Discoveries/Breakthroughs (Possible Update or Suggestion for upcoming Tech Tree)

[The Darkness]

I'm already a huge fan of the up and coming R&D Update. I can wait to get my hands on all the data and experiments. With this being said, my mouth is watering at the chance to really start playing this game as it was designed.

"With goals and strategy in mind".

And all this anticipation has got me thinking. How is the Tech Tree, or R@D Tree going to look and function. I know in the recent video released previewing many of the R@D updates. It showed a sporadic, root-like "Tree". Which I feel is appropriate at this time. I have no doubt that the Dev's will refine its architecture down the road.

Again though, this all has got me thinking.

"Are all the tree unlocks going to be unlocked 1 after another? And all using science?"

If that's the case then may I suggest this to help add a little spice to the R@D Tree.

Discoveries/Breakthroughs

One of my favorites things about science is when we are hard at work looking for the results we expect or hypothesize. We sometimes witness something we could have not otherwise foreseen. Most scientist call these Discoveries or Breakthroughs.

Now on to my rather DULL graphic I have made to help explain how this all may work.

Now the goal of this graphic is to help you envision KSP's proposed Tech/ R@D Tree with my addition of Discoveries/Breakthroughs.

Progress through the tree takes us from the Top Left Hand Corner. Then to the Top Center. To the Middle, Then finally to the Bottom Middle. Now disregarding the Red Line and the box isolated to the Middle Right. You could put any number of KSP Parts in those blue boxes and sum up how or what order you would unlock them.

This logic usually encourages "Grinding". I'm sure most of you have played MMO's. And any MMO fan knows that if you want the best gear or items. You are usually going to have to Grind out long hours doing the same thing over and over again. In KSP this could mean Multiple Moon landings for instance. Which I have no complaint about. I find grinding to be fun 85% of the time and a learning experience to refine techniques.

But what about when the Player has Grinded to his wits ends, what tasks/parts has he left to achieve/unlock.

Well what if in the Tech Tree there was Items that needed special prerequisites to unlock them. Looking back at the graphic we notice that the flow from box to box is very consistent. With the except of the Middle flowing to the Middle Right. We notice that there is a boundary, or red line that separates the flow. This red line represents a "Required Task, Event, or Prerequisite"

Now the question is, what could this task be?

This is where the beauty of this idea blossoms. The task could be anything relating to the data the game is already capturing. Hard Data like ship weight, components, periapsis, apoapsis. Or the Variable Data like position, sensors, thrust, celestial bodies, and distance.

One task that comes to mind is this:

"Complete 3 Orbits of a celestial body, without solar panels."

Task Name: "Battery Powered"

Discovery/ Breakthrough:"High Capacity Battery"

Thus the red line is drawed, and the player has a specific goal, independent of his normal operations.

This also forces players to think critically of there missions and goals.

Thanks for reading, and your comments are welcome. I hope people understand that I'm not trying to re-invent the wheel here. Rather just making a suggestion that has been seen in many other popular games.

I also wanted to make this post as short as possible. So that I did not confuse or upset anyone.

[allmappedout]

I quite like the idea.

I guess my question is thus; can you see the goals required to obtain said item? As you say, breakthroughs happen when they're unexpected, so my first thought was that these parts don't appear on the tech tree until the task associated with them has been completed.

Obviously it makes it then harder to find these new parts (as a result I'd probably leave some of the parts as nice-to-have only rather than anything critical to proceeding down the tech tree), but the sense of discovery would be better, and, if they're on the tree already, then it's basically still a grind; taking Hitman Absolution for an example - it tells you all the cool ways you can kill people in the mission statements....which kind of takes away from the fun of figuring them out for yourself.

[KvickFlygarn87]

Great idea, to stop the very grinding-y part of science! Also good because it adds something to give you ideas, like if you don't know what to do, just complete tasks!

[The Darkness]

I guess my question is thus; can you see the goals required to obtain said item?

I would say yes. You could see the goals. But maybe not until you come to that part of the tree. That way, if there was an OP part that was many research levels higher than where you are, you just could not skip up the tree to unlock it.

Also the Part for the Breakthrough could have one of those "Mystery Box" ??? Icons. As to not give away what you may be working for.

(as a result I'd probably leave some of the parts as nice-to-have only rather than anything critical to proceeding down the tech tree)

I agree. An example would be maybe Discovering an Engine with more Gimble at the cost of lossing some of its Thrust. Or alternate variations that offer distinct advantages and disadvantages over their counterparts. In any event these parts would have to keep the balance of the game and not limit a player to becoming stuck. But not simple enough for them to farm them all out.

Thanks for the feedback.

[KrazyKrl]

I'd much rather see the actual tech tree become breakthrough-centric. Having custom parts from breakthroughs only ends up obsoleting other parts. Every piece needs to be useful in some place or another, and limiting them seems poor design.

Now, if the game was split up into breakthroughs; you could still iterate through the next available tier of upgrades. But to progress any further, you need to apply what you've unlocked towards the next breakthrough in technology.

I.e. Tier 0 is starting, you unlock several basic parts. Plus several others via SCIENCE! points. Tier 0 culminates in the ultimate upgrade for its tier, decouplers. You use this new knowledge of multi-stage rocketry to attain the next tier. Tier 1 requires you to reach a minimum orbit of 80kmx80km of Kerbin, this breakpoint enables some more stuff also. Tier 2 could be a flyby or landing on another body. Tier 3 could be Interplanetary flyby. Tier 4 could be Interplanetary landings. Tier 5 could be fully interplanetary space travel.

I'd MUCH rather see a system of large achievements to enhance your space program. The point being, you can have tiny goals for, say, getting that landing gear unlock. Or you can spend your science points in the prerequisites for the next tier of space travel. And make that next big breakthrough in technology level.

[boomerdog2000]

Seconded Darkness. We need to have the parts have advantages and disadvantages instead of just better versions of the same parts. IE higher mass with higher thrust like the Mainsail. This should help keep all parts relevant.

Edited October 10, 2013 by boomerdog2000
broken quote

[The Darkness]

Seconded Darkness. We need to have the parts have advantages and disadvantages instead of just better versions of the same parts. IE higher mass with higher thrust like the Mainsail. This should help keep all parts relevant.

Thanks for the 2nd boomer, I'm glad this is getting some support.