Evel Kerbievel's Minmus Rover Jump-Off Challenge--NOW WITH "UNLIMITED" CLASS!

[Starwhip]

Contrary to what I originally thought, it seems that a more massive ship is the way to go!

I have an idea... it involves a whole lot of wheels. Think "paddleboat"

[noorm]

Contrary to what I originally thought, it seems that a more massive ship is the way to go!

I have an idea... it involves a whole lot of wheels. Think "paddleboat"

I would think the lenght of the rover is more important than the weight for you special style... for a constant rotation rate, things further from the rotation center will experience a faster motion. But please don't quote me... I'm not an kergineer!

[Starwhip]

I would think the lenght of the rover is more important than the weight for you special style... for a constant rotation rate, things further from the rotation center will experience a faster motion. But please don't quote me... I'm not an kergineer!

Yes. But make it *too* long, and you'll be flinging yourself too high. It imparts too much vertical force and not enough horizontal.

I need to make a "hook" that only pushes you forward, somehow, but I'm kinda lost. It may involve a complicated thing with aircraft gear, action-group brakes, and a giant arm. May.

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It may also involve this:

[ghostbuzzer7]

This looks promising

[Starwhip]

Well, points for consistency, I suppose. It didn't go nearly as high this time.

EDIT:

Ooop. Two point one kilometers... Max height of 562 meters.

It's weird going almost as far as Tarantulae did (589.8m) in VERTICAL distance alone.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Starwhip

[Mister Dilsby]

Well, points for consistency, I suppose. It didn't go nearly as high this time.

I might have recorded it wrong, but I thought you were 561m high on the last jump, so this one is 1m higher. In any case I'm not surprised by 2.1, you seemed to be in the air significantly past the 2.0 mark in your last jump so it was probably 2.08-2.09 already.

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Looking for opinions here: I'd like to open things up a bit further, allowing craft to use any Minmus terrain and any non-glitch means of getting to orbit on fully renewable electric power alone. I have a concept or two that I think could potentially escape, and I'm sure the other crazies here have some as well... should I do it as an "unlimited class" category in the present challenge, or start a new thread?

(And yes, Foxster's mass driver would STILL be illegal in the new category )

[Starwhip]

I has brilliant idea! NEED MAKE STOCK ROTOR NOW!

Basically:

1) Centrifugal force of rotor accelerates rover with nothing but SAS power.

2) Rover is released at bottom of swing towards ramp about 50 meters away.

3) Rover jumps at around 40 m/s

4) Stuff happens.

EDIT

Like so:

EDIT2:

I flings it.

This works nicely.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Starwhip

[Mister Dilsby]

I has brilliant idea! NEED MAKE STOCK ROTOR NOW!

If rotor rotate uppish, maybe not need hit ramp at all?

[Starwhip]

Great Scott!

Do I win?!

That rotor is seriously overpowered...

[noorm]

Do I win?!

I would guess not...

• Ramps are inert. No engines, RCS motors, rover wheels or any other part may be used to impart kinetic energy to the rover. (But you may use any of the above to position the ramp(s))
  
• The rover must begin the run with its brakes set, in contact with either a ramp or the ice.
  

[Starwhip]

But it's not a ramp...

Anyways, working on accuracy. I'll try to throw the rover in the path of a ramp... though the rotor is fun on its own.

[noorm]

If it's not a ramp, the second rule I quoted should apply!

[Starwhip]

If it's not a ramp, the second rule I quoted should apply!

Oh, true.

Hey, it's still fun to play with!

Back to the drawing board!

[Foxster]

Contrary to what I originally thought, it seems that a more massive ship is the way to go!

I have an idea... it involves a whole lot of wheels. Think "paddleboat"

I was playing around with that kind of stuff yesterday too. A spinning machine with or without multiple wheels. Tried it with a releasable axle too. Even using nearly all massless parts I couldn't get much speed out of it though.

Was kinda based on this contraption I made the other day but scaled down a lot...

[Mister Dilsby]

Do I win?! That rotor is seriously overpowered...

Wow! Let's call this the first entry in the "Unlimited" category. For Unlimited you can use ANY means provided that (1) the equipment begins anchored at ice level and (2) the energy used is fully renewable. I'll edit the OP later on and try to make it perfectly clear.

[Mister Dilsby]

OK gang, this thread is now cleared for extreme torque abuse Please review the "Unlimited" class rules and see if I missed anything. Starwhip's ummm... rover whip qualifies for Unlimited and is on the board at 6.1km.

[Starwhip]

New ship in progress. I think I found a way to accelerate past 30 m/s for the "Open" category: A large structural element attached to the front of the rover (With one in the back for balance) that is basically half a parabola... If my reasoning is correct and I get the shape just right, it should accelerate mostly forward and hardly at all vertically.

EDIT:

And for "unlimited" class, I need to make that rotor more stable: at the moment it likes to blow up if it goes too fast.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Starwhip

[Mister Dilsby]

My first "Unlimited" run went 23km, but no survivors. Developing...

ETA: 47.5km! Still no survivors...

Edited March 13, 2015 by Mister Dilsby

[Starwhip]

One form of the structural pylons has an impact tolerance of 999 m/s... maybe you could do something with that.

And rover wheels are nearly indestructible in my experience. (Though they do pop.)

[Mister Dilsby]

Actually the pilot was dying without impact, due to extreme G-forces! So I toned it down a bit...

Here's the Fling-O-Matic at the starting line:

Rolling up, right on target...

In the air! Commence flinging!

RELEASE!

Flinger down safely...

And Flingee impact in 3... 2... 1...

Many bounces later... FRODO LIVES! 11.3km.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Mister Dilsby

[Foxster]

Nice 'rover'! ...and I thought my last effort was tad dodgy!

Just shows how many ways there are to skin a cat in KSP .

[Tarantulae]

Ok, clamp proof of concept. Only things this craft has is aircraft wheels, clamps, sas and power. No powered wheels, no engines, nothing else.

First I put a nice ramp up and drove it down near the edge of the ice. Part of it blew up when i blew the wheels off, but oh well, its still a pretty good ramp.

Reached 26.4 (maybe a little faster) when I hit the ramp. was enough force that my pusher cart was lost. Max alt was 202 (plus a little, I didn't realize I'd max out so fast) Distance on touchdown was 1.5km. Final stop 2.5km. Jeb still happy in his chair.

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[Mister Dilsby]

So do I understand this right, the ship is propelled by the force of your clamps docking and undocking? That's insane!

I'm thinking that if the crewed rover needs to separate rom the 'pusher' then it belongs in Unlimited (like my Flinger). Open rules require that the "ramp" (herein taken to mean whatever crafts you use to launch the rover) be on the ice and "inert". But if you kept the parts connected through impact then I think you would qualify for Open.

Can you confirm the propulsion method please? And well done on such a creative solution!

[Tarantulae]

Its not from docking/undocking. They are initially docked, and then I undock. After that it's from the ports trying to dock, but being blocked by parts of the ship. They get close enough to attract, but can't dock. Something about how it calculates the physics makes the active ship pull the inactive ship to it, where it gently collides, causing acceleration. Once the clamps are a certain distance apart, they continue to provide acceleration. I'm thinking it isn't calculating the same pull on the active vs inactive halfs of the ship.

I think if I hit the ramp more carefully, I could keep the clamp forces attracting between the two halves. With any luck, it continue to provide acceleration during the jump.

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Second attempt. Using trim instead of SAS to try to accelerate. 35.7m/s prior to hitting the ramp. Pusher cart still separated though. I think my weakness now is the ramp. 278 max alt. 1.9 max distance. 3.3km final stop. Need to figure out a way to keep the pusher attached after hitting the ramp. Maybe a more gentle slope?

For those wondering, it is a 4.13T craft.

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Edited March 13, 2015 by Tarantulae

[Mister Dilsby]

That's crazy! I wonder if the effect works in deep space? You could make an infinite push machine. In any case, I'm afraid it seems a bit glitchy to me. There's no way an object should be able to accelerate itself without any energy input. So it's definitely not an Open entry, which requires all kinetic energy to come from "electrically driven rover wheels". Let's qualify it for Unlimited; even if it does completely violate the basic laws of motion. Certainly torque wheels violate those laws at least a little, and we are allowing those.

Again, great job putting this together! I love it when a challenge uncovers new exploits.