Kerbal Construction Time/StageRecovery Dev Thread

[magico13]

Uploaded PR6b. Lots of internal changes for only a few external ones. This took something like 20 commits on github and quite a bit of testing (thank you JeffreyCor for putting up with so many broken builds). I'm short on time, so here is a brief list of the changes:

Game Changing The default build rate was reduced to 0.1BP/s in both buildings. You are given 15 extra upgrades automatically instead. This is still much lower than before (it would take 38 upgrades to reach a 1BP/s rate in both buildings). If you didn't delete the settings file, you will want to change the number of upgrades given to sandbox games to 45, the new default.

-You can edit ships that are in progress or already completed in case you forgot to add a part or need to take one off. The amount of progress made on the ship is reduced by 1.1 times the difference in BP.

-Scrapping partially completed ships adds parts to the inventory, meaning that time isn't totally wasted.

-Added a window at new game start (will popup for everyone this update).

-Fixed a bunch of issues with the crew selection gui.

Please take a look at the changelog, it gives a better list of changes than this one.

I won't really be available for questions too much today or tomorrow, but ask away and I'll try to respond when I can.

Sidenote to JeffreyCor: You'll notice that you also get 15 upgrades at game start despite getting them already. I just changed the name of the controlling variable for that so you'll have to reduce the number by 15 in the persistence. Just search for "TotalUpgradePoints =" with a text editor.

[Floppster]

Woo, update!

I was actually going to ask about extending the build time, but my idea was through build points, retaining the science reward.

Still, I have one idea you might want to consider: A ship list. Right now the only way to add a craft to the build list is by going through the VAB/SPH, loading up the craft and pressing build. (Assuming I'm not an idiot and have missed a feature completely.) Why not have a list of crafts already saved, like the one you get at the launchpad/runway, where you simply select a craft and it gets added to the build list?

This idea is mainly coming from some of my mods' parts taking forever to load, but it's an idea either way.

[magico13]

Why not have a list of crafts already saved, like the one you get at the launchpad/runway, where you simply select a craft and it gets added to the build list?

Something like this was once suggested, perhaps by you (I don't recall), because they kept going to the launch pad to build ships but that just simulates. I have it written in my list of ideas to create a window where you can see a list of saved craft and either build or simulate them from there. Ideally it would appear instead of the default window that pops up when you click on the launch pad or runway. Maybe I'll try to get this working for the next update. I also want to try to add a Kerbal time requirement, for Kalista, but I want to try to implement that as a separate mod that KCT integrates with. I have no idea how to do that, which is partly the reason I want to do it that way

[SpacedInvader]

Kerbal time requirement?

[FennexFox]

I think I have a trouble with your latest update.

* Simulation worked weird: it doesn`t calculate time spent on simulation.

* Simulation revert didn`t work: Revert button doesn`t work.

After them, I re-installed this mod and now I can not get into my VAB.

Edit: It`s KCT simulation backup file that makes problem. I delete that and everything works fine.

Edited July 4, 2014 by FennexFox

[magico13]

I'll need a bit more information than that. As for the first part, are you saying the time left for simulation never decreased? It only starts counting once you launch, and occasionally KSP doesn't actually set off the OnLaunch event so it never starts.

Reverting the simulation can be done using the revert buttons or anything else that exits flight because all it does is backup the persistence file (it literally just copies it) and then it copies it back when you exit the flight scene. If the save failed to work properly then that could explain why you wouldn't be able to revert or get into the VAB (Or any other building for that manner). Has the problem stopped happening? If it happens again could you please get me a copy of the output_log.txt from the KSP_Data folder? That's where all the errors and other information is output.

Kerbal time requirement?

Just like tech nodes and ships, I plan on adding a requirement for hiring Kerbals taking time before you can use them, representing training. Perhaps also requiring down-time between launches before you can reuse a Kerbal. I plan on doing this as a separate mod that KCT interfaces with, so I can learn how to do that and also so people can use it even if they don't want to use KCT. It's a secondary priority to KCT, and I won't be able to start work on it for at least a week. I'm thinking of having it take a few days to train them, with a rate dependent on their stupidity (less stupidity means a faster rate), with a special rate for Kerbals with the badS trait (like Jeb). I like the idea of having different stages/classes of training (as a purely visual thing) that they go through (which would be somewhat silly but reasonable), like "Lithobraking 101". I am definitely open to ideas for either classes the Kerbals would take or things they would do in training (like Centrifuge G Training, Eating Lunch through a Tube, Taking Final Exam, etc).

Edited July 4, 2014 by magico13

[JeffreyCor]

Once stupidity actually matters, apart from in some mods as currently, maybe having stupidity go down and/or courage go up with training as a representation of becoming more skilled and better conditioned and accustomed to certain situations. This possibly could be extended as well to adjusting by going on more missions so they get better as they do more. It would make for a good balance between along with requiring downtime between missions.

[Taki117]

So, I'm having an issue where I can't load any vessels. I can build and save them, and even simulate them, but whenever I click the folder in the VAB to load a ship nothing happens and a Null reference Exception is generated.

Output Log

[magico13]

So, I'm having an issue where I can't load any vessels. I can build and save them, and even simulate them, but whenever I click the folder in the VAB to load a ship nothing happens and a Null reference Exception is generated.

The null reference mentions mechjeb, but it appears as if it has to do with a specific ship (Microwave Power Station). I would suggest removing that craft file from the folder and trying again. It appears to be missing the part FalconRadialDecoupler. My guess is that's the issue, but no promises. TAC life support has some errors in the spacecenter, but those generally aren't serious. In the main menu scene there's a bunch of output saying that the SaveGameFixer thing ran and removed a bunch of parts. I haven't seen that before. In the save Wolf Aerospace it says that FalconRadialDecoupler has been deleted in the craft file Microwave Power Station.craft. Thermo Test.craft will likely have the same issue (missing Ember pit) and so will Untitled Space Craft.craft (parts LLLWeight5t and B9X.dropTank.Large are missing). SaveGameFixer is apparently part of ModuleManager. Not sure why that happened. Did you update other mods too?

[Taki117]

The null reference mentions mechjeb, but it appears as if it has to do with a specific ship (Microwave Power Station). I would suggest removing that craft file from the folder and trying again. It appears to be missing the part FalconRadialDecoupler. My guess is that's the issue, but no promises. TAC life support has some errors in the spacecenter, but those generally aren't serious. In the main menu scene there's a bunch of output saying that the SaveGameFixer thing ran and removed a bunch of parts. I haven't seen that before. In the save Wolf Aerospace it says that FalconRadialDecoupler has been deleted in the craft file Microwave Power Station.craft. Thermo Test.craft will likely have the same issue (missing Ember pit) and so will Untitled Space Craft.craft (parts LLLWeight5t and B9X.dropTank.Large are missing). SaveGameFixer is apparently part of ModuleManager. Not sure why that happened. Did you update other mods too?

Just Laztek's Historical pack, and I don't know why my Microwave power station would have a missing part since I currently have 4 in orbit. I know about the LLL and B9X droptanks. (They were mods that I had, and then got rid of) so I don't use those craft anymore. What's odd is that those craft aren't even in the ships folder anymore. But I will delete the .craft for my Microwave power station (Even though it still works) and see if that helps things.

EDIT: EUREKA! I think I know why it's happening. Thank you for taking a look. The FalconRadialDecoupler was part of the Laztek Dragon Pod Falcon 9 lifter, which got deleted when I updated the historical pack. I have things to test...will report back.

Edited July 5, 2014 by Taki117

[magico13]

I'm not positive that that's the problem, but the part being missing is mentioned right before the first NullReference I see in the editor, then is mentioned afterward, then there's a bunch more NullReferences.

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at ShipTemplate.SetIfControllable () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at ShipTemplate.LoadShip (.ConfigNode root) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at CraftBrowser+..ctor (System.IO.FileInfo ) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at CraftBrowser.buildCraftList () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at CraftBrowser..ctor (Rect rect, System.String subFolder, System.String profile, System.String title, .SelectedCallback onFileSelected, .CancelledCallback onCancel, UnityEngine.GUISkin guiSkin, UnityEngine.Texture2D fileIcon, Boolean showFlagButton) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at EditorLogic.loadShip () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

[ShipConstruct]: Trying to load Microwave Power Station - No AvailablePart found for FalconRadialDecoupler

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at ShipTemplate.SetIfControllable () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at ShipTemplate.LoadShip (.ConfigNode root) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at CraftBrowser+..ctor (System.IO.FileInfo ) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at CraftBrowser.buildCraftList () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at CraftBrowser..ctor (Rect rect, System.String subFolder, System.String profile, System.String title, .SelectedCallback onFileSelected, .CancelledCallback onCancel, UnityEngine.GUISkin guiSkin, UnityEngine.Texture2D fileIcon, Boolean showFlagButton) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at EditorLogic.loadShip () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at CactEyeTelescope.TelescopeGuidance.OnDestroy () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at EditorLogic.recurseShipList (.Part part, System.Collections.Generic.List`1 shipList) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at EditorLogic.getSortedShipList () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at EditorLogic.get_SortedShipList () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at MuMech.VesselExtensions.GetModules[MechJebCore] (.Vessel vessel) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at MuMech.VesselExtensions.GetMasterMechJeb (.Vessel vessel) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at MuMech.MechJebCore.OnDestroy () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 

[Taki117]

I'm not positive that that's the problem, but the part being missing is mentioned right before the first NullReference I see in the editor, then is mentioned afterward, then there's a bunch more NullReferences.

Fixed it! Turns out one of the craft iles had gotten corrupted (No idea how) so deleting all but what I was currently working on fixed it. My first Manned Interplanetary Mission is now well on its way!

[magico13]

Fixed it! Turns out one of the craft iles had gotten corrupted (No idea how) so deleting all but what I was currently working on fixed it. My first Manned Interplanetary Mission is now well on its way!

Glad to hear! Fixing that problem was a lot easier for me than fixing problems actually related to KCT, those ones seem to elude me

[Taki117]

Glad to hear! Fixing that problem was a lot easier for me than fixing problems actually related to KCT, those ones seem to elude me

Well the good news is KCT isn't having any issues at all. So keep up the good work!

[Floppster]

About the training time and more specifically about a kerbals stats changing during training, IMHO courage shouldn't really go up from training, but from actual flights instead. Stupidity though, would lower with training. My $0.02.

[JeffreyCor]

I can see that, but I would imagine some improvement in training, but surely not nearly as much as would be gained from actual missions. I would imagine training would also consist of simulations so that reactions would become automatic rather than freaking out, which I envision being related to the broad "courage" stat since at least at present there are only the 2.

[Tigorath]

I cannot say how much I fully appreciate and endorse this mod. This is what Kerbal should be aspiring to.

It makes you plan on how you construct your rockets in the way of trying to keep the parts you build for a later date.

For me this is definitely one of the top five essential mods if you wish to immerse yourself into blowing yourse.... I mean sending rockets into space.

[magico13]

This is just a friendly reminder that when 0.24 comes out I will need some time to update. I do not expect the current version to be functional (in fact, I know it won't function properly with currency), so please do not report any bugs with 6b and 0.24. When the new release comes out, then you can start reporting bugs. So far the only update I've gone through was 0.23 to 0.23.5 (which was a fairly minor update) so it may take some time for me to figure everything out. Thank you for your cooperation! (BTW, I don't know when 0.24 is coming out, but it seems like it's soon. Unfortunately I'm not on the experimentals team so I haven't gotten to update KCT prior to the official release)

Also, I've started work on the Kerbal hiring mod, which I have called Flight School. So far it doesn't do anything since I'm just building the framework (I was lucky enough to not have to do that for KCT, as Ekku Zakku did that.) It's too early to really discuss any specifics, mostly because there currently are none. I'm doing the development using GitHub from the start, so you can check that out if you want to follow the early development (until I release it on the forum).

[tmikesecrist3]

I do have a question... How does this mod play with RSS/RO? I really like the idea... and another thought What about time to Recycle the Launch pad? Because I know that is part of what limits launches

[magico13]

I do have a question... How does this mod play with RSS/RO? I really like the idea... and another thought What about time to Recycle the Launch pad? Because I know that is part of what limits launches

I have not played with RSS so I don't know how well they work together directly, but I believe other people play with RSS and this without issue. The only place I can imagine there being problems is if the altitude where debris gets destroyed is higher than 35km, because KCT is currently set to only care about debris that gets destroyed at less than 35 km.

Do you mean limiting time between launches (for reconditioning the launchpad)? I'll consider it, but waiting for the ships themselves to build is already a big hassle. Does anyone else have an opinion about this? Perhaps as an additional feature that can be disabled? There's a fine line between realism and annoyance that means I'm willing to eschew realism for gameplay. I don't know if that would be too annoying, but it makes sense from a realism POV.

[tmikesecrist3]

Well I it takes like a week or two, and if you already have a stock of Rockets built. but if you have to build the rocket any way, I dont think any one would notice the time needed to recondition the Launchpad. There is no reason why the work on the rocket can't be done at the same time, I can see why some people might not want that. so maybe make that an option. kind of like they do with Respon in Tac life support

[Kalista]

Well if you need another bug checker to make sure flight school and .24 are bug free for the main release I'm willing to beta test it.

[magico13]

Just letting you guys know that I've got a compatibility update in testing right now for 0.24. There are a few persistent bugs that I want to try to fix that 0.24 added, one of which has completely disabled the editing ability (which is annoying since I just got that working last version), so I may have to release without editing and then add it back in when I can get it working again. There's no new features really, except that dropped stages have some of their cost refunded (currently set to 75% of what you would get if it were landed at that location, so a max of about 75% at KSC and 7.5% on the other side of Kerbin). Hopefully I'll be able to get the release out tomorrow (Friday) but no promises.

[guto8797]

Ei magico! Take your time updating, but i have a suggestion for a separate mod: if you watch Scott manley's video you see a major issue with part recovery, they must have a probe and must not get 2.5 km away from you. Whaddabout using your para chute detection code so we could retrieve spent stages? Keep awesome!

[magico13]

Whaddabout using your para chute detection code so we could retrieve spent stages?

This will be in the 0.24 update of KCT, recovery of funds from spent stages at a reduced value. But I also made it into it's own mod which is available for use now. And KCT will be compatible with it so you can run them side by side without issue (in fact, I'm not going to make KCT's recovery value configurable since StageRecovery's already is)

Forum thread for StageRecovery