parts [1.10.x] SDHI Service Module System (V4.0.4 / 11 October 2020)

[Synthesis]

I doubled it and found, from the pad, it'll go high enough to deploy both chutes--provided you have SAS on and, thus, lift straight up (which does sort of go against the principle of it).

[Capt. Hunt]

Yeah, the previous values for charMin / charMax work with DRE but not with stock. (Even though they share the same source)

right now I'm trying increased amounts of solid fuel for the LES. 4x is way too much so trying less.

Edit: Ok, I myself am having inconsistent results when decoupling the aeroshroud where it doesn't stop shielding the payload. Nobody else is having a problem in that area...?

Edit #2: Abort tip: A procedure I devised is to extend the flaps on your fins when aborting. It'll stabilize your lifter stage and exert a little drag on it and help keep it away from your pod. (obviously only works if it's a control surface). Works in stock and should work in FAR too.

Edit #3: Found out why the aeroshroud was (sometimes) not ceasing to shield the pod et al. I was decoupling from the docking port. The shroud only updates the cargo bay when its own decouple function has fired. So, known issue: Always use the shroud's decoupler function. (at least until I fix that; but there's probably not really a reason to do what I was doing)

I just had a flight where the 909 wouldn't start because it thought it was still shrouded, I'm not sure why though, because I've had successful launches before.

Edit: I did also notice that if you have the fairings in the same stage as the SM adaptor, they don't separate, this did happen on the flight in question, because I messed around with the SM and didn't fix the staging after I put everything back together, so maybe that has something to do with it.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Capt. Hunt

[Starwaster]

I just had a flight where the 909 wouldn't start because it thought it was still shrouded, I'm not sure why though, because I've had successful launches before.

Edit: I did also notice that if you have the fairings in the same stage as the SM adaptor, they don't separate, this did happen on the flight in question, because I messed around with the SM and didn't fix the staging after I put everything back together, so maybe that has something to do with it.

Next update of the Animated Decoupler, I'll put in a check to see if the parts have separated for any reason and force the cargo bay module to update itself. It's more a bug in the cargo bay module itself because it should be doing those checks already. Already bugged some folks to try to get it fixed in the stock code itself. (you can see this in action in the stock code if you put something on a decoupler inside a closed cargo bay or procedural fairing and then decouple it)

Oh, about the KSPX LES, it has a mass offset. That's why it veers off to one side and does it more extremely if you have more solid fuel in it. (CoMOffset one of those things that should be used sparingly and carefully. Really it should only be used to correct model issues now that we have CoPOffset)

Edited June 4, 2015 by Starwaster

[Capt. Hunt]

Actually, I'm using the stock LES, but it sounds like it has the same problem.

[Bomoo]

Actually, I'm using the stock LES, but it sounds like it has the same problem.

KSPX LES has a much gentler pull to the side, from what I've seen. Plus it looks better.

[sumghai]

Oh, about the KSPX LES, it has a mass offset. That's why it veers off to one side and does it more extremely if you have more solid fuel in it. (CoMOffset one of those things that should be used sparingly and carefully. Really it should only be used to correct model issues now that we have CoPOffset)

Actually, I'm using the stock LES, but it sounds like it has the same problem.

I had a look at the stock LES CFG, and it doesn't have a CoMOffset or CoPOffset.

Based on what I've read about Apollo abort modes, my understanding is that the LES-pod combo flipping after separation is normal, as it ensures that the pod is flung out of the way from the exploding lifter rocket.

I think the problem we're having is that the LES isn't pulling the pod high enough before it starts to flip, and adding more solid fuel shifts the CoM slightly, which may (as Capt. Hunt observed) exacerbate the flipping.

Would increasing both the solid fuel capacity and slightly increasing the thrust help?

[Bomoo]

Just tried an abort with the stock LES, and it doesn't get the pod up high enough to fully deploy the main chutes before smacking into the ground. All it does, really, is jerk the pod to the side a short distance.

Also, is anyone else experiencing their SLS-replica test rocket flop around like a wet noodle on ascent? Jesus Christ.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Bomoo

[Bomoo]

Tried the full kit of the latest test versions on my "for reals" install of KSP, and everything works just as it should, some issues with sound effects not firing aside (there do not appear to be decouple sound effects on ANY SDHI fairing pieces). I do believe you have it, gentlemen.

[Starwaster]

Just tried an abort with the stock LES, and it doesn't get the pod up high enough to fully deploy the main chutes before smacking into the ground. All it does, really, is jerk the pod to the side a short distance.

Pretty sure that's why we're favoring the KSPX in testing.

It's a stock issue and not one that's going to be solved other than Squad. The stock LES has a side firing rocket that has all the force of one of its downwards firing rockets and that's not going to change. All that can be done is to use a different LES or employ some other means to counter the side firing rocket. (such as a sepratron or a KWR small ullage motor)

Also, is anyone else experiencing their SLS-replica test rocket flop around like a wet noodle on ascent? Jesus Christ.

No....

[Bomoo]

Pretty sure that's why we're favoring the KSPX in testing.

It's a stock issue and not one that's going to be solved other than Squad. The stock LES has a side firing rocket that has all the force of one of its downwards firing rockets and that's not going to change. All that can be done is to use a different LES or employ some other means to counter the side firing rocket. (such as a sepratron or a KWR small ullage motor)

KSPX master race.

[Capt. Hunt]

ok, I tested using the KSPX escape tower, and it works. It gets plenty of altitude for chute deployment. My only real complaint would be that the KSP LES has a decoupler, so it separates from the BPC on LES jettison, and it looks kinda stumpy compared to the stock LES.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Capt. Hunt

[sumghai]

Tried the full kit of the latest test versions on my "for reals" install of KSP, and everything works just as it should, some issues with sound effects not firing aside (there do not appear to be decouple sound effects on ANY SDHI fairing pieces). I do believe you have it, gentlemen.

So the other supported add-ons (Deadly Reentry, FAR, HotRockets, Klockheed Martian Special Parts, TAC-LS, Ship Manifest / CLS) are all working too?

I'll open up a new issue for the sound/particle FX on the fairings/other parts later today.

Pretty sure that's why we're favoring the KSPX in testing.

It's a stock issue and not one that's going to be solved other than Squad. The stock LES has a side firing rocket that has all the force of one of its downwards firing rockets and that's not going to change. All that can be done is to use a different LES or employ some other means to counter the side firing rocket. (such as a sepratron or a KWR small ullage motor)

KSPX master race.

ok, I tested using the KSPX escape tower, and it works. It gets plenty of altitude for chute deployment. My only real complaint would be that the KSP LES has a decoupler, so it separates from the BPC on LES jettison, and it looks kinda stumpy compared to the stock LES.

Since the stock LES is inherently designed to flip the pod on abort, it seems that no amount of buffing would make it work nicely for SDHI.

I too prefer the KSPX LES, and I know that many SDHI derivatives (Aerojet Kerbodyne, Chaka Monkey) have their own custom LES, but I think perhaps it's time to make an official SDHI LES for inclusion in V3.0 (see poll):

- Solid fuel capacity comparable to KSPX LES

- Balanced thrust from main motors

- No decoupler (for compatibility with the SDHI pod cover)

- Possibly built-in RCS thrusters that consume the same solid fuel supply as the main motors*?

*Is it possible to make an RCS thruster block that is disabled by default (even when RCS is active), and then use action groups to reactivate the LES RCS on abort?

[kenbobo]

- Possibly built-in RCS thrusters that consume the same solid fuel supply as the main motors*?

I tried making a RCS linear port that ran on solid fuel. Results concluded that it didn't work.

[Bomoo]

ok, I tested using the KSPX escape tower, and it works. It gets plenty of altitude for chute deployment. My only real complaint would be that the KSP LES has a decoupler, so it separates from the BPC on LES jettison, and it looks kinda stumpy compared to the stock LES.

Oh, that. I always delete the decoupler module from the KSPX LES config whenever I install it. As for it being stumpy, I used the KSPX LES long before Squad introduced the Apollo-replica stock one with the NASA update, so for me it's the stock one that looks too big.

- - - Updated - - -

So the other supported add-ons (Deadly Reentry, FAR, HotRockets, Klockheed Martian Special Parts, TAC-LS, Ship Manifest / CLS) are all working too?

I'll open up a new issue for the sound/particle FX on the fairings/other parts later today.

Oh, sorry, I don't use any of those mods, so I'm not sure I'm the right person to talk to about testing them.

The idea of an SDHI LES sounds intriguing, though I don't know how big the audience is that doesn't use both SDHI and KSPX. Still, more variety can't hurt. For the record, it was me that voted No on the LES poll simply because I think it's un-necessary extra work and I'd probably end up using the KSPX one because of its gentle side pull.

Hey, also, are you aware of this business (Pod doesn't fly straight down the retrograde vector when going through atmosphere.)? I remember someone mentioning it earlier in the thread and you and Starwaster discussing how to fix it, but it was still around when I performed my orbital tests yesterday.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Bomoo

[Starwaster]

I tried making a RCS linear port that ran on solid fuel. Results concluded that it didn't work.

I can make it work.

[sumghai]

I'll keep that poll running for a week, although I do suspect that a dedicated SDHI LES is probably beyond the scope of V3.0.

As for the solid fuel RCS built into the LES itself, I'll probably only put effort into it if only stock PartModules and parameters are needed in order for it to work.

[sumghai]

Sorry for the double post, but can I confirm that the stock aero occlusion and all supported add-ons work properly?

I'd like to finally close those issues, and focus on fixing the missing sound / decoupler FX.

[Starwaster]

Sorry for the double post, but can I confirm that the stock aero occlusion and all supported add-ons work properly?

I'd like to finally close those issues, and focus on fixing the missing sound / decoupler FX.

I think so. With the exception that separated shielded items will stay shielded if they weren't properly decoupled or otherwise came apart accidentally. Stock issue but I'll put some extra handling in AnimatedDecouplers so that they will handle it, and hopefully the stock bug will get fixed soon.

[sumghai]

I think so. With the exception that separated shielded items will stay shielded if they weren't properly decoupled or otherwise came apart accidentally. Stock issue but I'll put some extra handling in AnimatedDecouplers so that they will handle it, and hopefully the stock bug will get fixed soon.

Roger that, thanks for the heads-up - closing #42 and #37 on GitHub.

[Capt. Hunt]

Just about everything seems to be working for me so far.

It looks like I can't test the inflatable heat shield though, Raidernick locked down the download link in the KM Special Parts thread.

Too many people were whining about him updating to 1.0.x I guess.

[sumghai]

Just about everything seems to be working for me so far.

It looks like I can't test the inflatable heat shield though, Raidernick locked down the download link in the KM Special Parts thread.

Yeah, bit of a shame. But since that's considered a supported add-on rather than a dependency, I think we can safely consider it to be working for V3.0.

[Capt. Hunt]

yeah, I guess so.

Maybe at some point later you could convert it to use USI's inflatables instead, but that's probably not essential for 3.0

[sumghai]

Maybe at some point later you could convert it to use USI's inflatables instead, but that's probably not essential for 3.0

Do those inflatables trigger automatically on splashdown?

[Capt. Hunt]

no, I don't think so.

But it's a start.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/84359

edit: looking at the code, I think USI's inflatable parts are using Firespitter.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Capt. Hunt

[sumghai]

no, I don't think so.

But it's a start.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/84359

edit: looking at the code, I think USI's inflatable parts are using Firespitter.

Yeah, FSbouyancy doesn't support triggering on splashdown.

Hopefully someone can pick up Klockheed Martian Special Parts soon.