[WIP] MSI's Infernal Robotics - Model Rework (v02 Pre-Release Beta)

[Devo]

It's currently hardcoded anyway. I honestly didn't want to deal with parts falling apart when things were moving too fast. Before 0.23.5 release if you had a rotatron that spun too fast, it would fall apart, now it wiggles really wild and crazy but it stays attached. I prefer it this way.:

Any idea how I can combat my current issue ?

I have a ship im building, it has some RCS on the roof of the pod. The pod is attached via a rotatron to the main body.

On IR v0.15 or the previous, the parts never snapped off in the new KSP even at 100 rotation speed. The RCS never wobbled or jittered the joint.

The new version of IR, the joints now have a wobbling issue, when RCS is applied it makes the joint unstable that throws the balance of the entire craft off... is there anyway I can retain the old rigidity and use the new version?

The older version was/is working for me perfectly, so it's not a ship breaker for me, but I obviously can't release with this version of IR, and can't release with the old version so im in limbo right now. :/

Edited June 18, 2014 by Devo

[Master Tao]

Any idea how I can combat my current issue ?

I recommend reusable struts such as Quantum Struts. ZodiusInfuser is also planning similar struts for the IR rework, but hasn't released them.

[Camacha]

It's currently hardcoded anyway. I honestly didn't want to deal with parts falling apart when things were moving too fast. Before 0.23.5 release if you had a rotatron that spun too fast, it would fall apart, now it wiggles really wild and crazy but it stays attached.

I fully understand, just a suggestion for the distant future maybe

[Devo]

I recommend reusable struts such as Quantum Struts. ZodiusInfuser is also planning similar struts for the IR rework, but hasn't released them.

I can't use struts, the part needs to rotate freely, and right now it's borken for me if you only knew how much of a knife this new version just put in my side, it's killing me.

[sirkut]

I think it's something to do with TweakScale adjusting a value. I will need to do some testing to find

Out what it is.

[ZodiusInfuser]

On IR v0.15 or the previous, the parts never snapped off in the new KSP even at 100 rotation speed. The RCS never wobbled or jittered the joint.

I too have noticed jitter with my new translational parts when extended, however I wasn't sure if that was just how I modelled them.

[sirkut]

Only thing I've noticed that needs to be fixed is the scaling of the mass. Other than that I don't know what the issue could be.

[erbmur]

Could somebody explain the difference between then extendatron basic and the extendatron stackable?

[sirkut]

Could somebody explain the difference between then extendatron basic and the extendatron stackable?

It's generally best to experiment with all parts but I will tell you. Basic means it has 2 attach nodes, one at top and one at the very bottom of the part. Imagine it as a solid cylinder. The stackable has 2 attach nodes but one is directly underneath the top attach node. This allows you to attach things inside each other. here's a video demonstrating this very concept. The first used is the basic, then the rest are stackable. You'll get the meaning.

[ZodiusInfuser]

It's generally best to experiment with all parts but I will tell you. Basic means it has 2 attach nodes, one at top and one at the very bottom of the part. Imagine it as a solid cylinder. The stackable has 2 attach nodes but one is directly underneath the top attach node. This allows you to attach things inside each other. here's a video demonstrating this very concept. The first used is the basic, then the rest are stackable. You'll get the meaning.

Also note that the stackable ones have 9 scales allowing you to make them look nicer when forming a telescopic piston.

[erbmur]

It's generally best to experiment with all parts but I will tell you. Basic means it has 2 attach nodes, one at top and one at the very bottom of the part. Imagine it as a solid cylinder. The stackable has 2 attach nodes but one is directly underneath the top attach node. This allows you to attach things inside each other. here's a video demonstrating this very concept. The first used is the basic, then the rest are stackable. You'll get the meaning.

You legend!!!!

[Kanddak]

Also note that the stackable ones have 9 scales allowing you to make them look nicer when forming a telescopic piston.

I have just freshly reinstalled IR 0.16 and these parts (taking care to remove old versions of TweakScale), and I only have 5 possible scales, numbered 0, 1, 2, 3, 4.

The translation limits are not scaled along with the parts. This screenshot shows all five scales completely extended: https://i.imgur.com/8Gp6vzJ.png

The same is true for the basic extendatron: https://i.imgur.com/mbKD9AP.png

The right-angle extendatron exhibits more complicated behavior: Scale 1 works correctly and scale 0 fails to scale the limits in a similar fashion to the other two extendatrons, but scales 2 and 3 seem to do nothing at all and scale 4 appears to rotate slightly. https://i.imgur.com/0LDE0E7.png

[sirkut]

Did you place all these parts in its own directory inside the magic smoke parts folder?

[Kanddak]

Yes, the directory structure is as prescribed in the download: https://i.imgur.com/UG0wsUH.png

I have, however, removed the legacy parts.

[Sparker]

This may end up tieing into my plans for foldeable wings.

So you've got an Idea how to make these wing benders?

[ZodiusInfuser]

Yes, the directory structure is as prescribed in the download: https://i.imgur.com/UG0wsUH.png

I have, however, removed the legacy parts.

Um, that's exactly how it should be and how it is on my install (I too only have the TweakScale that comes with IR now). Also the scales you show are not correct (far too big). Can you confirm that Rework_TweakScale has a IR_TelescopicRobotic entry in it, and that there are nine sets of values? If that's there and the part references it (which it should) then I'm not sure what is happening. Could you try the Legacy telescopic parts and see if it occurs with them too? You shouldn't need them for the parts to work (although I've never tried without so don't know).

[Kanddak]

Rework_TweakScale.cfg does indeed contain IR_TelescopicRobotic with 9 values, and part.cfg for the stackable extendatron refers to it with 9 separate translateMax values.

Edit for update:

With the legacy telescopic pistons, I have the same five scale options, with scales 0 and 2 exhibiting the same "translateMax not being scaled" effect, scale 3 undergoing a slight rotation, and scale 4 doing nothing.

The legacy hydraulic cylinders simply don't scale translateMax at all scales.

I am going to temporarily remove all other mods and see if the effect persists.

Edit 2: With all other mods removed, the stackable extendatrons now have all 9 scales, all scales work properly, robotics parts' scales now have names and not just numbers. Will be trying to isolate the conflict.

Edited June 19, 2014 by Kanddak

[sirkut]

Rework_TweakScale.cfg does indeed contain IR_TelescopicRobotic with 9 values, and part.cfg for the stackable extendatron refers to it with 9 separate translateMax values.

Edit for update:

With the legacy telescopic pistons, I have the same five scale options, with scales 0 and 2 exhibiting the same "translateMax not being scaled" effect, scale 3 undergoing a slight rotation, and scale 4 doing nothing.

The legacy hydraulic cylinders simply don't scale translateMax at all scales.

I am going to temporarily remove all other mods and see if the effect persists.

Do you have Goodspeed tweakparts installed?

[Kanddak]

Do you have Goodspeed tweakparts installed?

I wouldn't have thought so but apparently yes; I had a Goodspeed directory (containing Scale.dll) which I didn't remember was related to TweakScale when removing old versions. Its replacement in my GameData folder made the problem reappear. After removing it, replacing all other mods I was using caused no problems.

Thank you both for the prompt attention to what turned out to be my own fault.

[sirkut]

I wouldn't have thought so but apparently yes; I had a Goodspeed directory (containing Scale.dll) which I didn't remember was related to TweakScale when removing old versions. Its replacement in my GameData folder made the problem reappear. After removing it, replacing all other mods I was using caused no problems.

Thank you both for the prompt attention to what turned out to be my own fault.

BOOM! Thank you very much.

[ZodiusInfuser]

For those eagerly awaiting Foldatrons (which I intended to finish before starting Extendatrons), I'm afraid you'll have to wait a fair bit longer. Like with the original rework lineup there's a lot of dependencies between the parts meaning that I'm having to think of certain design decisions now rather than later when I originally planned. I want it to be possible to make a full Athlete with my athlete-inspired parts, and it isn't at the moment...

Basically, I need to make some wheels (or at least finalise their dimensions so the foldatrons will work with them once created)

Now, that being said, I have 5 foldatron parts that aren't dependent on wheels being a thing so I may try and finish them up. No promises though as there may be things I need to alter based on changes brought on by the wheels. Also, I have no clue how to make wheels, so this could be a long process

Thanks

Edited June 19, 2014 by ZodiusInfuser

[Albert VDS]

Woo, wheels!

Those foldatrons are really well thought out, the shape I mean.

[ZodiusInfuser]

Woo, wheels!

Those foldatrons are really well thought out, the shape I mean.

Yea, they're kind of a pain . I want the shape to conform around the wheels, yet without wheels I can only guess at the final required volume, which ultimately would mean having to redo the parts further down the line. Other tools (e.g. gripper, sample collector etc) would have to abide by this volume but I think that's an acceptable compromise.

Edited June 19, 2014 by ZodiusInfuser

[BigD145]

I eagerly await QWOP in KSP.

[Sentmassen]

JOIN THE DARK SIDE!

I made a dark grey version of the texture if anyone is interested.

Download: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/15214821/IRdark.zip

Throw both TGA files in all the part folders (i.e. MagicSmokeIndustries\Parts\Rework\Robotic_Probe*******\IR_****** folders)

Edited June 20, 2014 by Sentmassen