CZ-9 latest design

[xenomorph555]

From the latest chinese study for super heavy life vehicles comes the latest Long March 9 design that we know of:

The core will still be 9 metres and the boosters will remain 3.35 metres, the rocket would stand about 100 metres tall. The core will have 4 yf-400 engines (400 tonnes of thrust from each I believe) and each booster will contain on yf-400 as well. Both the core and the boosters will run of lox/rp1.

The second stage will be another lox/rp1 stage with 2 yf-400 engines.

The third stage will run on lox/lh on one yf-77 engine.

The rocket could take 100 metric tonnes to LEO and 35 to TLI. In a manned lunar mission the CZ-9 would carry an extra 4th stage most likely running on lox/lh to boost the TLI to 60 metric tonnes. This could then carry a modified shenzhou and lander to the moon.

As you can see this latest design is a much more realistic goal for the CZ-9. I will take a look at the components and possible difficulties of the project:

Things such as 3.35 metre boosters would be very easy for the Chinese since they have had a lot of experience with this size. The 9 metre core could prove to be problematic since Chinese engineers have had problems merely constructing a 5 metres core for CZ-5. Engine wise the yf-77's were completed in mid 2000's so no further work is required in this aspect. The yf-400 could take time due to its proposed size and power, it's 3 times more powerful then the yf-100 Chinas most powerful rp-1 engine, however China appears to be good at developing rp-1 engines so this might be a small problem. Launch wise the CZ-5 pad at Wenchang is said to be able to support rocket's capable of putting 200 metric tonnes into LEO so the CZ-9 could launch here although a new VAB would have to be constructed.

[Sky_walker]

Link?

/10char

[xenomorph555]

Link?

/10char

I'm sorry but this was shown at a live conference/presentation, it's not on the internet at all unfortunately like a lot of Chinese projects.

[Sky_walker]

oh ~_~

Well... any way - looks like my prediction about Chinese being the first guys to reach the moon in a 21 century might be right Or perhaps they'll be brave and send a first woman to the moon? Now that would be a huge blow in the self-esteem of USA.

[xenomorph555]

oh ~_~

Well... any way - looks like my prediction about Chinese being the first guys to reach the moon in a 21 century might be right Or perhaps they'll be brave and send a first woman to the moon? Now that would be a huge blow in the self-esteem of USA.

They are, they have stated a few times that they plan to send a woman to the moon possibly on their first moon mission. It has been said that every shenzhou mission to LEO will have a women on board from now on, whether they can actually do it I don't know but we shall see.

[Sky_walker]

Oh yea, I hear about women on Shenzhou, though I didn't know about the moon part - last time I read anything about it journalist came out with a conclusion that it's uncertain if China will go beyond LEO with it's manned missions in a first place.

I'm not much into Chinese space program - partially because info available in the Western media is nearly non-existent - but... yea, that will be a huge win for China. Good luck to them with that. It might be a true milestone in the history.

[xenomorph555]

Oh yea, I hear about women on Shenzhou, though I didn't know about the moon part - last time I read anything about it journalist came out with a conclusion that it's uncertain if China will go beyond LEO with it's manned missions in a first place.

I'm not much into Chinese space program - partially because info available in the Western media is nearly non-existent - but... yea, that will be a huge win for China. Good luck to them with that. It might be a true milestone in the history.

China will go to the moon eventually but not right now, they have the belief on economic sustainability when it comes to space, so far it's working. But who knows, maybe they have something secret in development like a zond replica or something.

[Simon Ross]

Again folks, be careful how much you read into this.

CZ-9 is still a PAPER study, not hardware in development. In reality, it is about at the same stage as the Saturn V was in 1963 or the N1 was in 1966, with a lot less funding or political pressure.

Simon

[xenomorph555]

Again folks, be careful how much you read into this.

CZ-9 is still a PAPER study, not hardware in development. In reality, it is about at the same stage as the Saturn V was in 1963 or the N1 was in 1966, with a lot less funding or political pressure.

Simon

I know, it's just a more advanced, realistic paper project then when it started in 2010.

[peadar1987]

oh ~_~

Well... any way - looks like my prediction about Chinese being the first guys to reach the moon in a 21 century might be right Or perhaps they'll be brave and send a first woman to the moon? Now that would be a huge blow in the self-esteem of USA.

First woman on the moon? Big deal.

I want to see the first morbidly obese person on the moon!

[Skyler4856]

First woman on the moon? Big deal.

I want to see the first morbidly obese person on the moon!

The ultimate weight loss system...

My name is John and I lost 500 pounds in 3 days...

[Idobox]

They are, they have stated a few times that they plan to send a woman to the moon possibly on their first moon mission. It has been said that every shenzhou mission to LEO will have a women on board from now on, whether they can actually do it I don't know but we shall see.

If they want press coverage, they should send the first cat/dog/hedgehog/sea otter on the moon. Pandas, although super cute, are endangered and shouldn't be used in space programs.

CZ-9 is still a PAPER study, not hardware in development. In reality, it is about at the same stage as the Saturn V was in 1963 or the N1 was in 1966, with a lot less funding or political pressure.

It is also a much easier design than either of these examples.

The yf 400 doesn't exist yet, but the yf 100 is a copy of the RD 120, and energomash makes engines much more powerful than the RD120, like the RD191, already twice as big as the RD120, or the RD 171, with 4 chambers. So, realistic.

Also the idea of using the same engine 8 times is very cost effective.

So yeah, it could change quite a lot before it flies, but it is a promising proposal

[xenomorph555]

I should mention the Chinese have been developing since 2012 what is said to be a "very powerful engine", much more then then the yf-100, it could be the 400 or something else. Rumours have described it as a twin chamber, closed cycle, rp-1 engine possibly developed of the rd-180 which after researching has 390 tonnes of thrust. It would seem the Chinese are one step ahead of us...

[Kryten]

'The Chinese' aren't doing anything, this is all CAST. It's private-venture stuff, or at least as close to private-venture as you can get with a government-owned company; it has no funding from actual government departments, and, more importantly, none of them requested this work. It doesn't represent Chinese plans any more than ULA's powerpoints of super-heavy Delta derivatives represent American plans.

[zhanglulutianxia2014]

Yes, China will go to the moon eventually!!!

[Reddragon]

It doesn't represent Chinese plans any more than ULA's powerpoints of super-heavy Delta derivatives represent American plans.

Except one is made and controlled by an official state-run space agency and the other is a company trying to prove it's abilities for another state run agency and representatives. But you might still be right.

[Kryten]

There seems to have been somewhat more government support since I posted that, but it should still be noted that CAST is not directly government-managed.

[Reddragon]

There seems to have been somewhat more government support since I posted that, but it should still be noted that CAST is not directly government-managed.

That might be true even though it would be odd for the Chinese. Thanks for that info!

[Kryten]

They moved to indirect management in the 90s, collating a bunch of institutes into CASC (of which CAST is a part) and a competitor called CASIC. Both have diversified into commercial contracts and even non-aerospace areas since; one of CASIC's institutes rather infamously makes DF-21 ballistic missiles, cars, and refrigerators in the same factory.

[xenomorph555]

Not sure why this thread was pulled out of no-where but k.