I've stranded Jebediah Kerman around Minimus - help!

[asb3pe]

So I've been following Scott Manley's terrific tutorial videos on youtube, and in episode six we've now flung Jebediah Kerman all the way out to Minimus.

Somehow, I got there with 1000 m/s velocity (he got there with 224 m/s lol) and even with using up all of my fuel I couldn't slow down to enter orbit. Goodbye Jebediah... (sob)

No way. I can't let him perish. So I used a few tips from Scott - first, I had been doing F5 quicksaves along the way. The last one was at periapsis with Minimus going 1000 m/s (lol), so that wasn't gonna be enough. But he also gave a tip about if you run out of fuel you can use the thrusters. But they weren't making puffs of smoke for me like they were doing for Scott. So I read the wiki and learned that the "R" key turns on the RV-105 Thrusters - I thought they were always working! Anyhow, the combination of using all my liquid fuel and most of my monopropellant from the thrusters (19.53 left out of 110) got me into orbit! YAY!!! I DID IT!!! I SAVED JEBEDIAH KERMAN!!!!

Or did I? What do I do now? I will go back to Space Center, enlist another Kerman to go back to Minimus... and rescue Jebediah? Is this possible? I'm new to this game, having a lot of fun obv (thanks to these videos), but now I'm filled with questions. Is there a two-seater capsule (I'm in career mode)? Can I really put another ship in orbit and get the two ships close enough so Jebediah can fly to the other ship with his jetpack? I have solar panels on the capsule, so Jebediah will be okay even if it takes me a while to get back to him, right? I'm loving this career mode. Thumbs up. Tips appreciated. (not the monetary kind, you numbskulls!)

My main question - can I transfer fuel somehow from ship to ship if I can get another ship to the planet?

Edited June 7, 2014 by asb3pe

[Moss]

If you've been following Scott Manley, he also did a video on how to rendezvous another ship. Good thing is that it's easy around Minmus. There is a two seater capsule, but if you want him home sooner just bung on an extra one man cabin to your rescue ship.

[asb3pe]

A separate gameplay question - I made a bunch of F5 quicksaves along the way to Minimus, but the only way I know how to access it is by holding F9 to load the last quicksave. Is there a way to access the other, earlier quicksaves? Or is it literally just a "quick" save with only one slot available to reload from? I'd really like to go back in time and review to figure out how I got such a large velocity compared to the tutorial.

[asb3pe]

I have a plan, but I don't know if it makes any sense. I'll make a ship that has the Mobile Processing Lab because that has room for two Kerbals, then I can do science while I'm there. Right? I really don't know much about the Mobile Lab yet. I also still don't have a complete grasp on science in general, it sure can be confusing between "keep data" and "transmit data" and "store data" - when to do which one.

Edited June 7, 2014 by asb3pe

[Taki117]

A separate gameplay question - I made a bunch of F5 quicksaves along the way to Minimus, but the only way I know how to access it is by holding F9 to load the last quicksave. Is there a way to access the other, earlier quicksaves? Or is it literally just a "quick" save with only one slot available to reload from? I'd really like to go back in time and review to figure out how I got such a large velocity compared to the tutorial.

IF all you did was hit quicksave then the last one is the only one that exists (Since the file gets overwritten each time) however if you hit ALT+F5 you can create multiple quicksaves and ALT+F9 to select which one to load.

[asb3pe]

IF all you did was hit quicksave then the last one is the only one that exists (Since the file gets overwritten each time) however if you hit ALT+F5 you can create multiple quicksaves and ALT+F9 to select which one to load.

Now there's a handy tip, thanks - glad I asked! This is my first run-thru at the game so I'm using saves to help me learn quicker. But it also seems like cheating in a way, it certainly takes almost all the risk out of career mode.

[Claw]

I have a plan, but I don't know if it makes any sense. I'll make a ship that has the Mobile Processing Lab because that has room for two Kerbals, then I can do science while I'm there. Right? I really don't know much about the Mobile Lab yet. I also still don't have a complete grasp on science in general, it sure can be confusing between "keep data" and "transmit data" and "store data" - when to do which one.

You're right, science can be a bit confusing.

Without getting bogged down in details, you're better off returning the science samples to Kerbin. You get the maximum science points that way.

There are a couple ways to bring back all that science.

- Do your science, then return the whole experiment module.

- Do your science, then send a kerbal on EVA to take the science and store it in a capsule.

There is a bit more to it than that, but that's a start. The science lab is useful because you can store multiple copies of the same experiment (by module type and biome). Also, the lab lets you reuse sci jr and goo containers.

Transmitting works too, but there is a lower cap to how much science you can gain through transmissions.

[Kryxal]

For a rescue craft you don't have to worry about, put one of the core probes on and an EMPTY capsule (you'll probably have to remove a Kerbal from it). You have a ship that can reach Minimus already, so repeat, but the way to do it is to be going slowly when you get up there, you were just flying past Minimus on the way out of Kerbin SOI, I suspect. Figure on using about 920 delta-v from a 75 km or so orbit to reach Minimus, and if your node shows much more, something's wrong...

[davidparks21]

I flung one of my first kerbals out to a solar orbit early on. Took me a while but I finally built a recovery vessel that was capable of escaping kerbin, meeting up (it took years in poorly timed orbital maneuvering), and getting back. It was a heck of an experience, and taught me a lot about getting around the solar system. And all for a good cause.

I equipped my recovery vessel with the claw so he just grabbed up the other ship (you can even grab a Kerbal on EVA with the claw) and dragged him back (little more than a command pod). Don't make it your first docking, easier to do that in near orbit, but by all means, SAVE THAT KERBAL! Eventually...

Oh, and tip for docking... make sure your RCS thrusters are nicely balanced across your center of gravity, and it's hard to have "too many" RCS thrusters when it comes to docking.

[Feniks_PL1984]

Try to play with manover modes if you are on high mun orbit chwnces are it will take very littleto escape it if you aim it right you should be able to aim it at a planet and come back. You stil have some fuel left.

Also if you are in this kind of truble again and run out of fuel you can always get out and push it. I'm serious it is entirely possible given enough time to move your ship with jetpack. As you can refuel it indefinitly.

[asb3pe]

Yes, this was Scott Manley's advice in his tutorial - he acknowledged the possibility that those following along might have run out of fuel (he still had plenty of course), and he said that since the Minimus gravity is low you can actually get back just by using the RV-105 thrusters. However, I haven't tried yet because I have less than 20% fuel remaining in my last tank and I just didn't think that would be enough. But with Feniks' suggestion to use Jebediah and his jetpack to possibly assist in adding some ship velocity, perhaps its time to give it a go.

But yeah, as davidparks said, the rescue mission would be a great learning experience even if I don't exactly have the confidence in my abilities yet to make it all happen. Only one way to get such confidence - give it a go, and make it so!

[asb3pe]

For a rescue craft you don't have to worry about, put one of the core probes on and an EMPTY capsule (you'll probably have to remove a Kerbal from it). You have a ship that can reach Minimus already, so repeat, but the way to do it is to be going slowly when you get up there, you were just flying past Minimus on the way out of Kerbin SOI, I suspect. Figure on using about 920 delta-v from a 75 km or so orbit to reach Minimus, and if your node shows much more, something's wrong...

That is what I had, I was going about 1100 m/s when I got there so my delta-v was indeed like 900 or so. But my remaining fuel only got me about 700 delta-v before it ran out. The monopropellant thrusters gave me the other 200 or so to get me into a reasonably circular orbit, its barely elliptical but I forget my apo and peri numbers.

What I don't understand is how Scott Manley got to Minimus and he was only going 224 m/s when he arrived... I'm going to have to review his video and watch his numbers more closely and see what he did that I didn't do.

Edit: I think I recall him lining up with his retrograde vector (not sure if that's correct term) and firing his engines to slow down before he got there? Would that make sense to do that on an approach? When you arrive at a planet, once you're an expert at this stuff, you probably have a "target velocity" you want to arrive with, is that correct?

Edited June 7, 2014 by asb3pe

[asb3pe]

You're right, science can be a bit confusing.

Without getting bogged down in details, you're better off returning the science samples to Kerbin. You get the maximum science points that way.

There are a couple ways to bring back all that science.

- Do your science, then return the whole experiment module.

- Do your science, then send a kerbal on EVA to take the science and store it in a capsule.

There is a bit more to it than that, but that's a start. The science lab is useful because you can store multiple copies of the same experiment (by module type and biome). Also, the lab lets you reuse sci jr and goo containers.

Transmitting works too, but there is a lower cap to how much science you can gain through transmissions.

I probably should start a new thread on this, but then again, I'm certain this topic has probably been discussed ad nauseum on these forums (it must be the most confusing part of the game once you have a semi-grasp on the orbital mechanics concepts). So I'll do a search first before I start asking my million questions.

[Claw]

I probably should start a new thread on this, but then again, I'm certain this topic has probably been discussed ad nauseum on these forums (it must be the most confusing part of the game once you have a semi-grasp on the orbital mechanics concepts). So I'll do a search first before I start asking my million questions.

It's okay. Again, I won't add anything just yet except to say try reading the link below. The wiki page has gotten a lot better recently. Science can still be confusing, so I would recommend just tryinh to read it straight through once, even if parts don't make sense. The try doing some science (maybe just on the launch pad), and read the article again.

http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Science

There are a ton more resources than this, but it's a descent place to start.

Oh, and just to clarify my earlier statement, a science lab is not required to do science. It has a purpose, but it's not required.

[asb3pe]

It seems as if we never want to transmit data unless it is the only means for returning the science back home (i.e. a one-way probe to deep space). I pretty much always click "Keep Data" until the game tells me I can't (such as I've taken a second crew report), and then I try to do something with it so I don't lose the science points altogether.

The wiki is very helpful, thanks, but this subject is still awfully confusing to beginners and I think the game designers should somehow try and remedy that. But what do I know, I'm just a noob.

[asb3pe]

I'm gonna call this thread "Answered" because I got into a large Kerbin orbit with the last of my monoproellant, and now I'm using Jebediah's jetpack to push on the capsule and pull my periapsis down to the surface of Kerbin. Jebediah would like me to pass along his gratitude to you all for the advice. I'm not sure he's all that pleased with his Mission Controller right now, but hey, at least he's home and alive, that's all that really matters, isn't it?

[Kryxal]

Actually, that 1100 when you get there means you used WAY more delta-v than you should have ... that 900-odd mostly gets used to get you up there, you shouldn't be moving very fast at all, Minimus should be catching up to you.

[cantab]

Congrats, looks like you didn't need the rescue mission after all! But for future:

Rendezvousing is tricky when you do it for the first time, and you might want to practice in Kerbin orbit. This is what I learnt from: http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Basic_maneuvers and it took me two attempts.

If Jeb's ship is in an inclined orbit around Minmus, try and match the inclination as much as you can with a mid-course correction or/and a correction as soon as you enter Minmus's SOI. That'll save you a lot of fuel compared to matching inclinations once you're already in low Minmus orbit.

For your crew capacity, the simplest option is to use two Mk 1 pods. A single small chute should suffice for the landing back at Kerbin, but if you're paranoid add a couple of radial chutes too, and maybe a few struts to reinforce the connection to the rest of the rocket.

If you choose the Science Lab or the Hitchhiker, bear in mind they are not command modules, so you'll need a separated command pod or probe core to control the ship. Don't forget the power supply if you use a probe core!

When you quicksave with F5, it overwrites the previous quicksave. If you use Alt+F5 you can instead make named quicksaves. More convenient might be to use a backup program to automatically back up your ksp saves, or use a mod such as Jebretary.

Regarding science transmission, with the small instruments it makes sense to transmit the experiment once (or twice if you want a little bit more), then keep a third run. For any ship not with a science lab this will get more return than just keeping and returning one run. It also gets you some science right away without having to wait for the mission to complete.

[Claw]

It seems as if we never want to transmit data unless it is the only means for returning the science back home (i.e. a one-way probe to deep space). I pretty much always click "Keep Data" until the game tells me I can't (such as I've taken a second crew report), and then I try to do something with it so I don't lose the science points altogether.

The wiki is very helpful, thanks, but this subject is still awfully confusing to beginners and I think the game designers should somehow try and remedy that. But what do I know, I'm just a noob.

Some science transmits at 100%, and crew reports are one of those. Take a scan through that wiki and it'll tell you what the transmission rates are for each experiment.

Specifically for crew reports, you can EVA and collect the report if you don't want to transmit it. Then store it back in the capsule. It's a bit goofy for crew reports, but it's just the way it's set up right now.