ComradeGoat

This plane generates phantom off-axis rotation forces in atmosphere. In space, it will pitch up constantly under thrust unless I correct it manually (which is has more than enough manoeuvrability to do). SAS simply can't fly it. I can fly and land it manually, but SAS is worse than useless.

I am talking about a tiny amount of gimbal correction needed to overcome the fact that my plane has a rudder sticking up out of the back, because planes need those. The only way to fly it on a constant heading in space is to keep pitching down every few seconds myself. What exactly is it I'm supposed to be learning here? How precisely do I build a craft that will make SAS take control of the rocket gimbals, like it is supposed to, and fly the thing without veering off course? Please explain, because it really isn't clear.

Nope. Just having the command pod SAS still makes the thing wander about like a wandering thing.

Beyond rocket gimbals, RCS, command pod torque and a set of reaction wheels, what am I supposed to be adding? The stuff is there, but the SAS system is simply not using it. The rocket *can* fly in a straight line because I can do it manually. SAS just ... doesn't.

I don't know. Is "what SAS is" equivalent to "a device to make an orbiting vehicle thrust in a circle"?

That's too big to put on planes.

Exactly what I'm seeing. It's a bit frustrating to see people going, "JUST ADD MORE TORQUE!" when there is plenty available, but just isn't being used.

The craft causing the problems have sufficient torque to overcome them. They can be controlled manually and hold a heading. They will not hold a heading under SAS. The problem is not insufficient torque. The problem is that SAS isn't using it.

Nope. Haven't touched it.

My plane will not hold a heading in vacuum under a tiny amount of thrust. How am I supposed to do orbital transfers like that?

None of this explains why my spaceplane, powered by a mere 2 24-77s, can't hold a heading in space.

Clean install. And yet planes that flew just fine in 0.20 are now exercises in advanced control wrestling.

Not even that. I just want to fly this (0.20 screenshot): It was a beautifully well behaved little SSTO shuttle in 0.20. Now it's the demon spawn of Satan trying its hardest to kill anyone who goes near it.

So a few people seem to be getting on OK with it. A bunch of us are having major problems. Can we have the old, lock heading, no matter what, back as an option, please? I just want the things to stay pointing where I point them and not introduce phantom off-axis controls, or decide to change heading half way through a burn.

I get that. I'm expecting that. That's fine. What's not fine is the way the other two axes just start wandering themselves while I try and stabilise the pitch. I have plenty of torque My problem in space is due to the rudder surface above the plane. Firing the rockets causes a tiny pitch up. The gimbals have enough to counter this by themselves. The command pod (yes, I have power) has enough to counter this by itself. They simply don't seem to be bothering to try.

I'm using the keyboard...

I'm flying craft that held a heading perfectly, with barely any control surface deflection in 0.20, and they Will. Not. Hold. A. Heading. Furthermore, they won't even hold a heading in space.

It's very pretty. Sadly, ASAS changes make it nearly unplayable :-(

Planes or rockets? Rockets seem to fly OK. It's planes that are rendered near useless for me.

I'm gonna go back to 0.20. The game was a joy to play. Now it's just constant key tapping to try and make the things go where you want them. I never considered using MechJeb before, but if they don't do something about this, I'm trying to be diplomatic, "unfinished" ASAS, then ISTM that MechJeb will be essential for playing the game in future, and that would be a horrible shame. I don't want to be hasty here, but this is just awful.

I get that, and I've compensated for it. It still won't hold a course. There are two scenarios here: in atmosphere, where it almost does nothing useful at all, and in space where a slightly off centre thrust (which will happen with planes because of e.g. vertical stabilisers) will cause the heading to wander when the rockets power up, even though the pod torque and gimbals are perfectly capable of correcting for that, and did so just fine in 0.20. It seems SAS is simply not bothering to try and hold the heading in this situation.

This is a plane. It's got control surfaces and is a very stable aircraft. It also has reaction wheels because I pulled it over from 0.20 and its ASAS unit magically became reaction wheels. It's doing something when I turn it on, but that something isn't doing the job of holding a heading.

Landed my test flight. It nearly crashed because SAS wouldn't hold the flare, so I came *this* close to killing Jeb on what should have been a perfectly trivial landing. It's much harder to fly now. I feel like I'm fighting the controls all the time.

Also, it's obviously not trim: the refusal to hod a heading in space only occurs when the vessel is under thrust.

No difference. Still resolutely refuses to hold a heading, still won't lock the other two axes.