Can't use a ladder properly

[technion]

Hey guys,

Boy am I glad I tested this on Kerbin before I got it to Laythe (again...).

After redesigning this lander to be more capable of getting into Laythe orbit, I can't seem to get a Kerbal to climb back in. Here's me, trying to get in. I even added a horizontal ladder to see if it would make him move along it. He just doesn't seem capable of grabbing the door.

As a side note, sanity check: if I deploy this lander from a 20KM orbit, I can land on Kerbin, then get back into a 100KM orbit. Someone please assure me that it'll be able to make it out of Laythe next time

[pluto101]

Kerbal's have poor lateral dexterity, and don't do a good job at grabbing onto ladders that are even slightly to the side of the ladder they're currently on. Your poor Kerbal is getting stuck on the handholds on your X8 tank, and thus can't reach the capsule. I'd suggest keeping your hand holds in a straight line to the top of that X8 fuel tank, and from there your kerbal should be able to walk into the capsule.

I'd also suggest testing this on the launchpad, though it looks like you've started to do that now.

[700NitroXpress]

You should be able to just right click on the door and choose board. At least you can with the external command seats. Your problem is the large fuel can under the lander can.

What you might want to try is putting an external command seat on it and using that to get back on the ship, or use it to ride up into orbit and then do an EVA to the lander door.

Edited November 4, 2013 by 700NitroXpress

[Clockwork_werewolf]

I always test my ladders on the launch pad for this reason. Kerbals can handle ladders being a little over by about 1/4 the amount in the picture. What I would suggest instead though would be to rotate the ladders so they are at a 10 degree angle and switching off angle lock in the builder so the ladders can be placed better. Then test it again.

There are so many times I have tested ladders on the launch pad and watched a Kerbal fall from a simple ladder transfer that now it is part of my checklist. Unless I'm going to a small moon like the Mun, then it's just fudge this I'm using jet packs.

[technion]

I think a better shot answers both of these.

You can see in this image that he's able to completely align himself laterally (at least it looks it to me?)

Yet at that point, he's can't right click the door at all. If he moves forward at all from there, he'll fall off.

[pluto101]

Oh, huh. You know, I encountered a similar problem in a rig I put together this weekend. I found that placing that final rung at a 45 degree angle seemed to allow Jeb to make it over that last ridge.

[technion]

Thanks Pluto. I'll give that a go. It was about to be "back to assembly" regardless because I switched target to the lander, then back to the kerbal, and suddenly he's 900m away and not getting back any time soon.

[Kasuha]

Laythe's atmosphere is thinner than Kerbin so make sure you can spend some fuel on braking. But getting back to orbit is way easier on Laythe than on Kerbin so if you can get it to 100 km orbit from Kerbin you should be safe even with completely powered landing (unless you stage your landing gear off).

Regarding ladders, I had success with this configuration (except Gregsby for some reason liked traversing the last part with his head down):

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[technion]

Many thanks guys. The 45' ladder feels like a terrible hack -- in that it clips halfway through the rocket. The image below however, shows my kerbal having just entered so that sorts that one out.

Kasuha, I need to do an assisted burn even on Kerbin, the rocket wants to touch down at 13m/s and can't handle more than about 9. The bottom fuel tank is designed to eject early after takeoff, the idea being to use staging without actually having to carry extra engines around.

Now I just need to rebuild the lifter to deal with the extra weight and then I can get back on course with this mission.

[Kasuha]

Just for your information, this is what I used on Laythe. It successfully landed, got back to orbit and later landed back on Kerbin (after a bit of refuelling). It does not involve any staging and weighs 29.9 tons. And you need action groups to deploy chutes twice. But that was in 0.21, now it might need either very soft landing or putting landing legs a bit lower.

[technion]

Thanks for that Kasuha, that's great info. The more I work on something - the more someone seems to be able to come along with a much simpler design that did the job I just replayed it, and managed a 250K orbit.

What engines are those? I can never tell from images (and I've been known to rebuild my own from time to time because when I'm sitting in the VAB I often can't tell what I last used).

I'm heavily looking forward to making this mission a success, the transporter already dropped a probe there and made it back, so this should be the final piece of the puzzle.

[Kasuha]

What engines are those? I can never tell from images (and I've been known to rebuild my own from time to time because when I'm sitting in the VAB I often can't tell what I last used).

LV-T45, those with thrust vectoring.

[merlinux]

Excuse me from putting my grain of salt but if you are thinking of redesigning you might as well try using a mix of jets engines and rocket engines for laythe. It is very efficient. Ill try and get a pic in my screenshot collection to show you

EDIT

found it Not the best image but it has 4 jet engines and 2 lv 909. Fully reusable Oh and this is even overkill for laythe, this lander achieve kerbin orbit without trouble

EDIT 2: You cant see it in the pic but it has 2 drogue chutes (located on top of the 909 stacks) and a few radial chutes.

Edited November 4, 2013 by merlinux