Project Thoth - a manned lunar return.

[MattJL]

So, I've had this idea. It's nothing new - I've been working on it since April of 2009 - but a series of events (a very long story) has led to me going public with it in several different places.

I'm currently working with three people from around the world to help put together what I'd like to call Project Thoth. The goal is simple: Put a man on the moon and bring him safely back to the Earth. The big catch, though, is that it'd be the product of non-governmental work and use largely existing architecture (namely Soyuz, Proton, Atlas V Heavy, Centaur, and Fregat-SB. Possibly Dragon, Falcon Heavy, and Falcon 9, too). Only the lander would need to be developed. I've been carving out the plan with an associate from France (who I will not name at the moment, because I'd like to ensure that I have his approval in naming him in general). To be completely honest, he's done almost all of the work. I'm just the spokesperson. It looks something like this:

+ Launch 1: Crew to ISS. Either Soyuz or Dragon could pull this off - likely Dragon, as Soyuz will be involved later. The crew will wait at the ISS for the rest of the spacecraft to be assembled in low Earth orbit.

+ Launch 2: Soyuz/Fregat-SB to ISS, unmanned. Proton is the go-to launch vehicle for this one. This will serve as the command module for the lunar expedition, and I have christened it "Phoenix" (or äõýøúÑÂ, if you want to go with the Russian name). It will hang out at the ISS and wait for launch number 4.

+Launch 3: Lunar module/LOI stage/Centaur tug to trans-lunar injection, unmanned. Atlas V Heavy is likely the launch vehicle to go with for this launch, as it is the heaviest-lift launch vehicle that is closest to operational status. The lunar module, the only new hardware in the plan, will be named "Taiga" (âðùóð). It will wait in low Lunar orbit in a 27 degree frozen orbit for Phoenix.

+Launch 4: KTVK/docking hardware, unmanned. Second Proton launch. The space tug for Phoenix.

Almost immediately after launch 4 is confirmed to be in a stable orbit, the three Thoth astronauts/cosmonauts will board Phoenix, power it up, and undock from the ISS. Phoenix will then dock to the KTVK, which will burn for the Moon.

Phoenix, after LOI, would then rendezvous and dock with Taiga. Taiga would be powered up in preparation for landing. The surface stay would last for about thirty-six hours, including a four-hour EVA, and then the ascent stage would launch to rendezvous and dock with Phoenix. TEI would occur twelve hours after discarding Taiga's ascent stage.

Landing would take place in Kazakhstan. A standard mission, taking into account the ISS stay, would last about two months.

So that's my big plan. How does it sound? Anyone have anything to contribute?

[rpayne88]

Two problems:

1. Funding. This is going to cost millions, if not, billions of USD. That is going to be the hardest problem to solve without serious backing by major companies (Google, Amazon, ect.)

2. Would the various world governments allow you to use the ISS? You are going to have crew at the ISS for more than a month. They may not let you use the ISS's life support for that long.

other then that, go for it.

[MattJL]

Two problems:

1. Funding. This is going to cost millions, if not, billions of USD. That is going to be the hardest problem to solve without serious backing by major companies (Google, Amazon, ect.)

2. Would the various world governments allow you to use the ISS? You are going to have crew at the ISS for more than a month. They may not let you use the ISS's life support for that long.

other then that, go for it.

Outside of backing by companies, there's ~3,000 kg of mass to work with aboard the Proton that launches Phoenix to the ISS. That's enough for a decent sized satellite (or several thousand CubeSats) and thus acts as another source of funding. There's also a small amount of room aboard Taiga for an experiments package (think ALSEP) that could be deployed on the Moon.

Total cost is projected to be $426.5 million, so on paper, the launch could be paid for by charging $143,333 per kilogram of additional payload. This is just over twice the cost for a standard CubeSat. Frankly, I don't feel that 144k is an unfair cost for universities/countries around the world.

ISS usage could probably be fiddled with through the Russians, as Phoenix would technically be a Russian spacecraft.

[rpayne88]

It seems like you've accomplished more in four hours than NASA has in 45 years.

[DonLorenzo]

Some points I'm wondering about

-Charging double doesn't usually give you much clientele, unless I'm missing something? Why would people piggyback their cargo on your rockets if it costs twice the rate of the competition? If it's to support the lunar endeavour, they might as well just hand over the cash

-Why launch the crew first? Launching them last would minimize life support requirements and could possibly remove the ISS from the picture which seems like a huge wildcard to me?

-So this idea is now five years in the making, is there more to it than the selection of 4 launch platforms and their payload capacities?

-Is your projected cost just launch costs or does it include mission control/support/training/operations and not to mention R&D for the lunar lander?

[DonLorenzo]

Also, your signature is very unfortunate under the OP

[Red Iron Crown]

*snip* Total cost is projected to be $426.5 million *snip*

Can you share how you arrived at this figure?

[Red Iron Crown]

It seems like you've accomplished more in four hours than NASA has in 45 years.

What?! NASA has had tons of projects that only existed on paper in the last 45 years!