Is "multiple claws on the same asteroid-ship couple" possible ?

[Minarkhaios]

That is something I didn't see in any of the 0.23.5 videos, and I'm wondering why.

When I think of pushing/pulling huge asteroids, I always imagine using a tripod with three claws.

And more as anchor to my big badass asteroid station.

So why do they all uses only one claw ?

- Is it because I did not see the one video that do have this kind of apparatus ?

- Is it because it's not possible to multiple claws an asteroid with the same ship ?

We can do it (hardly) with multiple docking port, so it should be possible, right ?

With the pivot it should be easier to catch the asteroid with the others claws when the first one is fixed, no ?. But that is only if it is possible to do so.

- Is it because I'm so clever that I'm the only one with this idea (Yeah. Right. Keep dreaming. All should be fine. Take your frog's pill and be a good boy).

In conclusion, if it's possible, it's great. And if not, this post should be turned into a suggestion to make it.

[MKI]

I am almost sure you can dock multiple to the asteroid with a single ship. Maybe we haven't seen it because there may be a bug with it (theres a lot of bugs this patch) or no one has really just tried it yet and showed us.

I have seen multiple ships attached to the asteroid, so i see no reason a single ship can dock multiple times to it either.

But maybe there's hidden issues about it that we do not know about that keeps people from using more than one from a single ship.

[ibeinsane]

If you could attach 3 claws onto a single asteroid (I have no idea if you can) using the tripod then you would lose the ability to use the pivot on the claw. A tripod of claws each with the free pivot activated would not produce a pivot to the ship.

[Minarkhaios]

If you could attach 3 claws onto a single asteroid (I have no idea if you can) using the tripod then you would lose the ability to use the pivot on the claw. A tripod of claws each with the free pivot activated would not produce a pivot to the ship.

Indeed, but I was more on the line of creating a huge anchor for a station. Thus the need to pivot should be lower.

And I imagine that even with a tripod, the three pivots would still be able to move a little and create some sort of "dancing station" effect. Which sill be great with the new colours.

[Kasuha]

I think we have to wait till it is released and try it out.

My guess is it will not be possible. The first claw to activate will make the asteroid part of the ship, and for the rest the asteroid will become as immaterial as any other part of their own ship.

[Minarkhaios]

... The first claw to activate will make the asteroid part of the ship, and for the rest the asteroid will become as immaterial as any other part of their own ship.

That's what I'm afraid of.

But there is hope is the fact that the pivot exist. Contrary to the 'docking port' scenario, where everything to unmovable, we will be able to put the other claws in contact with the asteroid.

And as I said, this is half discussion, half suggestion.

[Dodgey]

Kasuha, you can use multiple docking ports on a single ship, example, 4 docking ports, two on each ship. And I do know that parts on actuators in the Infernal Robotics mod physically interact with the same ship in certain cases.

[Kasuha]

Kasuha, you can use multiple docking ports on a single ship, example, 4 docking ports, two on each ship. And I do know that parts on actuators in the Infernal Robotics mod physically interact with the same ship in certain cases.

It's just my guess, I don't know anything for sure. But checking proximity to surface of any part in the scene is order of magnitude more work than checking proximity to usually quite small number of active docking ports. So my guess is the Claw reacts to collision event from physics engine. And if it is true, then no collision means no clawing.

You _might_ be able to attach more than one claw even in such conditions if you manage to hit the asteroid with them in the same frame. But really, we need to try that. Or make somebody try.

Even if it works this way, though, you can always have several modules and claw them separately after decoupling them from your ship. If they all have an engine, you can steer the asteroid by tweaking thrust of individual engines.

[Dodgey]

Only one way to find out. But anyway that would be a sight to behold, 3 mainsails strapped to the back of an asteroid blasting it through the solar system. Can we get Danny on the right a way please management?

[Minarkhaios]

... If they all have an engine, you can steer the asteroid by tweaking thrust of individual engines.

Why do fine tweaking when you can assign different action group to them and steer at full power (yeah ! go to hell fuel efficiency !).

But it still don't solve the problem to "how fix the bumper" on the asteroid. (Is bumper the right word ? I mean the part that is in front of the car, to push the slower cars and hit the grannies on the road)

[Red Iron Crown]

If you were precise enough, I think you could avoid the issues Kasuha raises by attaching several clamps with regular docking ports on the opposite side of them to the asteroid, then attaching those clamps to a mothership with multiple docking ports. Alignment would be very tricky, though the flexibility of the claw would help.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Red Iron Crown

[Kasuha]

Why do fine tweaking when you can assign different action group to them and steer at full power (yeah ! go to hell fuel efficiency !).

Easier control, but less thrust.

But it still don't solve the problem to "how fix the bumper" on the asteroid. (Is bumper the right word ? I mean the part that is in front of the car, to push the slower cars and hit the grannies on the road)

The idea is that you don't need to have a bumper.

[Kasuha]

raises by attaching several clamps with regular docking ports on the opposite side of them to the asteroid, then attaching those clamps to a mothership with multiple docking ports.

Unnecessarily complicated. When you claw them to the asteroid they are already parts of your ship, no more docking needed.

[Red Iron Crown]

Unnecessarily complicated. When you claw them to the asteroid they are already parts of your ship, no more docking needed.

I agree, but it is a workaround to attach a single craft to an asteroid by more than one claw as the OP asks. Assuming the claw works like you suspect, which seems reasonable.

[Kasuha]

Hmmmm... actually yes, that might be a reliable way to attach second and probably even third claw.

Imagine you have three claws on arms connected to the ship by docking ports. You attach one claw, then change your orientation so the second claw just touches the surface and undock the arm. Magnetism between docking ports will cease because they just undocked, but the claw will immediately get touch with surface because it is a different ship. So it will attach. At that moment, docking ports will remagnetize and stick together.

And then you can do the same with the third claw.

[Wahgineer]

I heard someone say that we would be able to attach multiple claws to the same thing.

[KN_Namida]

Reading through this thread some hours ago made me think...

If Kasuha is correct, attaching more claws of a single ship to an asteroid will be trickier than I firstly thought. My initial idea, regarding the construction of a space station on the side of the space boulder, was to attach an "anchor" of triangular shape, using 3 Probobodyne HECS units connected by girders, and each HECS having a claw beneath it, all of the claws with their pivot in free mode. One claw would attach first, then the second one and then the third one, if you were able to attach more claws from the same ship at roughly the same time. It works with docking ports, but this could be different.

There's always the possibility that, once a claw attaches, the vessel can't attach more claws to the asteroid, in which case... Some solutions come to mind, like using claws attached to the ship only by docking ports, and let them attach to the asteroid by themselvesbefore re-attaching your ship to them. That's a possibility.

On a side note, while thinking about this the vision of connecting more tiny vessels with claws, thus creating a proper chain (if you free the pivots) came to mind. I'll have to try that as soon as we get this update

[Minarkhaios]

.. Some solutions come to mind, like using claws attached to the ship only by docking ports, and let them attach to the asteroid by themselvesbefore re-attaching your ship to them. That's a possibility....

That also might not work.

The docking port will not attach because as it is also on the same ship (dock => claw 2 => asteroid => claw 1 => ship => second docking port).

It would also force us to add controller on the claw part (I might be wrong, but it's not possible for an uncontrolled dock to attach to another uncontrolled dock)

[KN_Namida]

That also might not work.

The docking port will not attach because as it is also on the same ship (dock => claw 2 => asteroid => claw 1 => ship => second docking port).

I didn't thought of this, you might be right. Or, to be more correct, I didn't know that 2 parts of the same ship could not connect together via docking ports... I'll have to think of a solution.

It would also force us to add controller on the claw part (I might be wrong, but it's not possible for an uncontrolled dock to attach to another uncontrolled dock)

And I might have just found one: instead of ejecting a claw + docking port towards the asteroid and then dock to it, we could have a claw + tiny probe + docking port module, practically a separate vessel, attach to the asteroid and then your main ship connects to it.

Anyway, we're still speculating on features not even implemented officially yet. Once the update comes, I'll test all I can to find out the capabilities and limits of the claws. We should have a thread about that too, once the time comes...

[Kasuha]

That also might not work.

The docking port will not attach because as it is also on the same ship (dock => claw 2 => asteroid => claw 1 => ship => second docking port).

Docking a ship to itself is proven to work.

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[Red Iron Crown]

Thinking about this a bit more, I don't think alignment will be as hard as I first imagined.

Imagine a tripod-like ship with claws attached through docking port pairs at the end of each leg, designated 1-3. Approach asteroid with all claws deactivated and get in a position where all three claws are touching the asteroid. Activate claw 1 to connect to asteroid. Decouple docking port 1, activate claw 2 and connect to asteroid, allow docking port 1 to reattach when magnetism kicks back in. Decouple docking ports 1 and 2, activate claw 3 and connect, allow ports 1 and 2 to reconnect and you have a 3-point connection to the asteroid.

Would work for an arbitrary number of claws, assuming a position where all are touching the asteroid is available. The last claw to attach doesn't really need the docking port, either.

Of course, all this is moot if the claw allows multiple simultaneous connections to a target from a single ship, but we'll have to wait and see if that is so.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Red Iron Crown

[Kasuha]

I guess the most important fact is that the answer to the topic question is:

Yes

[KN_Namida]

I guess the most important fact is that the answer to the topic question is:

Yes

Agreed. It looks like, doesn't matter if the claws behave exactly as docking ports or act a bit differently, we can find valid solutions if any problem pops up.

[Minarkhaios]

Agreed. It looks like, doesn't matter if the claws behave exactly as docking ports or act a bit differently, we can find valid solutions if any problem pops up.

Or at least kerbals will die trying it.

[Dodgey]

Or at least kerbals will die trying it.

I think that is the most important part.