[WIP][1.8.x] SSTULabs - Low Part Count Solutions (Orbiters, Landers, Lifters) - Dev Thread [11-18-18]

[GoldForest]

10 hours ago, jdub3350 said:

Is there a trick to SRB's that I'm missing?  I attach them to radial decouplers and stage them to fire with the first stage liquid engines, but they don't add any TWR to the stage, they only subtract their weight.  For instance a 1st stage liquid engines only goes from a TWR of 1.05 to 0.60 or below once the SRB's are added.  Thanks! 

Did you do anything to the thrust curve?

[jdub3350]

Just now, GoldForest said:

Did you do anything to the thrust curve?

I opened that up and messed with it, picking the various presets, but none of them changed the TWR readout in my KER window. @rasta013 I'll get a craft file up later today.  

[GoldForest]

9 minutes ago, jdub3350 said:

I opened that up and messed with it, picking the various presets, but none of them changed the TWR readout in my KER window. @rasta013 I'll get a craft file up later today.  

Hmmm. Get MechJeb and see if that shows your TWR.

[jdub3350]

8 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Hmmm. Get MechJeb and see if that shows your TWR.

Same on MechJeb, I even tried to launch a few times thinking it was an editor glitch, and none of them had enough ooomph to get off the pad, mechjeb reporting 7-8 m/s² peak acceleration after ignition and fire up. 

[GoldForest]

Redownload SSTUL and see if that does anything.

[jdub3350]

4 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Redownload SSTUL and see if that does anything.

Will do, I'll report back tonight. 

[Haxorlols]

Hello again everyOne, It seems when i change the texture to orange the fuel tanns just turn gray. And this happens with other textures too

[Shadowmage]

4 minutes ago, Haxorlols said:

Hello again everyOne, It seems when i change the texture to orange the fuel tanns just turn gray. And this happens with other textures too

It sounds like you don't have the texture sets installed correctly; they are very location dependent.

You should have two folders from SSTU in your main GameData folder, one for the main mod, and one for the optional texture sets

...KSPFolder/GameData/SSTU/(all the stuff from the SSTU release zip)
...KSPFolder/GameData/SSTU-TextureSets/(all the stuff from the texture-sets zip)

If that is how you already have it setup, I would need log files in order to do any investigation; the texture sets are working fine in my installation setup as-per-above.
 

2 hours ago, jdub3350 said:

Will do, I'll report back tonight. 

If you still can't get it working, please let me know + post up some logs from one of your attempts; will need that information to begin investigating.  With how that plugin and module is setup it would be very easy for another mod or patch to mess things up, but I can't know what/where without logs.

[Haxorlols]

4 minutes ago, Shadowmage said:

It sounds like you don't have the texture sets installed correctly; they are very location dependent.

You should have two folders from SSTU in your main GameData folder, one for the main mod, and one for the optional texture sets

...KSPFolder/GameData/SSTU/(all the stuff from the SSTU release zip)
...KSPFolder/GameData/SSTU-TextureSets/(all the stuff from the texture-sets zip)

If that is how you already have it setup, I would need log files in order to do any investigation; the texture sets are working fine in my installation setup as-per-above.
 

Alright, i just downloaded the new version with the .25 Module Manager, I'll try it right now and see if the cause is the outdated MM

[jdub3350]

1 hour ago, Shadowmage said:

 

If you still can't get it working, please let me know + post up some logs from one of your attempts; will need that information to begin investigating.  With how that plugin and module is setup it would be very easy for another mod or patch to mess things up, but I can't know what/where without logs.

Here is a google drive folder containing the output_log, craft file, and screenshots of mechjeb outputs following ignition of first stage, and first stage firing with liquid engines throttled down- https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6AubkMOT5rrTVc4LV85MTBHX3M.  I did this after deleting the SSTU folder in gamedata and reinstalling it. 

[Shadowmage]

24 minutes ago, jdub3350 said:

Here is a google drive folder containing the output_log, craft file, and screenshots of mechjeb outputs following ignition of first stage, and first stage firing with liquid engines throttled down- https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6AubkMOT5rrTVc4LV85MTBHX3M.  I did this after deleting the SSTU folder in gamedata and reinstalling it. 

I see that you are using RO / RP-0.  All support requests for RO related problems need to be made in the Realism Overhaul thread.  If you can duplicate/confirm the issue on a stock+SSTU install, please let me know and I will investigate further. 

You will need to ask for support in the RO thread for your problem, as it is more than likely related to their patches and setup.  I am not familiar with it and could not fix it even if I knew the solution (the fix will need to come on the RO end of things, which are not under my control).

[blowfish]

Yeah, my recollection is that the modular SRBs are very broken in RO right now.  Haven't had time to investigate the cause, but it's worth noting.

[jdub3350]

9 minutes ago, Shadowmage said:

I see that you are using RO / RP-0.  All support requests for RO related problems need to be made in the Realism Overhaul thread.  If you can duplicate/confirm the issue on a stock+SSTU install, please let me know and I will investigate further. 

You will need to ask for support in the RO thread for your problem, as it is more than likely related to their patches and setup.  I am not familiar with it and could not fix it even if I knew the solution (the fix will need to come on the RO end of things, which are not under my control).

 

4 minutes ago, blowfish said:

Yeah, my recollection is that the modular SRBs are very broken in RO right now.  Haven't had time to investigate the cause, but it's worth noting.

Thanks for letting me know!  Sorry to have taken your time with this. Everything but the SRBs seem to work great in RO, for what its worth.  I'm loving the upper stage tanks with integrated RCS.   

[helcustom]

I have modular fuel tanks installed and it won't let me put aerozine and ntr50 in the tanks I don't know wether to bring it up in this thread or the MFT one.

[Shadowmage]

59 minutes ago, helcustom said:

I have modular fuel tanks installed and it won't let me put aerozine and ntr50 in the tanks I don't know wether to bring it up in this thread or the MFT one.

That is an MFT problem, and nothing that I can fix / under my control.  It is also an issue when trying to use MFT for LH2....

One of the main reasons I had to write my own fuel-handler.  RealFuels was just too much, but ModularFuelTanks only really handles stock fuel types.  Others may have more information on this; I have never really used MFT beyond installing it to check functionality.

 

 

More work on LR-81.  Initial geometry is done, need to do some cleanup and manifold joins for a few things (turbopump/GG mostly).  Then onto unwrap+bake, and will likely hold it at the texturing stage while I wait to see how the wheel stuff is going.  Not going to spend time texturing anything else until I know there will be working wheels coming; really I should just put everything on hold until then... but I get bored and need things to stay occupied and invested....

LR-81-8096 (vacuum bell):

LR-81-8048 (semi-vacuum bell):

Edited July 7, 2016 by Shadowmage

[SuccessPastaTime]

Don't know if it's possible, but I was wondering what files/folders I might take out of the SSTU Gamedata folder if I just wanted the engines of SSTU in my game? I'm doing an RP-0 career, and not all the parts are configured yet, but most, if not all the engines are, so I'd like to save a little RAM, even though i use the 64-bit version of KSP. I feel like the more I add to my game, the more unstable it gets.

 

Anyway, I really like this mod, great models, and the procedural parts of it are amazing.

 

Thanks!

Edited July 7, 2016 by SuccessPastaTime
Spelling mistake.

[Shadowmage]

2 minutes ago, SuccessPastaTime said:

Don't know if it's possible, but I was wondering what files/folders I might take out of the SSTU Gamedata folder if I just wanted the engines of SSTU in my game? I'm doing an RP-0 career, and not all the parts are configured yet, but most, if not all the engines are, so I'd like to save a little RAM, even though i use the 64-bit version of KSP. I feel like the more I add to my game, the more unstable it gets.

 

Anyway, I really like this mod, great models, and the procedural parts of it are amazing.

 

Thanks!

If all you want are the engines, basically you will need the plugin, the engine config files, all of the engine models and textures, and all of the mount models and textures. 

All of the models/textures/configs are in the SSTU/Assets folder and should start with SC-ENG-XXXXXXXX; most everything else should be able to be safely deleted.

[SuccessPastaTime]

2 minutes ago, Shadowmage said:

If all you want are the engines, basically you will need the plugin, the engine config files, all of the engine models and textures, and all of the mount models and textures. 

All of the models/textures/configs are in the SSTU/Assets folder and should start with SC-ENG-XXXXXXXX; most everything else should be able to be safely deleted.

Wow, thank you so much for the fantastic mod, and the quick response! I'll give this a try.

[Urelyn Hazelwood]

Hello,

Any idea what could be causing this?

[Shadowmage]

2 hours ago, Urelyn Hazelwood said:

Hello,

Any idea what could be causing this?

You may be running a mod that has improper real-plumes definitions, causing the real-plumes patch to run but not deleting the stock effects.

1.) Are you running real-plumes?

2.) What mod(s) are you running?

3.) Will need a log file to really know what is going on.  It can be found in your KSP folder as KSP.log

[Urelyn Hazelwood]

2 hours ago, Shadowmage said:

You may be running a mod that has improper real-plumes definitions, causing the real-plumes patch to run but not deleting the stock effects.

1.) Are you running real-plumes?

2.) What mod(s) are you running?

3.) Will need a log file to really know what is going on.  It can be found in your KSP folder as KSP.log

Deleting the patch seems to have fixed it.

But here goes:

1.) I do not.

2.) http://textuploader.com/5ihi0

3.)http://www.megafileupload.com/s5yO/KSP.log

[RedParadize]

@Shadowmage I have a question for you regarding how wheels work. I was wondering if it would be possible to have a single part rover that feels like having 4 wheels. I was looking at the defunct Aset portable rover, I had a great deal of fun with it (We all miss you Alexustas...). It made me look at the real world Lunar Roving Vehicle. 1 piece, unfold and you are ready to go. Do you think there would be any way to do something similar to this ?

[Shadowmage]

32 minutes ago, RedParadize said:

@Shadowmage I have a question for you regarding how wheels work. I was wondering if it would be possible to have a single part rover that feels like having 4 wheels. I was looking at the defunct Aset portable rover, I had a great deal of fun with it (We all miss you Alexustas...). It made me look at the real world Lunar Roving Vehicle. 1 piece, unfold and you are ready to go. Do you think there would be any way to do something similar to this ?

With the stock wheels, absolutely impossible for quite a few reasons.

-IF- (and that is a big if at this point in time) we can get a custom wheel solution (or Unity fixes the wheels on their end... highly unlikely), then sure, would be doable.  I would love to have a small/compact/deployable rover (pref. that doesn't need KIS/KAS to assemble).

 

 

 

Initial geometry on the next few engines that I'll be (re)doing -- SuperDraco (the tiny thing, center left), LMAE (top right), LMDE (bottom right).  As these are all pressure-fed engines, there won't be too much more to them than a bell, some fuel lines, and some gimbal actuators on the LMDE (neither SD nor LMAE have gimbal).

Hard to believe that the tiny little SuperDraco puts out nearly twice the thrust of the LMDE, at a fraction of the dry mass; but that is technological advances for you.  Of course, I could have the size of it completely wrong... the only specification I could find was for it stated that it had a 20cm nozzle.  I could also have the thrust wrong (73kn), as it was unspecified if that was for a single engine or for a pair of engines/complete engine pod.
 

 

Also found a decently detailed (and free) lunar-lander model that I may work on adapting/using as a basis to create my own model from (wouldn't use that model as-is, but use it as a basis to create my own... often the available models are constructed terrible for game use)... so who knows, might also have an LEM at some point.

 

This weekends' release will include the new LR-81-8048 & 8096 engine models (no textures) and deprecate the existing LR-81(no number) placeholder.  The placeholder will still be in-game for a few weeks, but will be unavailable in the editor (existing craft must be converted to use the new engines before the old one is removed entirely).

[blowfish]

Note though, that the Super Draco is designed for sea level operation, and on top of that is very under-expanded to allow for deep throttling.  So even without technological advances, you're looking at a lot less nozzle mass.

[Shadowmage]

1 hour ago, Urelyn Hazelwood said:

Deleting the patch seems to have fixed it.

But here goes:

1.) I do not.

2.) http://textuploader.com/5ihi0

3.)http://www.megafileupload.com/s5yO/KSP.log

Thanks for the info;

From your log file, there is a mod with improper real-plumes config definitions, not exactly sure which mod as it is not one I'm familliar with.   Whatever mod this is needs to fix their real-plumes patches; it is not anything that I can fix on this end, and is a problem with that mods' patches.  It appears that the mod is 'WarpPlugin', but not exactly sure what mod it is.

[LOG 18:31:29.035] Config(@PART[FNSmallAugmentedArcjet]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]) WarpPlugin/RealPlume/Attila/@PART[FNSmallAugmentedArcjet]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]
[LOG 18:31:29.039] Config(@PART[TweakableMagneticNozzle]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]) WarpPlugin/RealPlume/Magnetic Nozzle/@PART[TweakableMagneticNozzle]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]
[LOG 18:31:29.041] Config(@PART[FNMethaneEngine]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]) WarpPlugin/RealPlume/Methane Rocket/@PART[FNMethaneEngine]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]
[LOG 18:31:29.044] Config(@PART[InterstellarPlasmaThrusterUpgraded]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]) WarpPlugin/RealPlume/Plasma/@PART[InterstellarPlasmaThrusterUpgraded]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]
[LOG 18:31:29.048] Config(@PART[InterstellarPlasmaThrusterUpgraded]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]) WarpPlugin/RealPlume/Quantum Vacuum/@PART[InterstellarPlasmaThrusterUpgraded]:FOR[RealPlume]:NEEDS[SmokeScreen]

For reference, they cannot use a FOR[RealPlume] in their patches unless they include RealPlume as a non-optional dependency.  They must change their patches to use a different syntax, to something such as NEEDS[RealPlume]:BEFORE[RealPlume].

You would be wise to report that bug (and the info provided) to that mods' author.

4 minutes ago, blowfish said:

Note though, that the Super Draco is designed for sea level operation, and on top of that is very under-expanded to allow for deep throttling.  So even without technological advances, you're looking at a lot less nozzle mass.

Good points you bring up.  I also just noted that the SuperDraco has far lower ISP than the Lunar engines (SD = ~240, LE = > 300), which certainly supports the 'optimized for atmosphere use'.  Has a fairly high mass-flow for such a tiny engine as well.  Double checked my thrust numbers, and they do seem to line up with what should be specified for a single engine.  For the mass, I mostly just approximated it for a ~115 V-TWR as I couldn't really find any data on that either.

Mostly I would intend it as a replacement for the deprecated/removed LC sets of engines; tiny engine with high enough thrust to be used for landing.  Sad that its ISP is so poor... but there has to be tradeoffs somewhere for the rest of its stellar stats.  A vacuum-optimized version could likely be created, increasing thrust slightly and ISP substantially, but it would lower the TWR and would still end up with a fairly large nozzle/bell on it removing much of its 'size advantage'.