engineers even wrote they should've stopped the whole program until the engines were finalized. Unfortunately, only Korolev could do that with his authority. Also, the whole program cost 2.5 billion $ by 1970 while Apollo budget was MUCH more. And, of course, don't forget about closed cycle engines that are so good americans use them on their rockets nowadays.

So, I personally think soviets made two achievements: they've almost finalised 100t rocket with 10 times smaller budget compared to USA (2.5 vs 25 billion) and they've also managed to create extremely efficient closed cycle kerosene-oxygen engines that, as far as I know, have no alternatives in the world

[M.Wolfy]

Considering the N1 never had a successful launch that hardly puts the Russians on top. It's one thing to design some grand rocket, it's another to actually put it into space.

Considering the U.S only did 1 Venus landing, that hardly puts the U.S on top. It's one thing to land on the moon, It's another to Land on another planet.

Seriously, I think people have to look at the bigger picture, Instead of generalizing "Land on the moon, win space race". And the Soviets achieved a lot more than the U.S did, seriously, they did.

[Wahgineer]

which is more impressive, landing a man on the moon or landing a probe that survived the scorching tempratures of venus ?

Oh wait, do you mean the probe that lasted three hours before its circuits were melted into puddles of slag?

[Wahgineer]

Considering the U.S only did 1 Venus landing, that hardly puts the U.S on top. It's one thing to land on the moon, It's another to Land on another planet.

Seriously, I think people have to look at the bigger picture, Instead of generalizing "Land on the moon, win space race". And the Soviets achieved a lot more than the U.S did, seriously, they did.

1: U.S. Didn't land on Venus (correct me if I'm wrong), they mapped it

2: Ever heard of Viking 1&2, Spirit, Opportunity, and Curiosity?

3: Most of the Soviet Mars Probes crashed

4: Soviet Union doesn't exist anymore

5: Soviet Buran was a ripoff of the U.S. shuttle, and it never flew an actual mission

6: After the U.S. landed on the Moon, Soviets more or less gave up on manned flight beyond LKO

I know the U.S. kind of did, but that was after they went to the Moon SIX times.

[Mr Shifty]

Oh wait, do you mean the probe that lasted three hours before its circuits were melted into puddles of slag?

The Soviets landed Venera 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, and 14 on Venus. And Vega 2. They were only designed to last for 30 minutes or so; most lasted for an hour or two. The only pictures from the surface of Venus were taken by Soviet landers. I'm not sure what you're trying to say anyway; you try designing an instrumentation package that can survive re-entry through sulfuric acid clouds and landing on a planet which has a surface temp of 450 degrees F and surface pressure of 1300 psi, and still return useful data, including camera images.

[Wahgineer]

Yeah, but in the end, which mission is more difficult to complete? Sending an expendable machine on a one way trip to destruction? Or having to get three men, who need food, water, life support, and living space to the nearest natural satellite and back alive?

Also if the Soviet probe landings where SO great, then why is the forum full of KSP players trying to do an Apollo-style mission to the mun, or trying to build a space shuttle, or landing a rover Curiosity style?

And to boot, why is it considered a major accomplishment to perform a MANNED landing and RETURN from Eve, KSPs' analog to Venus, than it is to land a probe there?

If your space program is more remembered than anyone else, I'd say you one the space race.

[Navyguy]

Obvisously the United States. All you people saying the Russins/Soviets won is wrong. They only won in the begining. A few examples of the things after the US won the space race compared to the Soviets/Russins are,

1. We sent a probe out of the solar system.

2. We landed 4 confirmed rovers on Mars.

3. We got more than 75% of the ISS into orbit.

4. We have alot of space telescopes.

5. We sent up alot of the GPS satelites.

6. ETC.

Sincerely,

Your friendly neighborhood Civil Air Patrol Cadet of NH-016

[Piwa]

Obvisously the United States. All you people saying the Russins/Soviets won is wrong. They only won in the begining. A few examples of the things after the US won the space race compared to the Soviets/Russins are,

1. We sent a probe out of the solar system.

2. We landed 4 confirmed rovers on Mars.

3. We got more than 75% of the ISS into orbit.

4. We have alot of space telescopes.

5. We sent up alot of the GPS satelites.

6. ETC.

Sincerely,

Your friendly neighborhood Civil Air Patrol Cadet of NH-016

Honor the history of the Soviet space, but by the way we talk about the space race, but not to this day: the space race of the USSR - USA 1-0, Lunar race of the USSR - USA 1:1

P.S. People will still be landing on other celestial bodies, but the first voice heard by the universe, Russian.

[czokletmuss]

Obvisously the United States.

Ah yes, the "America stronk!" thing. We've dismissed this claim.

http://youtu.be/50Oq45L-Xg8

[M.Wolfy]

Obvisously the United States. All you people saying the Russins/Soviets won is wrong. They only won in the begining. A few examples of the things after the US won the space race compared to the Soviets/Russins are,

1. We sent a probe out of the solar system.

2. We landed 4 confirmed rovers on Mars.

3. We got more than 75% of the ISS into orbit.

4. We have alot of space telescopes.

5. We sent up alot of the GPS satelites.

6. ETC.

Sincerely,

Your friendly neighborhood Civil Air Patrol Cadet of NH-016

Ah, The rover that wasn't a part of the space race? the one called curiosity...

Seriously, We are getting off track and talking about the current rather than the space race...

Also

1: U.S. Didn't land on Venus (correct me if I'm wrong), they mapped it

2: Ever heard of Viking 1&2, Spirit, Opportunity, and Curiosity?

3: Most of the Soviet Mars Probes crashed

4: Soviet Union doesn't exist anymore

5: Soviet Buran was a ripoff of the U.S. shuttle, and it never flew an actual mission

6: After the U.S. landed on the Moon, Soviets more or less gave up on manned flight beyond LKO

I know the U.S. kind of did, but that was after they went to the Moon SIX times.

The U.S did actually did land on Venus, The surviving day probe from the Pioneer Venus Multiprobe, Landed at 31.3°S 317.0°E

And for the record, The U.S did more things on mars than the soviets But seriously, Lets stop bringing up the Curiosity and current events...

AND this isn't about whether they exist anymore, Its about the space race...

Uh, It probably would of if the hanger didn't collapse on top of it and the Energia

Oh wait, do you mean the probe that lasted three hours before its circuits were melted into puddles of slag?

That should be expected when the avarage temperature is 460 Degrees Celsius

Edited October 3, 2013 by M.Wolfy

[metalmouth7]

I personally think the Soviet Union won the Space Race. While the USA did land a man on the moon, they did it using a system (Apollo,) that they quickly abandoned in favor of the Shuttle program. The Soviet Union's moon program, although it was an underfunded disaster, was at least a system that they kept developing (Soyuz.) As well, although the ISS is primarily built by the USA, it is based mostly on design concepts and lessons learned from the the Soviet Union's Salyut, Almaz, and Mir stations.

Although I'm personally not a fan of the Space Shuttle program (I believe it, along with our space station programs have trapped us in LEO,) I do think it speaks volumes that the Soviet Union's Buran flew a completely automated flight, and then landed itself within 3 metres of it's target, having been developed only a few years after the USA's STS program.

[ziogatto]

Who said the race is over? If america being a fox thinks they've already won and take a nap the turtles behind will catch up before you realize it!

[M.Wolfy]

Who said the race is over? If america being a fox thinks they've already won and take a nap the turtles behind will catch up before you realize it!

The turtles being China

[Wahgineer]

The turtles being China

Who are ripping off the U.S. because they can't seem to come up with anything on their own (I saw a picture of the manned Chinese shuttle. It looked like the American shuttle minus the vertical stabilizer/tail fin).

[Wahgineer]

Uh, It probably would of if the hanger didn't collapse on top of it and the Energia

So? It still didn't perform a mission. And, just like the Chinese, it was a ripoff of the American shuttle, meant strictly for military purposes.

[briansun1]

everyone will copy everyone else if the idea is good

[Wahgineer]

Then explain why the Saturn V and the N-1 look so different.

Also, copying isn't an excuse for laziness, nor does it prove your country is technologically superior.

It just proves that you are unoriginal and lazy.

Also, there IS a difference between implementation and imitation. ex: using the space shuttles cargo bay in your design rather than just removing the tail fin and changing the flag on it to make it look like your own idea.

[metalmouth7]

So? It still didn't perform a mission. And, just like the Chinese, it was a ripoff of the American shuttle, meant strictly for military purposes.

Actually, the Buran did fly a mission, in 1988. It wasn't a ripoff. The Buran, although similar looking, and having an incredibly similar air frame (due to that design being essentially the most effective, and was based upon some aspects of the American design,) had quite a few major functional differences. The Buran did not carry it's main engines into orbit, and was designed from conception to be capable of unmanned flight. As well, the Buran was capable of travelling to the Moon, had a better lift to drag ratio (indicating the air frame was not identical to the Space Shuttle's,) carried a crew of 10 (as opposed to 7,) and carried a larger payload than the earlier Space Shuttles.

[briansun1]

the USSR won the USA doesn't even have a real space program anymore