My ship just explodes at 6100m.

[plainawesome]

you can try posting the file file on google docks, I'm interested in testing out the ship as well.

[SRV Ron]

SRV, I'll email you the file if you'd like. I'm a total nub at this file sharing thing.

I'm going to remove the RCS tanks and try again tomorrow. I think you can pm me the email if you'd like.

Also if you just click and drag you can copy the file text without line numbers.

Copied the file by avoiding the line numbers.

Note, it flew although there is a spin issue that can be fixed with bracing. I did throttle down due to overheating issues with the mainsail. RCS is not needed for launch.

[SRV Ron]

you can try posting the file file on google docks, I'm interested in testing out the ship as well.

"Also if you just click and drag you can copy the file text without line numbers. "

This worked by copying to Wordpad and saving with the craft extension.

[Xephirious]

Looks good up there! You just throttled up and floored it? It may not be designed suitably yet as I haven't even gotten it past 6900 yet. If you can just fly it up without issues it must be something besides compression failure.

EDIT: I see you did throttle down. Did you go for orbital? It's designed to refuel at my Fuel Depot space station before the Jool excursion.

Edited December 4, 2013 by Xephirious

[Xephirious]

Well now I'm just stumped, I mirrored SRV's launch and I exploded at 6km and 195kmh.

[Taki117]

So, I just copied and pasted the craft file, I will give it a whirl and see how it goes. (Note I use MechJeb for throttle control so it will keep it below terminal velocity while in atmo)

Just finished the test flight, right out of the box it looks good, but I seriously doubt you have enough dV to get to Jool (Unless I wasn't supposed to drop those NERVAs...)

Big issues:

1. Tad wobbly on the pad, launch quick
   
2. No action group for solar panels. (More of a convenience thing)
   
3. not sure if I should have dropped those NERVAs
   
4. Questionable dV for Jool trip
   
5. Hits terminal velocity quick, needs throttle down (Possible cause of spontaneous dis-assembly)
   

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Edited December 4, 2013 by Taki117
Test Flight Complete

[Xephirious]

Ok I think I'm closing in on the cause. I just removed the 3 man pod and used a mk2 lander can. Got into orbit first launch. Going to add some weight to determine if it's the 3man pod or the additional 1.5t that was the cause.

[SRV Ron]

Ok I think I'm closing in on the cause. I just removed the 3 man pod and used a mk2 lander can. Got into orbit first launch. Going to add some weight to determine if it's the 3man pod or the additional 1.5t that was the cause.

Design suggestions;

1. Add the X-200-8 fuel cans under each orange tank to control overheat on the Mainsail. You may have to stitch them for stability. There is more then enough power for the added fuel and weight they contain

2. For more Delta V, change the 2 pair asparagus design to a 3 pair. (Six orange tanks in a ring instead of two.) Brace similarly to what I do with my design.

3. Brace the LV-N at the base, not the top, to the orange tanks.

4. Remove the duplicate set of quad thrusters.

5. you can go much smaller on the solar panels as well as place them on an action group.

6. Use the LV-N for interplanetary flight. They are double the efficiency in that mode.

7. There should be a better way to mount the probes and LV-N setup then the complex girder open design. Some weight could be shed there as well as better stability.

8. Place the battery below the decoupler on the command pod or just delete it. The probe batteries will provide power if needed until you have deployed solar panels.

9. Staggered launch clamps should stop the wobble on the pad.

10. Fins not needed.

The only reason I used the web decouplers is because I used a 4 pair design on the launch vehicle.

Also, I dump the more powerful but less efficient liquid engines once in orbit and use the remaining fuel on the more efficient LV-N for interplanetary flight.

Note, staging is wrong for the LV-N. It should go above the stack decouplers on the saddle tanks. (Between 5 and 6 on staging)

Edited December 4, 2013 by SRV Ron

[Xephirious]

Thanks so much for your help guys. A few notes on your suggestions.

LV-N staging was incorrect, that was a temp setting to allow for testing w/o blowing up the first pair of asparagus tanks with nuclear exhaust.

LV-N are for interplanatary flight only, the poodle was included for emergency maneuvres and orbital circularization but won't be the primary drive.

Don't drop the LV-Ns!

Solar action group is number 4

The craft is designed for orbital refueling at my Fuel Depot SS

I solved some of the wobble issues by disabling torque on all of the probe cores and bracing the LV-N's better

SRV's #4...? I dont get this one. EDIT: I see, you're talking RCS

The battery pack was out of position as I was moving things around to try and nail down the culprit of spontaneous disassembly.

Does overheating affect ISP?

I will probly rework the mounting of the LV-N's so they don't have decouplers. That should avoid some complications.

I was thinking of deleting the skipper all together and just toting the fuel with the LV-N, what do you think?

If you'd like I'll share the reworked craft after more testing.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Xephirious

[Taki117]

By all means, share away. On your rocket you have duplicated RCS thrusters on the upper most decoupler, these are not required. I also have a probe carrier design that might work a tad better if you want it. Overheating does not affect Isp If you want to keep your LV-Ns I would reverse the fuel line and have it going from the central tank to the outer tanks. As far as disabling the probe core torque, that's not the issue (And doing so may actually make wobble worse) the issue is the lack of a solid structural foundation. for the carrier.

[Xephirious]

Ok I got the beast into space! I made a few modifications and I'll post the .craft file tonight if I can.

http://i.imgur.com/uQZgSl9.png' alt='uQZgSl9.png'>

Since Jeb's untimely demise Bob has accepted his promotion as the new lead pilot of the Union of Rogue Kerbalnaughts and is quite happy with this flight!

[SRV Ron]

Looking better. You can ditch the poodle and rely on the nukes for interplanetary. In fact, you can gain more efficiency with three nukes instead of two and a poodle. you lose some thrust with little change in mass. The fuel can next to the command pod has no fuel lines to the lower one unless the bracings can pass through fuel. Suggestion is to remove the lattice work where the probes are, place a x-200-16 or 32 fuel can in that space, mount the nukes on shorter FL-T100 on outriggers, and mount the probes on outriggers as well. Don't forget RCS propellent can either on the LV-N outriggers or in the core.

Thruster sets are now correct.

Found the monoprop tanks in your lattice core.

Edited December 5, 2013 by SRV Ron

[SRV Ron]

Modified your booster to 3 pair asparagus. Also, later removed the poodle and added a x-200-16 to the core. Your payload now achieves orbit only needing a short burn of the LV-N, more efficient then using the Poodle. Reversed the fuel lines to the LV-N. Some spin issues to orbit but is controllable. It settles down on the last pair of asparagus.

BTW, fuel is not flowing from the upper can to the lower. A fuel line will be needed.

Orbit with poodle.

Orbit with LV-N only;

There should be enough delta V to get to Jool. No guarantee you can make it back.

[RSF77]

Using this mod might help, especially with mechjeb since engine gimbal seems to cause wobbling while using it:

Kerbal Joint Reinforcement

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/55657-0-22-Kerbal-Joint-Reinforcement-v1-4-2-Properly-Rigid-Part-Connections

May or may not though because of the obj_base collision but who knows, sure your rocket is actually positioned above the base on launch? Another option might be playing with the rate of physics calculations in the KSP options, cpu lag could be causing it or something. I know changing that slider to the right some makes my game immensely faster with high part counts, also making vehicles hold together better.

Edited December 5, 2013 by RSF77

[SRV Ron]

Engine wobble hasn't been an issue. If it were, I could lock gimbals on the asparagus. Reconfiguring bracing, not seen in the posted photo, solved a lot of the wobble problem.

[Xephirious]

Hey all! This is the newest and best .craft file for my Jool probe launcher. Thanks for your help and suggestions in designs. Hotkey descriptions are in the ship description (click the ship name in VAB).

There should be enough delta V to get to Jool. No guarantee you can make it back.

I don't use engineer so I'm not really sure about the dv. Thanks again for your analysis! I'll be making my first trip to Jool tonight.

http://www./view/e9701o41b6z752c/Jool%20Explorer%202.craft

Screenshots of her refueling at my SSFuelDepot

And another of her immediately after circularizing

Edited December 5, 2013 by Xephirious

[SRV Ron]

Redesigned your payload section. The probes are attached by by cube struts to the core tank. They survive launch OK. Now, how do you transfer control once you stage one for independent flight? If you use an action group, they become independently selectable.

This cut the parts way down yet retained the probes and other goodies of your payload. Need to play with bracing to stop yoyo spin during launch. I want to avoid the need to refuel. I can add more fuel to the launch phase as there is still a surplus of power on launch.

Keep us advised of your flight progress.

[Xephirious]

I totally redesigned the kit. The last .craft I posted broke the ion probes when decoupled.

Launched Jool Explorer2 and it's interplanetary tug. After joining the two I topped them off with a tanker and headed to Jool. After a loooong burn and some fine tuning I dropped the Interplanetary Tug in the Jool system. Tug had like 10 units of fuel left so it was pretty much maximally efficient. After fuel transfers and ditching the IP Tug I have 2600dv on the Kerbal'd carrier, just enough to get home.

Science is commencing and I have stable orbits on Jool and Vall.

Burning for Jool. Notice the decoupler above the bottom tanks, this will allow me to dump some weight mid way through my return trip for a small DV boost.

Dumping the IP Tug and commencing high orbit Jool science. Also launched two probes right after this pic. You can see how little fuel I had left in the tug.

Aerobraking Jool

Orbiting Jool's moon Vall

Total craft redesign again. I wanted to keep the feel of the first but leave more room for the probes. Fully tested now so it all works. I also deploy the probes manually w/o the staging so I can do them individually. All 3 types of probes work as designed, though the ion probes w/ parachutes cant do much science once in atmosphere as the panels break.

Mediafire seems to be down. If you PM an email I can send you the craft files, otherwise I will post tomorrow.

Edited December 6, 2013 by Xephirious

[SRV Ron]

Fix the spin issue. Got your payload into orbit with only a small burn of the LV-N. Therefore, no refueling needed. Tested out three probes launched by action groups that activated the probe, deployed solar panels, and launched it. Probes look good although the fuel ones could either go an ant engine or have two Oscar B tanks.

The launch vehicle all stock parts. Part count down quite a bit.

In orbit with launched ion probes;

And the standard probe;

[Xephirious]

The fuel probes have just under 900dv whereas the ions have 2300 or so, I chose that engine as it's ISP in vacuum is better. So far I've scienced Jool, Bop, Lythe and Vall. I will probly make a thread for the whole trip once it's done.

The two ion probes next to the fuel tanks on my build break a solar panel on decoupling, I'm thinking a different decoupler would do it w/o damage.

No worries though the mission is a resounding success thus far, so long as I can get the crew home!

The parachuted ion probe made a great floating oceanic lab on Laythe. Great results from there!

Edited December 7, 2013 by Xephirious

[SRV Ron]

I placed the mothership panels on the lower FL-800 fuel cans so the probes launch out of their way. The decoupler rings go floating off on their own. You can see them in the one picture just above the mothership. Plan slingshots with the moon to come out of Jool retrograde when the Kerban window is available and you should have an efficient trip home. Go direct to an aerobraking window as you did with jool.

[SRV Ron]

Modifications to the launch vehicle.

A KW booster placed Jool One payload into orbit with full tanks.

Next, I added a Novapunch booster ring with disastrous results;

After some redesign with braces;

BTY, the final design is very stable with no spin issues.

Results, 109 tons in orbit with a core engine to send the payload to Jool.

Now to see if the trio can orbit Jool, conduct their probe missions, and return home.

Edited December 9, 2013 by SRV Ron

[SRV Ron]

Jool Explorer 6 has aerobraked into orbit into the influence of the three inner moons with just under 1/2 the fuel left for the LV-N. No tug, no refueling. Used RCS to fine tune the aerobrake to exactly 120km. The encounter slingshot was going to kick me out of the Kerbal system.

[Xephirious]

Great work! I don't use kW so I don't have access to some of those rocket parts. After the Jool probe mission I retooled the kit for a Laythe Habitability Survey. Now it's a 3 peice design carrier, tug, lander and a seperate fuel tug is 5 days behind. LHS is in a polar orbit of Laythe and the probes are dispatched. The lander had a malfunction and doesnt appear to have the Dv to get to LLO. Poor Kerry Kerbin appears to be stuck on the surface of Laythe! Once I've completed the LHS I will update.

[xtremespino]

Maybe you were accelerating to fast, did you try throttling down? That has happened to me, I just didn't notice until I saw the g-force meter needle was as high as it could go.