lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 You mean, upside down? I'm guessing you mean the borked normal map - or that's what it looks like, anyway. That's ugly! Maybe Unity has down sampled it during export or something, I'll take a look. Any others, or just that one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koosmonaut Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) Hehe, I mean the borked normal map. It is only the KF Medium Track. (reinstalled the mod to be sure, still same problem). And somehow my KF Tiny Rover Wheel and KF Small Rover Wheel only rotate without giving any traction in forward or reverse. I'll do a clean install of my game just to check if it is my setup or the mod.edit: Normal maps still weird in a clean KSP install. Small and tiny roverwheels still wont work properly on Kerbin at least. Edited January 21, 2015 by Koosmonaut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Ok, cool, I think I know what happened with the texture. Make sure you've fitted the wheels the right way up, I forgot to add stickers! They're all presented in the suspension compressed state in the editor and those two designs look completely at home upside down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koosmonaut Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Putting the wheels 'upsidedown' fixed the issue, they do indeed look at home wrong side up hehe. But the texture thing is something you can fix I assume , my stupidity is not so easy to fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Hehe. Happens all the time! I think I'll add a toggleable semi-transparent 'this way up' marker in the editor which will get removed in flight. I'll issue an update for the texture later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Even one of those editor-style arrows rendered besides the wheel, like the orientation arrows in NodeHelper, or the ones included in the stock center-of-lift visualization, would be sufficient. Just gotta be able to let these wacko designers know what's what. I wish there was a way to make the parts spawn in the correct orientation from the get go based on which editor building you're running in. That would be an awesome stand-alone plugin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 This seems to make sense to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiteout1911 Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Just wanted so drop by and say that your wheels are awesome! And I have the same texture problem as Koosmonaut has them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Thanks, appreciate it. Will fix the texture in the next day or so, sorry about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZodiusInfuser Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 I don't know if anyone else has reported this, but if you attach these wheels by their attachment node (rather than surface) in the SPH, the mirroring is wrong and causes both wheels/tracks/repulsors to point either left or right. Oddly if you attach it to a part (via node) then attach that by node to another part it behaves fine:I had a similar issue with IR rework parts, and its because the parts are oriented along the wrong axis. I'm not sure how you could resolve this though, as I know the current axis is important for setting up the wheels like they need to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Ohhh, that's weird. I assumed Gaalidas tried when he added the nodes, I never thought to try myself.Yes, that's a pain :/ It would be a change to the plugin, complete change of all parts, and I'd have to build wheels in a somewhat nonsensical manner in Unity because KSP expects everything to point up like a rocket (which is fair enough, really). Also break saves in a way you can't even find and replace to fix... There is some mirror axis stuff in the part class though, maybe something there will get us out of trouble.Could, of course, just take away the nodes... Thanks for the heads up about orientation. That would have been my first thought, but great to have it confirmed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekan1k Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 The sparks mod causes your wheels and tracks to spark. And smoke.You know- this one: https://kerbalstuff.com/mod/381/Collision%20FX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZodiusInfuser Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 The sparks mod causes your wheels and tracks to spark. And smoke.http://i.imgur.com/ewPJCJs.jpgYou know- this one: https://kerbalstuff.com/mod/381/Collision%20FXIs that just an FYI, or a "fix it please lo-fi". If the latter then I imagine he'll need a lot more information. Also it could well be a fault with that mod rather than this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekan1k Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Is that just an FYI, or a "fix it please lo-fi". If the latter then I imagine he'll need a lot more information. Also it could well be a fault with that mod rather than this one.It's just an FYI. Those two mods seem to be interacting with the new parts, and I thought he might want to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Awesome, that's hilarious. A quick glance at the code tells me that it looks for ModuleWheel as well as Wheel Colliders, so it'll probably need updating if it's going to work alongside KF. I actually had no idea it did anything other than really cool collision effects when stuff hit the ground or each other. I don't think think it's anything I can fix, though might be worth mentioning to pizzaoverlord, as I doubt it'll take much to sort out. Does give me a few pointers for repulsor effects, though, so thanks for chiming in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 (edited) Ohhh, that's weird. I assumed Gaalidas tried when he added the nodes, I never thought to try myself.Yes, that's a pain :/ It would be a change to the plugin, complete change of all parts, and I'd have to build wheels in a somewhat nonsensical manner in Unity because KSP expects everything to point up like a rocket (which is fair enough, really). Also break saves in a way you can't even find and replace to fix... There is some mirror axis stuff in the part class though, maybe something there will get us out of trouble.Could, of course, just take away the nodes... Thanks for the heads up about orientation. That would have been my first thought, but great to have it confirmed.I would maybe suggest we add an optional dependency on one of those addons which provides node toggling. I never actually had that issue because I rarely attach things directly using symmetry when using the nodes, since the nodes were created with the idea that you could align them correctly without using symmetry, and were mostly inspired by the ASET ERS rover system which provides tons of possible wheel-attachment stack nodes that can be toggled. I believe the editor has a modifier key you can use to temporarily disable node attachment. I don't have the keyboard cheat-sheet in front of me though.The sparks mod causes your wheels and tracks to spark. And smoke.http://i.imgur.com/ewPJCJs.jpgYou know- this one: https://kerbalstuff.com/mod/381/Collision%20FXAwesome, that's hilarious. A quick glance at the code tells me that it looks for ModuleWheel as well as Wheel Colliders, so it'll probably need updating if it's going to work alongside KF. I actually had no idea it did anything other than really cool collision effects when stuff hit the ground or each other. I don't think think it's anything I can fix, though might be worth mentioning to pizzaoverlord, as I doubt it'll take much to sort out. Does give me a few pointers for repulsor effects, though, so thanks for chiming in.Yeah, I tried to help the author fix his MM config to accurately work with the KF modules. To fix that, you need to load up his MM patch file and add a few extra exceptions to the bottom patch. I actually redid his MM patch from scratch for my local setup, so the example i am about to show doesn't actually look exactly like his original.@PART[*]:HAS[!MODULE[ModuleLandingGear],!MODULE[ModuleWheel],!MODULE[CollisionFX],!MODULE[FSwheel],!MODULE[KerbalEVA],!MODULE[TTModularWheel][B],!MODULE[*Repulsor*],!MODULE[KFWheel][/B]]{ MODULE { name = CollisionFX scrapeSparks = true collisionSound = CollisionFX/Sounds/Bang1 scrapeSound = CollisionFX/Sounds/GroundSkid sparkSound = CollisionFX/Sounds/SparkSqueal }}This is the most recent build of the mod, and I'm showing only the third patch in his MM file to save space. At this time, the only parts you should need are displayed in bold. You'll probably notice the wildcards in the Repulsor entry. This is actually because at one time I believe the two repulsor styles were using separate modules. At this time, you could reference "Repulsor" without the wildcards and be just fine. Then, the module "KFWheel" exists on all the other parts that you need to exclude.Remember when I said I'd tried to help the author fix his patch? Well, at that time i was expecting imminent release of our beta, but that didn't happen and so my instructions were not accurate to the currently released package. The author seemed to be missing a few screws in his knowledge of how to set up MM properly as well. There were missing @ symbols and such that are absolutely necessary when looking for the existence of a module in a part. Either way, I tried to help and the rest of you screwed me up! Well, I'll show you when I launch my master plan and soon, very soon, I shall rule the world! Mwahahahaha!!! ... What just happened? I blacked out for a minute there... Moving on now... Edited January 22, 2015 by Gaalidas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 The same thing we do every night, Pinky! Try to take over the world! Are you thinking what I'm thinking?Ahem..I'll go have a chat with pizza(I really want to say THE HUTT!!, but that may be one geeky film reference to far)overlord, see what the deal is and if the MM patch can be modified accordingly. Thanks, Gaalidas.pat has MirrorAxis, MirrorRefAxis and MirrorVector available to play with. I wonder what they do... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZodiusInfuser Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 (edited) The same thing we do every night, Pinky! Try to take over the world! Are you thinking what I'm thinking?...I'll go have a chat with pizza(I really want to say THE HUTT!!, but that may be one geeky film reference to far)I get both these references!!! --------------------------------------------------Yeah, the meccanum no worky yet Btw, if anyone with dev repo access wants to play about with these, here's a Craft File I've created. You'll need Infernal Robotics and the Model Rework for it to work though (but not tweakscale), since these are temporarily acting as the drive and control.Its a lot of fun to drive! Controls are I & K for forward/back, U & O for turn left/right, and J & L for strafe left/right. Set speeds in the IR window accordingly (note that a max of 20 seems to give the best experience). Docking is also possible, with translation working fine but turning getting a bit unstable shall we say Edited January 22, 2015 by ZodiusInfuser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 (edited) Ah ha, at least someone gets my dated humour That's so cool, I'll have a go later!EDIT: mirrorAxis, mirrorRefAxis and mirrorVector appear to do nothing to help the stack node symmetry issue. Not a fan of dependencies, or MM patches really, so I'm wondering if the sensible thing is either to remove the nodes or just explain that the symmetry is just broken for no particularly good reason. Another question is, is this a bug since the editor logic changed? Edited January 22, 2015 by lo-fi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 The same thing we do every night, Pinky! Try to take over the world! Are you thinking what I'm thinking?Ahem..I'll go have a chat with pizza(I really want to say THE HUTT!!, but that may be one geeky film reference to far)overlord, see what the deal is and if the MM patch can be modified accordingly. Thanks, Gaalidas.pat has MirrorAxis, MirrorRefAxis and MirrorVector available to play with. I wonder what they do...I think so mate, but where are we going to find enough jello to fill my rubber pants at this time of night?ahem... anyway... actually, I do remember "pizza the hutt" from somewhere, but I can't place it.Glad I could help with the MM patch. As I've written it, it should work. By the way, shouldn't the module named "Repulsor" actually be "KFRepulsor" in the same naming convention that the rest of your modules have been using? If you intend to bring that one in line, better advise him to use the wildcard in my example at least in front of the module name.You totally lost me on that last line, though. Are you drinking while typing again?- - - Updated - - -I get both these references!!! --------------------------------------------------Btw, if anyone with dev repo access wants to play about with these, here's a Craft File I've created. You'll need Infernal Robotics and the Model Rework for it to work though (but not tweakscale), since these are temporarily acting as the drive and control.https://www.cubbyusercontent.com/pl/Zodius'%20Mecanum%20Car.png/_f593b53419594b12a61fad6a0f749facIts a lot of fun to drive! Controls are I & K for forward/back, U & O for turn left/right, and J & L for strafe left/right. Set speeds in the IR window accordingly (note that a max of 20 seems to give the best experience). Docking is also possible, with translation working fine but turning getting a bit unstable shall we say I just got a really sweet idea about all that translation and such. Once we have the plugin stuff worked out for complete control of these things in an intuitive form, we should really look at what it would take to allow them to be switched into an RCS mimic mode, allowing use of RCS translation controls to be used to translate/rotate the craft around with those... uhh... can we even call them wheels?I know, I'm a genius.... no need to bow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 Hahaha! I still love that show, it was genius. Pizza the hutt was Spaceballs! Now I want to make Spaceball helmets for Kerbals...Anyway, yeah, it should probably be KF prefixed. I started that so I wouldn't clash with the stock ModuleWheel, and sort of following FS in naming convention. Having said that, I got there first with the repulsors, so maybe I'll just leave it like that I noticed someone else posted in the collision effects thread, I'll keep an eye.How cool is that lander Bobcat is teasing (to go completely off topic for a moment)?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekan1k Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 I want everything about that shuttle/rover/lander combo thing. EVERYTHING. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZodiusInfuser Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 I just got a really sweet idea about all that translation and such. Once we have the plugin stuff worked out for complete control of these things in an intuitive form, we should really look at what it would take to allow them to be switched into an RCS mimic mode, allowing use of RCS translation controls to be used to translate/rotate the craftThat's sort of the way I've set the infernal robotics method up, but yes, would be better if it used the same control inputs. I also think a more traditional mode would be good, with a forward input and an amount of strafe and turn applied (like the crab wheel concept behaved). uhh... can we even call them wheels?...They're wheels on a wheel, so how about wheelception-a-trons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Hopefully better than the crab mode concept, considering how horribly you could screw the orientations of all the wheels up to the point where going straight was impossible. That's why I suggest there be toggles for the different control methods, instead of simply mapping the different controls to other keys. Also, like the crawler wheels needed, a quick and easy reset action needs to be assigned so you can go back to the default orientation really easily.- - - Updated - - -Hahaha! I still love that show, it was genius. Pizza the hutt was Spaceballs! Now I want to make Spaceball helmets for Kerbals...Anyway, yeah, it should probably be KF prefixed. I started that so I wouldn't clash with the stock ModuleWheel, and sort of following FS in naming convention. Having said that, I got there first with the repulsors, so maybe I'll just leave it like that I noticed someone else posted in the collision effects thread, I'll keep an eye.How cool is that lander Bobcat is teasing (to go completely off topic for a moment)??I can only say "Funky" to that thing. I've had bad luck with most of the bobcat creations, but I will admit it looks kinda cool. Would make sending a KF-powered vehicle off-world a lot easier.I would say the repulsor module needs to be renamed just so it can be easily identified, by future generations of modders, as a part of your mod. Look at FS, just about everything from that mod (quite likely literally) is prefixed with "FS." Wait until next beta though, or we'll really confuse things when making these compatible with other mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aivoh Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 These are super sweet! Why didn't I try this mod sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts