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Kerbal Attachment System (KAS) 0.4.7 - Pipes as fuel lines and even fewer explosions!

Majiir

By Majiir
in KSP1 Mod Releases

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Chris_C

Chris_C

Posted
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then learn to code and do it yourself.

Jeeze you don't even need to code - the change to get it working is rather trivial, just change the version checking code to check for the current version of KSP (ie change a single number) - and it basically works as it did...

You don't even need an IDE it will compile with a rather simple Makefile...

If the KSP api was decently documented and I had the time I'd volunteer to maintain it myself... but well who wants to get whined at...

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Xrave

Xrave

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Jeeze you don't even need to code - the change to get it working is rather trivial, just change the version checking code to check for the current version of KSP (ie change a single number) - and it basically works as it did...

This fix is not as simple as usual compatibility upgrade, unfortunately. I've been digging at the function for ages now and i still don't understand why the bug is occurring for the 64 bit and not the 32 bit.

If I have one gripe with Majiir (and the mod's predecessor KospY)... it is that the source is written without consideration into people that may read the code later. It's not bad code , but it's not helpfully documented either ^^;

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Sma

Sma

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Also, lets not forget that those who make/maintain this and other mods do so with no compensation (except for those who setup paypal buttons), and take time out of their daily life to give us something to make our game play experience better. They really don't owe us anything and when people whine about this or that not being updated, or something not working correctly it likely doesn't make them feel very good about the hard work they are doing.

We should all take some time every now and then to thank those that work on the mods we use. Thank you mod developers :)

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Galane

Galane

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Wow! The explosions that the KAS parts are causing with the x64 build are truly remarkable! There must be a way to contain all that energy and use it to power our rockets!

C'mon Jeb, we have some more work for you!

KAS Orion Hybrid. A courageous (or really stupid) Kerbal sits above the pusher plate, which has various KAS components affixed to it. Periodically he attempts to remove one of the parts and BLAMMO! The ship is pushed ahead a bit.

Could have some fun with it before it gets fixed. Build a vehicle in SPH with some KAS parts on the back, grab them off and see how far the explosions will push the vehicle down the runway. :D

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Loupkiller

Loupkiller

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Posted (edited)

Hello, I am wondering if I am being a newb or if there is a bug with the mod, when I try to take items from the Universal Storage KAS Container, clicking on take does not let me take whats inside the container. I was able to pickup the complete container and place it back on the ship.

I only read the last 3 pages of the thread, Ill go read more after i posted this and edit if i found something.

After reading the last

Thank you

Edit:After reading the 20 last pages I found this: Link

Edited by Loupkiller
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JeffreyCor

JeffreyCor

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Guys KAS works perfectly fine in 32-bit 0.24. :)

Have to disagree. Have had the same problems as others have posted with problems when using KAS with .24.x 32 bit. Very glad for you being one of the lucky ones, but wouldn't exactly say it's working perfectly fine.

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Majiir

Majiir

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I am busy with RL obligations. I am not participating in the Kerbin Cup this round. (My team got this far running at 50% anyway.)

If you would like to make a serious offer to maintain or assist with any of my projects, please send me a note. They require a lot of time (and a lot of money, in some cases). Otherwise, kindly keep your thoughts on mod maintenance to yourself.

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whaaw

whaaw

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I am busy with RL obligations. I am not participating in the Kerbin Cup this round. (My team got this far running at 50% anyway.)

If you would like to make a serious offer to maintain or assist with any of my projects, please send me a note. They require a lot of time (and a lot of money, in some cases). Otherwise, kindly keep your thoughts on mod maintenance to yourself.

I spent a lot of time in the KAS code and some other guy too. there is nothing wrong mostly it works on 32bit. Its very hard to get a workaround for that grab problem. Phantom forces everywhere

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sharpspoonful

sharpspoonful

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I am busy with RL obligations. I am not participating in the Kerbin Cup this round. (My team got this far running at 50% anyway.)

If you would like to make a serious offer to maintain or assist with any of my projects, please send me a note. They require a lot of time (and a lot of money, in some cases). Otherwise, kindly keep your thoughts on mod maintenance to yourself.

BOOM.

startrekwithit.gif

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Chris_C

Chris_C

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This fix is not as simple as usual compatibility upgrade, unfortunately. I've been digging at the function for ages now and i still don't understand why the bug is occurring for the 64 bit and not the 32 bit.

If I have one gripe with Majiir (and the mod's predecessor KospY)... it is that the source is written without consideration into people that may read the code later. It's not bad code , but it's not helpfully documented either ^^;

BUG??? if anything its a *lot* more stable using it in 64bit since KSP was updated, I'm yet to be able to reliably replicate any explosive behaviour, mind you the only other mod I'm using is MechJeb - is this a Windows / other mod interaction issue ??

I'd be interested to hear from anyone else who has only KAS installed and can *reliably* recreate explosive behavior with a .craft file and simple instructions to replicate....

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aikixd

aikixd

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This fix is not as simple as usual compatibility upgrade, unfortunately. I've been digging at the function for ages now and i still don't understand why the bug is occurring for the 64 bit and not the 32 bit.[/quote

Speculation (I haven't seen KAS or any underlying related code ): By those two discussions, it appears, than CPU does not uses floats or doubles for its operations, but uses something called FPU, which is an 80 bit floating point number. When DirectX comes into the picture, some strange things happen. It appears that when DirectX is initiating, it changes the precision of calculations on the FPU.

So, when KSP detaches parts, it gives a little punch to new ships, so they move apart. Say, that punch is a little less than 1, by 0.00000001 as an example. In a 32 bit code, this number after the affection of DirectX can become 0.000000003 which is a little closer to 1. But for the 64 bit app, there are 32 bits more to carry the mistake and it can become -0.000000001 that is bigger than 1 and if we multiply it by "explosion factor" this will give us more than 1 which leads to "explode(part)". The fact that the detaching works with lower deltaT somewhat supports the idea, as the multiplications would be by smaller numbers, thus less range for error to accumulate.

It can be completely wrong, as I am unfamiliar with such low level coding and this is just a hunch.

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Rhedd

Rhedd

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BUG??? if anything its a *lot* more stable using it in 64bit since KSP was updated, I'm yet to be able to reliably replicate any explosive behaviour, mind you the only other mod I'm using is MechJeb - is this a Windows / other mod interaction issue ??

I'd be interested to hear from anyone else who has only KAS installed and can *reliably* recreate explosive behavior with a .craft file and simple instructions to replicate....

Okay, you can hear from me. No .craft file or complex instructions needed. It's too simple. Take a small lander can, slap a KAS rack on the side, put a container on the rack, put anything in the container- or not. Launch, EVA, click the container and select grab.

Have fun.

Sometimes the lander can flies away at warp speed, sometimes the poor kerbal does. Sometimes both do. Sometimes some things or everything explodes violently. The KAS rack almost always ends up spinning wildly like a top, not respecting little rules like gravity. The one things that consistently NEVER happens is nothing. Something always explodes or goes hilariously awry.

This is in 64 bit, and happens whether using standard KAS or using the recently modified DLL posted here. No other mods.

Boom. Every time.

The modded DLL does help, though, since without it I can't remove anything from containers. With it I can, but there's an oddly long pause before the item shows up on the kerbal's back.

So yeah, now you've heard at least one person say this is a 100% replicable problem. Happens every single time.

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Chris_C

Chris_C

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Okay, you can hear from me. No .craft file or complex instructions needed. It's too simple. Take a small lander can, slap a KAS rack on the side, put a container on the rack, put anything in the container- or not. Launch, EVA, click the container and select grab.

In that case its *definatly* a windows issue of some kind

I like the directX floating point theory as I know its caught people before

I recommend Debian "Jessie" 64 bit, I would help bug hunting but I don't have windows on any of my machine (thankfully! ;) )

.... I do wonder if the bug would happen in windows if you run debian 64bit in a virtual machine on windows.....

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BLUESHADOW125

BLUESHADOW125

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In that case its *definatly* a windows issue of some kind

I like the directX floating point theory as I know its caught people before

I recommend Debian "Jessie" 64 bit, I would help bug hunting but I don't have windows on any of my machine (thankfully! ;) )

.... I do wonder if the bug would happen in windows if you run debian 64bit in a virtual machine on windows.....

does this mean that the KAS bugs are incurable???

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aikixd

aikixd

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does this mean that the KAS bugs are incurable???

There are no incurable bugs. If what I have written is correct, then that would be the starting point. It's really tough to fix a bug, that there is nothing known about it.

Though, it may be up to Squad to make the fix. I don't know the KSP API, really, I may be wrong here. I do know that there is an option in dX to disable this behavior, but that will cause performance impact and this is most likely managed by Unity. If small numbers make things explode, I would have just made them bigger.

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Chris_C

Chris_C

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does this mean that the KAS bugs are incurable???

not at all just get rid of windows..... :o)

*seriously* *if* this is the issue (which it entirely might NOT be) I remember hearing about it ages ago (ie its probably been fixed/worked round many times)

Whats really needed is someone to run a debugger or at least show detailed logs so someone can at least get a clue as to whats causing the issue - watching a slowmo youtube might have been enough but I can't replicate the issue with my setup so I've no way to tell if any meddling I might do would help....

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mike9606

mike9606

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not at all just get rid of windows..... :o)

*seriously* *if* this is the issue (which it entirely might NOT be) I remember hearing about it ages ago (ie its probably been fixed/worked round many times)

Whats really needed is someone to run a debugger or at least show detailed logs so someone can at least get a clue as to whats causing the issue - watching a slowmo youtube might have been enough but I can't replicate the issue with my setup so I've no way to tell if any meddling I might do would help....

It is not a bug with Windows, it is a bug with either KAS or the 64-bit version of unity.

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