The Double Mission Challenge (Now with reduced repetition!)

[Kulebron]

Going to sumbit an entry in a week maybe.

Another question: if I have 5 jet engines, 20 intakes, and in high altitude I turn 4 engines off, flying off a 1 engine and still 20 intakes, does this count as airhogging?

[Vaporo]

Another question: if I have 5 jet engines, 20 intakes, and in high altitude I turn 4 engines off, flying off a 1 engine and still 20 intakes, does this count as airhogging?

Yes, it does. By the definition in the rules, you would be airhogging even before the 4 engines turn off. (Five or more intakes per engines are airogging. Four or less are not airhogging. Unless you are using FAR/NEAR, which nerf jet engines to where true airhogging is impossible.)

EDIT: Looks like I have to go back to elementary school. 20/5=4, not 5.

Airhogging won't disqualify your entry, though.

Edited November 1, 2014 by Vaporo

[Kulebron]

Hmm. 5 or more intakes per engine? or per all engines? 20/5 = 4.

Ok, if I'm abusing it already, I'll go further

[Vaporo]

Hmm. 5 or more intakes per engine? or per all engines? 20/5 = 4.

You would think taking a calculus class would cure me of stupid arithmetic mistakes like that. (I'm serious. I do that all the time.)

You're right. You wouldn't be airhogging before the first engines shut off, but you would be afterwards.

[Kulebron]

I thought this too. Ok, maybe I'll not turn them off then.

[Kulebron]

My almost submission. This has not flown the entire route yet, just done one cycle (mission) of 4. I'm not sure I can endure all of them. (I'll have to put this on hold for a month, sick of this. )

Hattifnattar (strange small and light creatures that were searching for electricity and Moomins' magic hat)

Lander with orbit module (tank)

Carrier

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Technology:

1. Kerbin air-breathing lifter (no airhogging this time, exactly 4 intakes per engine)

2. Tiny lander (probe core + ion engine + 1 tank + batteries + cube struts as legs)

3. Xenon tank module (RCS + probe core + 4 xenon tanks + battery)

Lifter pulls everything into LKO, then lander and tank undock, dock together and depart for the mission which includes landings at

* Mün

* Minmus

* Ike

* Duna

* Dres

* Vall

* Bop

* Pol

There's enough Xenon fuel for 4 missions.

Jebediah flies on the lifter in a lander can, just to repack parachutes.

If I'm calculating correctly, this can gain Mun 2.5, Minmus 2.3, Duna 3.7, Ike 3.4, Dres 3.3, Pol 3.5, Bop 3.7, Vall 4.5.

Total 23.6 (now it's my turn to make arithmetic mistakes) 26.9 points in a cycle.

DV used is about 13Km/s, but it's actually bigger, because this is for lander + tank, and lander does landing excursions alone.

Some notable things:

* do not circularize the entire ship, let the tank go into the most excentric orbit. It's actually easier to launch and rendezvous with it this way.

* when reaching Jool, aircapture at Laythe saves a huge amount of DV. It puts you in a high circular orbit around Jool, and also if you make it excentric, almost escaping, 1 m/s can throw you on much lower or much higher Jool orbits, depending on timing.

In theory I can get 26.9 * 100 * (4 - 1) * (4 - 1) = 24210 pts

Start mass is 20.1t, end mass is going to be about 13t (I use 6t of fuel and drop two tanks 375kg each), about 64.7%, so the score just doubles, to 48420 pts.

If you look at screenshots, there's one problem: I'm a bit short of oxidizer in the lander to do 4 cycles, and I need 100 units of it, or 500 kg, 2% of mass. I don't think this changes performance, or I can outtweak it, and usage is going to diminish in later take-offs with dropped weight.

So, question: if these lander and tank are the same in all 4 missions, should I repeat them, or this can be considered a sumbission?

Edited November 7, 2014 by Kulebron

[Vaporo]

My almost submission. This has not flown the entire route yet, just done one cycle (mission) of 4. I'm not sure I can endure all of them. (I'll have to put this on hold for a month, sick of this.

So, question: if these lander and tank are the same in all 4 missions, should I repeat them, or this can be considered a sumbission?

Well, technically I require that you repeat the mission, but... I can see that the challenge gets awfully boring awfully fast if you are just completing the EXACT SAME MISSION over and over again. So, I think that I will set a precedent here: if your fuel usage and craft design *clearly* indicates that you can complete multiple launches, I will not require that you do the mission again, and I will (very conservatively) estimate how many launches can be performed. (Actually, I think that I will make a separate scoreboard for this kind of entry.)

So, that being said I think that I have to say:

CHALLENGE COMPLETED!

Unfortunately, I can't count you for a full four launches because of your oxidizer usage. Mathematically, it makes sense that you could just tweak in a little bit more oxidizer and maybe add just a bit more LF to get a full four launches. But, because your didn't, I can't say that you could do four launches. So, I can only say that you are capable of three launches.

Also, My math says that you total multiplier is actually 2.5+2.3+3.7+3.4+3.3+3.5+3.7+4.5=26.9

So:

26.9 * 100 * (3 - 1) ^ 2= 10,760

It does look like you manage to double your score, but I will need your craft file to check this for sure.

No bonuses, I think, so unless you get me your craft file, your score will remain at 10,760, which puts you in second place.

[Kulebron]

Ok, thanks a lot! I'll tweak it and do the take-off and landing sequence to prove it's possible.

[Kulebron]

I did this: 2 take-offs and 2 landings, half of planned, and I still have more than half of the initial OX and LF (ox 396=>301, lf 900=>483). So 4 times are definitely doable, it just needs tweaks to ascent profile. (Shown in the screenshots. First takeoff: 9/31, 2deg 20%, second takeoff 9/32 2deg 25%.)

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26.9 * 100 * (4 - 1) ^ 2 = 24210

For end mass you can actually count the empty craft, with tanks dropped. Initial mass is 20.6 t, minimum possible is 10.6 t, or 51.5%, or 25728 pts, which is more than 24210, so total will be 24210 * 2 = 48420.

Here's the savefile, here's the craft. In case you're interested, this is the same craft empty. If you want to fly it, only MechJeb is needed.

Set it to manage air intakes and prevent flameouts (in utilities window).

P.S. Interesting idea with 2 leaderboards. Well, it not only gets very boring, it takes eternity. Average landing takes 45 minutes, because it requires travel, circularizing, undocking, fine tuning of landing, landing, then take off and rendezous, and docking. One cycle took me about 6-8 hours.

Edited November 7, 2014 by Kulebron

[Vaporo]

I did this: 2 take-offs and 2 landings, half of planned, and I still have more than half of the initial OX and LF (ox 396=>301, lf 900=>483). So 4 times are definitely doable, it just needs tweaks to ascent profile. (Shown in the screenshots. First takeoff: 9/31, 2deg 20%, second takeoff 9/32 2deg 25%.)

26.9 * 100 * (4 - 1) ^ 2 = 24210

For end mass you can actually count the empty craft, with tanks dropped. Initial mass is 20.6 t, minimum possible is 10.6 t, or 51.5%, or 25728 pts, which is more than 24210, so total will be 24210 * 2 = 48420.

Ok then.

CHALLENGE COMPLETED! (again)

Your new score is:

48,420

Which puts you in first place. Very, very well-designed mission.

[Kulebron]

Thanks! I hope I don't kill interest to the competition.