Tylo in 1.0?

[technion]

OK guys, not that I'm anywhere near it in this new save, but what are people planning for Tylo following the 47-8S nerf? This place was terrible to land as it is.

I'm picturing the cascading effect of the changes to this engine, leading to a bigger final stage, to an even bigger lander, and so on. Has anyone got a screenshot of something that managed this?

[Warzouz]

I think is still the same way with 47-8S, you just need more engines and add some more fuel to balance the mass increase. Beware that massless parts seems to be gone. So recheck your TWR and Delta-V.

As for low TWR landers (with LV-N) the challenge should have increased quite a lot as nuke weight has increased ... I don't think my SSTO (non plane) would be able to land and take off now (starting TWR was 1, landin was 1.6, DV=6000m/s, down from and to 30km orbit. Total 14T in 0.90).

[technion]

Beware that massless parts seems to be gone. So recheck your TWR and Delta-V.

So those batteries and panels count now? damn.. that's going to hurt my designs.

[Kuu Lightwing]

How about ISRU rig? There's a possibility that bringing down a refinery, drill and a fuel cell might actually be easier than bringing fuel needed to return...

[technion]

How about ISRU rig? There's a possibility that bringing down a refinery, drill and a fuel cell might actually be easier than bringing fuel needed to return...

Without having unlocked and played with those features, I'm not sure. I've always considered reorbit the easy part though. A TWR > 1 is enough to do reorbit, and only a small fuel tank was required. It's landing where you need to shave off that 2km/s with the ground pounding towards you that was hard.

[Kuu Lightwing]

But since you won't need to carry return fuel, that might mean that you'll need less engines to have the same TWR and landing might be easier, too. The general idea is that such craft can be lighter overall. And a side bonus that it could be used to refuel your interplanetary ship off the smaller Jool moons.

[Warzouz]

So those batteries and panels count now? damn.. that's going to hurt my designs.

It seems to be. Further more, external piece add drag in atmosphere.

[magnemoe]

How about ISRU rig? There's a possibility that bringing down a refinery, drill and a fuel cell might actually be easier than bringing fuel needed to return...

With karbonite in 0.90 it was posible to build an Tylo SSTO, you had to top up the tanks in orbit, mine and make fuel after landing then get back up into orbit, see no reason why this should not work in 1.0 if Tylo has lot of ore.

[Jouni]

The Poodle looks like it might be a good Tylo lander engine now. It has decent TWR, high Isp, and a relatively low profile, so it could be useful for landers with a few tonnes of payload.

[Kuu Lightwing]

With karbonite in 0.90 it was posible to build an Tylo SSTO, you had to top up the tanks in orbit, mine and make fuel after landing then get back up into orbit, see no reason why this should not work in 1.0 if Tylo has lot of ore.

I feel like ISRU in general is a very powerful tool. Each planet in the Kerbol system is either relatively easy to land on from low orbit, or has a moon that's easy to land on. That means, you don't need to bring fuel for your return trip since you can just refuel your interplanetary ship in orbit and go home or even visit another planet. You only need enough dV in your mothership to get into orbit, and a lander that can mine ore and return to mothership.

[GoSlash27]

The Poodle looks like it might be a good Tylo lander engine now. It has decent TWR, high Isp, and a relatively low profile, so it could be useful for landers with a few tonnes of payload.

Based on my findings yesterday, the Poodle seems to be the best candidate for this job... provided you have a payload large enough to justify using it.

Best,

-Slashy

[KerikBalm]

I think the result is that SSTO tylo landers are no longer viable (not that they were very practical before-> even if they were reusable, they'd eat up tons of fuel compared to a staged design... have fun keeping the propellant depot supplied).

So... staging or ISRU

[Kuu Lightwing]

Well, ISRU one would probably be an SSTO technically

[ment18]

I built a SSTO for my Jool-5 mission that uses 3 LV-Ns. 6000+ m/s delta-V and around 1 t/w, I used the decent where you only need good t/w right as you land. I tested it with hyper edit and it worked. Sadly Laythe now kills the lander. With LV-Ns only using LF, should be even easier now, thought the lander had large massless landing gear.

[Warzouz]

I built a SSTO for my Jool-5 mission that uses 3 LV-Ns. 6000+ m/s delta-V and around 1 t/w, I used the decent where you only need good t/w right as you land. I tested it with hyper edit and it worked. Sadly Laythe now kills the lander. With LV-Ns only using LF, should be even easier now, thought the lander had large massless landing gear.

Cool. I had a 6050m/s SSTO lander (not plane) for Tylo (with all science) starting at 30km with TWR = 1.02. It was for 0.9 and it had 2 LVN. What is your beast weight ?

[ment18]

An Single Stage Tylo lander and return is probably not possible without resource mining now, the LV-N was nerfed an made 0.75 tons heavier and the changed fuel source doesn't matter as LF tanks aren't more efficient and the the mass of propellant expelled does not change, you just use more. My old lander now has about 4500 m/s and less than 1 Tylo t/w using the correct fuel tanks (smallest mk3). It weighed about 22 tons.