Multiplayer or resources ?

[PwnedDuck]

Resources. Deep ship design-orbital mechanics multistage planning is not something that can be easily be coordinated with friends, and certainly not something I have the patience to introduce to my solidly KSP-disinterested, bumbling friends.

Resources just makes the deep end so much deeper, even if it isn't something for ign to gush about.

Edit: if I want mp games to mess around in there is no shortage. Here's hoping KSP stays, and grows as a deep experience I can enjoy alone.

Edited December 15, 2013 by PwnedDuck

[Ski]

I voted resources.

I would really dig both. I just want resources to be completed first. With resources, people can set up off kerbin infrastructure and with the ability to use those resources, set up colonies and off-world shipyards. Then add in multiplayer and allow people to build colonies and fuel depots and shipyards and mining operations and so on together.

I'd like to see something kinda like the following for next year:

0.24 Money in career and finish adding biomes to planets and moons

0.25 Resources - collection and per ship utilization (similar to how Kethane works, you can mine stuff to make fuel)

0.26 Resources - broad utilization: ability to construct vessels offworld, ship ore back to Kerbin and sell it for money, etc

0.27 Final mechanics implementation - primarily re-entry heat and life support; waste heat management and remote tech style comm systems would be nice (maybe make these optional via settings toggle so that beginners don't have all kinds difficulty up front)

0.28 Multiplayer

You read my mind.

Here is your rough guideline SQUAD.

P.S. so when MP is implemented will that mean that MechJeb autopilot will be deemed as : cheating?

I always heard that there is no cheating in single player games...well it's about to be MP.

Edited December 15, 2013 by Ski

[vexx32]

"About to be"...? It's not gonna be coming that fast, you know. It's a goal. Not something they've been secretly working on for ages.

[DirkLarien]

voted resources

I really don't see any point in playing this game with someone else.

So i can dock with someone ? "....hey stop rotating so i can dock", "No you stop i will dock with you, you suck at docking"

Why would i want to do that anyway ?

Two players controlling one ship ?

one player piloting the ship, other player doing ... what exactly ? clicking on solar panels ? clicking on experiments ?

Please tell me about something, that would be engaging enough to do.

So people can ram my ships/stations/etc ? No thanks.

And really you want to wait hours to actually get from kerbin to moon ? Don't get me started on launch windows for other planets.

Ok, i get it. Lets make some sort of ingame time-warp vote system. „hey lets warp for a 5 days so i can get to xyz planet“ „naaah am doing stuff on surface gonna take like an hour.“

No thanks

IMO multiplayer is mechanic, that would most likely take a lot of time to make and i really don't see the benefit in it. Please tell me, because i cant think of any.

[OtherDalfite]

voted resources

I really don't see any point in playing this game with someone else.

So i can dock with someone ? "....hey stop rotating so i can dock", "No you stop i will dock with you, you suck at docking"

Why would i want to do that anyway ?

Two players controlling one ship ?

one player piloting the ship, other player doing ... what exactly ? clicking on solar panels ? clicking on experiments ?

Please tell me about something, that would be engaging enough to do.

So people can ram my ships/stations/etc ? No thanks.

And really you want to wait hours to actually get from kerbin to moon ? Don't get me started on launch windows for other planets.

Ok, i get it. Lets make some sort of ingame time-warp vote system. „hey lets warp for a 5 days so i can get to xyz planet“ „naaah am doing stuff on surface gonna take like an hour.“

No thanks

IMO multiplayer is mechanic, that would most likely take a lot of time to make and i really don't see the benefit in it. Please tell me, because i cant think of any.

This, I don't know if Squad even thought about what multiplayer would entail other than this. I don't even know if they WERE thinking.

[vexx32]

Think outside of the box. Rather than assuming that multiplayer will be exactly what we have with others to annoy you, it bears considering that it could easily add many entirely new things to the table. I would not be surprised if there end up being a great many things made possible with multiplayer that we have not even imagined yet.

[Galileo Kerbonaut]

Think outside of the box. Rather than assuming that multiplayer will be exactly what we have with others to annoy you, it bears considering that it could easily add many entirely new things to the table. I would not be surprised if there end up being a great many things made possible with multiplayer that we have not even imagined yet.

Things like: you're a NOOB, idiot, fool... and all the other swears I don't dare to post afraid of being banned...? Come on, you know just as well as I do MP is going to degenerate KSP. You're not a fool... you know how the internet works, right?

Edited December 16, 2013 by Galileo Kerbonaut

[Eric S]

Things like: you're a NOOB, idiot, fool... and all the other swears I don't dare to post afraid of being banned...? Come on, you know just as well as I do MP is going to degenerate KSP.

If KSP were done MMO, you'd be right. If it were done with mostly public servers, you'd probably be right. On the other hand, if I use MP to play with friends and one of them acts like that without being lighthearted about it, they probably won't be invited back. It's the difference between playing with friends and playing with strangers.

[I_Killed_Jeb]

Things like: you're a NOOB, idiot, fool... and all the other swears I don't dare to post afraid of being banned...? Come on, you know just as well as I do MP is going to degenerate KSP. You're not a fool... you know how the internet works, right?

whoa there buddy

[allmappedout]

Things like: you're a NOOB, idiot, fool... and all the other swears I don't dare to post afraid of being banned...? Come on, you know just as well as I do MP is going to degenerate KSP. Come on, you're not a fool... you know how the internet works, right?

Are you serious? The stuff we have already seen with multiplayer-esque things proves this isn't the case. The idea of being able to take an entire apollo mission up, as a crew, entirely in IVA, sounds like an awesome prospect that my friends and I would absolutely love to do. The idea of putting together a huge space station, with each of us putting parts together sounds like a ton of fun.

What everyone seems to be assuming is that multiplayer is going to be like call of duty, with matchmaking and lobbies. I don't see it like that at all. I see it as a direct connection between computers (maybe piggy backing off steam, or whatever), and having a small group of people working together, maybe 4, maybe up to 8 or so. I certainly don't see the idea of having 32 people as appealing or manageable.

And even if it is, for the most part the community is made up of a bloody load of great people, and a lot of intelligent people. It'd be an absolute pleasure to play with some of you, and I'd absolutely love to do so and be part of something bigger. Most people on here aren't going to be your average 14-year-old ADHD kid that will move on after 20 minutes. People have put hours, days, weeks and months into this game. People LOVE this game, and a lot of people want to share that excitement with other people.

And as so many people have said before, the possibilities that Multiplayer brings, most of them probably haven't been imagined yet. Resources would be cool, of course, it's definitely something I want to see too, because as others say, it adds a purpose to going to a planet with permanence, BUT, I don't want resources if I have to go to a planet and spend an hour searching for a small deposit of chemical x just to fly it back to Kerbin so I can make more rocket fuel. The implementation has to make sense, and most importantly, be fun.

[Skyrunner27]

Pretty sure most of multiplayer will be private servers. Oh and here is a point mentioning if you don't like multiplayer don't use it.

[Galileo Kerbonaut]

Are you serious? The stuff we have already seen with multiplayer-esque things proves this isn't the case. The idea of being able to take an entire apollo mission up, as a crew, entirely in IVA, sounds like an awesome prospect that my friends and I would absolutely love to do. The idea of putting together a huge space station, with each of us putting parts together sounds like a ton of fun.

What everyone seems to be assuming is that multiplayer is going to be like call of duty, with matchmaking and lobbies. I don't see it like that at all. I see it as a direct connection between computers (maybe piggy backing off steam, or whatever), and having a small group of people working together, maybe 4, maybe up to 8 or so. I certainly don't see the idea of having 32 people as appealing or manageable.

And even if it is, for the most part the community is made up of a bloody load of great people, and a lot of intelligent people. It'd be an absolute pleasure to play with some of you, and I'd absolutely love to do so and be part of something bigger. Most people on here aren't going to be your average 14-year-old ADHD kid that will move on after 20 minutes. People have put hours, days, weeks and months into this game. People LOVE this game, and a lot of people want to share that excitement with other people.

And as so many people have said before, the possibilities that Multiplayer brings, most of them probably haven't been imagined yet. Resources would be cool, of course, it's definitely something I want to see too, because as others say, it adds a purpose to going to a planet with permanence, BUT, I don't want resources if I have to go to a planet and spend an hour searching for a small deposit of chemical x just to fly it back to Kerbin so I can make more rocket fuel. The implementation has to make sense, and most importantly, be fun.

Just wait until the public community gets their hands on this... it will grow out of hand quickly. Do you really think moderators will take control of this!?

Resources, on the other hand, would add an unimaginable depth to game play.

Again, you are aware of how the internet works, right?

Edited December 16, 2013 by Galileo Kerbonaut

[Santoron]

Probably resources, since I can't see myself using multiplayer all that much. But I won't have to choose. Modders will provide expanded resource systems in the coming months, and Squad will provide Multiplayer. Win Win.

[RSwordsman]

I would *LOVE* multiplayer-- in theory. In practice though, I probably wouldn't do it much. Compared to what I see on here, my creations are balsa-wood airplanes powered by balloons making fart sounds. I wouldn't get much out of it.

Resources, though, would add so much to the game. Right now it's basically a literal sandbox, tasking the player to fly around the solar system and orbit/land on things. But you can't do anything once you get there other than collect science points (if career mode), plant a flag, then come home. But once I installed Kethane, my space program had a purpose. My satellites weren't just semi-functional junk cluttering up LKO. I then had a reason to send probes to various bodies, put scanning satellites in inclined orbits around Kerbin, and launching payloads with multiple components that would unpack and all work together once at a destination.

Granted I haven't gotten any full-scale mining operation to work yet, but the point is, I can try. And if successful, I'd win more than bragging rights. If this and other resources are implemented in the full game, it would make the Kerbals' space capabilities so much wider and for me at least, more driven.

Edited December 16, 2013 by RSwordsman

[Sigma117]

I chose resources.

I do like that mp is coming, but I feel resources would add a lot more to the game, even if it's as simple as Kethane. That and the general issues with mp and the internet, unless you're on a private server you will undoubtedly get people you'd rather not have met playing.

[Galileo Kerbonaut]

If KSP were done MMO, you'd be right. If it were done with mostly public servers, you'd probably be right. On the other hand, if I use MP to play with friends and one of them acts like that without being lighthearted about it, they probably won't be invited back. It's the difference between playing with friends and playing with strangers.

So what if none of my friends play KSP? I have to turn to the public servers and be doomed? Thanks, but no thanks... I'd rather play a single player game, preferably with resources.

[TinfoilChef]

My preference is resources. For all of the many reasons that so many have already expressed.

[Murph]

This poll is flawed and can't produce a "clean" result. It makes the false assumption that those are the only 2 possible desires, and doesn't allow a neutral response. It basically makes the results meaningless as evidence.

My response is "don't care, as long as KSP keeps moving forwards". Please ensure that is included in your results before you cite them as evidence anywhere.

[Caelib]

If I had to choose one over the other, I would definitely pick Resources -- they just have so much more to offer the game than multiplayer.

[Horn Brain]

The following is my opinion. I do not even pretend to suggest that I'm right and others are wrong.

This is the biggest mistake the devs have made.

Resources would add mountains of gameplay to KSP. Multiplayer adds almost nothing that can't be accomplished by sharing a save file.

The fact that resources would be localized would give players new tasks (map and sample resource distributions, deliver hardware to gather/process resources, deliver infrastructure to get resources off planet, and it would also add a useful purpose for space stations), but it would also invoke or strengthen the importance of new skills (targeted landings and larger-scale mission architecture planning). It also gives more opportunities for the devs to challenge us in different ways on each world (put resource-rich areas only near the poles of one planet, or have one planet with propellium at the equator and oxium at the poles, Duna and Ike have complementary sets of resources, requiring you to develop a method of transporting material between them, etc.).

Multiplayer adds... what exactly? Docking is a one-player operation. Two players trying to actively dock with one another would be annoying, so what will usually happen is one player will just point at the other and hold his craft still while the other docks. That is exactly zero percent fun for one player and exactly the same amount of fun as solo mode would be for the other player. You can do things like build a space station together... which you can already do by sharing save files. You can race each other to the Mun... which you can do by just setting your laptops on the same table, or calling each other on speakerphone. You can fight each other... but KSP isn't a war game, and the devs don't want it to be a war game! I just fail to see much reason you would want to add multiplayer to this game that can't be done already. The best I can come up with is that you could simulate a Falcon 9 or White Knight/Spaceship 1 reusable mission where one of you flies the first stage back to the launch pad while the other flies the second stage into orbit. But then part of the excuse given by Harv during the interview as to why resources weren't fun was that they required you to master the game to use them. I feel like being able to design and use a reusable, multi-stage launch vehicle comes pretty close to being a master of KSP. And yes, at the far end, resource utilization in some ways can be as difficult to make use of, but there are many simple applications that most people could simply bolt on to their missions (Say, attach a processor and drill to your Mun lander to refuel your ship after landing).

If resources are complicated, then why are we adding parts specifically designed for space planes? It doesn't get much more complicated than balancing the CoL, CoM, and CoT in a space plane and also trying to find places for all the parts and remembering that the weight will shift around during flight. It's certainly more complicated than "you need a drill and a processor and an extra tank to mine resources".

I fail to see a single reason why multiplayer makes sense but resources do not.

I'd like to say that I'm not trying to be rude or angry, I'm just honestly pointing out how

[cesarcurado]

The following is my opinion. I do not even pretend to suggest that I'm right and others are wrong.

[...] You can fight each other... but KSP isn't a war game, and the devs don't want it to be a war game! I just fail to see much reason you would want to add multiplayer to this game that can't be done already. [...]

Oh, sorry for this but...

This isn't a mining game either.

And seems the devs don't want it to be one...

There is difference between turn-based save share galore and real time gameplay.

[I_Killed_Jeb]

I think if they could make planetary science better, more fun and more interactive and conducive to cool creations then resources is not as important

[Pleborian]

As much as the idea of multiplayer excites me (and is possibly one of the biggest features im looking forward to), I wouldnt mind a resource system first. I mean chances are we will actually see them before multiplayer simply because MP is a feature that is gonna be developed AFTER the game is complete which if im not mistaken means after resources, I could be wrong and whatever direction the devs approch it from is fine with me

[Mistake Not…]

Completely ignoring the relative merits of different gameplay systems, something with as large an impact on the game's overall technical design as multiplayer should be implemented as soon as possible.

Building new gameplay mechanics (such as resource collection) on top of an existing, working singleplayer / multiplayer framework would be way easier than shoehorning multiplayer systems into yet larger amounts of gameplay code designed from a singleplayer-only perspective.

So, while personally I'm not interested in multiplayer, it makes perfect sense for Squad to work on it sooner rather than later.

[The Destroyer]

It should have a "both" option.

Resources. Cool, that be nice and add more realism. I always add kethane, but I never use it....

MP Would be very fun wiht friends- but probably not on a "Public" server. Greifing to a whole new level....