The Career Mode !SCIENCE! Challenge - Max that Tech Tree!

[numerobis]

Ugh; I was well on the way to returning a decent load of EVA reports, but I managed to get Jeb into a pod he couldn't get out of... no recent quicksave since I had gotten cocky, and as allmhuran says, mining Mun and Kerbin for biomes is boring.

If I count correctly, I'm seeing a total of over 1100 science quite doable within the Kerbin system with the tier-0 spacecraft I built, which is basically the same type everyone else is flying (took a while to practice proper decoupling). I ended up with about 1500 m/s and five capsules in orbit. That is enough to go to Mun, boost to Minmus, land at Minmus, head back down to a polar Mun orbit, then on down to a polar Kerbin orbit. Five EVA reports per biome, plus a few crew reports and samples from minmus and the landing site.

But successfully flying that without wedging Jeb in a small capsule is for another day.

I'm not planning on ever threatening the leaders on this board -- I don't have the patience for all those gravity assists.

[ThreeMartiniLaunch]

Ugh; I was well on the way to returning a decent load of EVA reports, but I managed to get Jeb into a pod he couldn't get out of... no recent quicksave since I had gotten cocky, and as allmhuran says, mining Mun and Kerbin for biomes is boring.

If I count correctly, I'm seeing a total of over 1100 science quite doable within the Kerbin system with the tier-0 spacecraft I built, which is basically the same type everyone else is flying (took a while to practice proper decoupling). I ended up with about 1500 m/s and five capsules in orbit. That is enough to go to Mun, boost to Minmus, land at Minmus, head back down to a polar Mun orbit, then on down to a polar Kerbin orbit. Five EVA reports per biome, plus a few crew reports and samples from minmus and the landing site.

But successfully flying that without wedging Jeb in a small capsule is for another day.

I'm not planning on ever threatening the leaders on this board -- I don't have the patience for all those gravity assists.

That's the spirit!

[Nome]

I've completed my second launch mission. 3844 science earned on this one for a total of 4590 science between the two launches. I miss-spent my points after the first mission and didn't get all the science gear I wanted - oh well. My design is similar to Vector's, using the multiple science pods. I used a lander to grab each pod and take it down to a Mun biome. The pod ship (which I named the Pineapple Express) also acted as a fuel depot for the lander. I initially planned to collect science from all of the Mun biomes, Minmus, as well as the space zones above the two moons and Kerbin as well. I ran out of fuel, however, and wasn't able to get to Minmus, as well as missing the 4 Mun biomes too far from its equator. The Pineapple Express tipped over upon landing on Kerbin, but I only lost a few docking ports and empty fuel tanks.

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Edited November 8, 2013 by Nome

[Lions]

I think it is safe to say that i did 3 launches, Sky knows it, but i have to upload the pictures first i guess

[allmhuran]

OK, so it's decision time for me and I'd like to know what other people's opinions might be.

I have decided to redo my tier 0 mission with the even bigger version of the craft (as linked in the video from the previous version). So far things are going very well. By burning more intelligently and going for more advantageous intercepts with Eve and Moho I have managed to do the Eve > Moho > Kerbin > Duna approach phase and still have over 1800 oxidizer remaining. That, for comparison, is *double* what I had at this point in my previous attempt.

Unfortunately, this time around I did not get a free encounter with Ike while passing Duna. The two Ike crew reports (low and high altitude) and four Ike EVA reports (low and high altitude x2 command pods) are probably worth around 150 total science. That's quite a lot to give up.

So, here are my options:

1) Continue past Duna without the Ike intercept. Perform a free return to Kerbin and get a boost up to Jool.

2) Land on Duna, pick up the additional points for a ground sample as well as landed EVA reports (x2) and the landed crew report, then escape back to Kerbin (or head to Jool, not sure which is better) via an Ike gravity assist plus Oberth burn.

Duna is actually quite cheap. Delta V required is 1300 (both down and up, so 2600 total), but landing is actually almost free with 5 parachutes, so really it's more like 1500 total. That's *less* than the cost of a landing and ascent at Vall. Not sure what the additional science value of a Duna landing is, I'm guessing about 350 total, plus I'd get all the reports I would be missing at Ike, so about 500 total difference.

Edited November 12, 2013 by allmhuran

[numerobis]

How about swinging by Ike on the way home from Jool?

For landings, how practical is lithobraking? Seems like a way to both avoid deltaV (or parachute mass), and stage off empty tanks.

Edited November 12, 2013 by numerobis

[SunJumper]

How about swinging by Ike on the way home from Jool?

For landings, how practical is lithobraking? Seems like a way to both avoid deltaV (or parachute mass), and stage off empty tanks.

Lithobraking staging should only need a minimal amount of luck...

[allmhuran]

Surviving the lithobrake would be fairly straightforward since I have 4 fuel tanks below the engine.

Unfortunately, I have only had to drain fuel from two of those tanks, the other two are still full, and I only have one other empty tank in the central column. So a lithobrake would cost me at least one full tank, or two if I go with symmetrical destruction. Trying to get just the two out of the four bottom tanks to go without taking out the other two full ones as well would be... difficult.

Ike on the way home is definitely another option, although it would again require a lucky pass by Duna and possibly more delta-V to get back to Kerbin since Tylo would no longer be flinging me straight home.

Also, I just realised I can also get upper and lower atmosphere crew reports and, with a bit of care, four atmospheric EVA reports if I do a Duna landing. Those are, IIRC, about 50 each, so that's +250-300 with diminishing returns on the EVA reports. That swings me firmly in favour of the Duna landing.

Although, there is the outstanding question of whether I can get back into the Pod on Duna.... how high can the EVA pack get you there?

Edited November 12, 2013 by allmhuran

[SkyRender]

If you can get to Jool early on, you should take the chance. Very little delta-V required for changing SOIs to other moons, and the multipliers are absurd (7 for Jool, 8 for Bop and Pol, 9 for Laythe and Vall, and 10 (!) for Tylo). If you can spare the fuel to circularize at Bop and Pol, you can jetpack down to get samples and EVA reports from their surfaces (worth 9x) and have a huge science leg up.

[allmhuran]

Oh don't worry, I'm still going to Jool.

[Vector]

I think you are better off landing on Ike. You don't get quite as much science but it should be much cheaper, even with a free Duna landing. According to the wiki there is no "high atmosphere" so you might only get half the atmosphere science you're expecting.

I know you think Pol and Bop are crazy expensive, but I think if done optimally should cost less than landing on Duna. Of course it may take a very long time with the gravity assists and/or waiting for an intercept.

[SkyRender]

Actually, it turns out Duna does have an upper atmosphere area. It's just a very, VERY thin belt (from about 32,000m to vacuum; blink and you'll miss it).

[allmhuran]

I decided to just fly past it, mostly because I was worried about my ability to get back into the command pod. I will go with numerobis' suggestion of trying to hit Ike on the way back, and maybe I'll go for the additional Duna science if I still have the fuel. Once the ship is light I can probably safely topple it onto its side after landing, but I wouldn't want to do that with full tanks. And yeah, in that case I might go for an Ike landing instead of Duna anyway. Cheers for the advice all.

Edited November 13, 2013 by allmhuran

[SunJumper]

Actually, it turns out Duna does have an upper atmosphere area. It's just a very, VERY thin belt (from about 32,000m to vacuum; blink and you'll miss it).

AFAIK, the upper atmosphere area doesn't count if you're not in a ground-intersecting trajectory.

[allmhuran]

Finished mission 1 redo with the embiggened craft. Got Ike on the way home (Kinda).

5528 science.

Direct album link: http://imgur.com/a/aG6ej#0

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Edited November 17, 2013 by allmhuran

[Vector]

Very cool! Clearly a pro with the gravity assists.

The way you did the Tylo to Pol transfer, minimizing eccentricity for a reasonable insertion is much harder than it looks. Props for that.

The Mun biomes indeed have glitches. I've never looked for them within the game but I've seen a biome map showing glitches and all.

[numerobis]

Impressive!

One thing: the rules seem to allow flying multiple spacecraft, as long as they all go up in one launch. Seems you could save a chunk of mass by making separate landers for various destinations. Example: when you're doing your escape burn from Kerbin to Eve, you could decouple a bunch of little spacecraft with a manned pod, a T30, and two tanks each. Then you could use those pods to mine samples from every single biome on Mun. Similarly you could drop a pair of pods at Eve to get a sample return from Gilly and radio back some data about Eve (stranding a kerbal), etc.

Mission 2 could go pick everyone up that you stranded (on Eve, Tylo, Laythe, and wherever else).

[SunJumper]

Impressive!

One thing: the rules seem to allow flying multiple spacecraft, as long as they all go up in one launch. Seems you could save a chunk of mass by making separate landers for various destinations. Example: when you're doing your escape burn from Kerbin to Eve, you could decouple a bunch of little spacecraft with a manned pod, a T30, and two tanks each. Then you could use those pods to mine samples from every single biome on Mun. Similarly you could drop a pair of pods at Eve to get a sample return from Gilly and radio back some data about Eve (stranding a kerbal), etc.

Mission 2 could go pick everyone up that you stranded (on Eve, Tylo, Laythe, and wherever else).

That would require decoupling. In tier 0, the only decoupler you have is one that is heavy and very hard to use (it's called a SRB)

[allmhuran]

Some might call this a necro, but challenges never die! Or at least this challenge had to be completed before 0.24 comes out with budgets and renders it obsolete.

Behold, the end of this challenge (video will follow eventually)

[Vector]

Incredible! Can't wait to see the details.

[allmhuran]

The video: "Kerbal Space Program - Over 9000"

craft

Edited June 30, 2014 by allmhuran

[fragbasic]

Congratulations, well done and thank you.

[SkyRender]

It's not quite in the spirit of the challenge since it's actually 3 missions on level-0 tech, but that doesn't make it any less impressive! Well done!

[allmhuran]

It's not quite in the spirit of the challenge since it's actually 3 missions on level-0 tech

Ahem.

The goal is simple as can be: max out the tech tree in as few launches as possible!

I would say 1 launch is as few launches as possible

[Vector]

In the prior version I don't think a single launch unlock was possible, because the theoretical maximum was insufficient without the biomes of Minmus. Still quite an achievement. I doubt I could endure such a lengthy mission -- my own grand tour took essentially a whole day and it was at the limit of what my patience would tolerate!