Getting off of Eve with Real Fuels and how it handles ISP

[Sovek]

Soooo, my career is essentially called the Interplanetary Expedition Team. IPET for short. Essentially its mission is to visit every body in the system and return to Kerbin. Its doable, except for maybe Eve. Eve may be a one way trip, regardless. The problem is that unlike stock, Real Fuels tends to handle ISP a bit more like RL.... as the atmosphere gets thinner and ISP improves, so does thrust, not how much the engine consumes fuel. This isnt bad for Kerbin, as its pressure is 1 Atmosphere. Eve is like 5 times that.

Watching Scott Manley's ISQ episode on a shuttle that landed on EVE got out by flying up. But can I do it without KSPI? Or should I look into getting KSPI now and learning how it works for future Eve missions, or just ignore getting off Eve all together and not bothering with KSPI..

Though... I do want to be able to build research stations around pretty much all of them, KSPI would make that... more doable.

[Tay_T]

This seems more like a personal preference. Would you rather go all stock, or would you prefer saying that your grand tour or visit to Eve was modded?

Assuming I know what you're talking about, KSPI should be the KSP Interstellar mod, right? The warp drive and all of that. I'll look for that video of Scott Manley you mentioned, but it sounds cheaty in my opinion. Although, it (can) be very, very difficult to leave Eve with stock. If you feel in some way that this is your only option, I would say more power to you and as he would say, "fly safe."

[Sovek]

Its not just stock though, Its heavily modded as is, and Real Fuels is the problem of dealing with Eve.

I dunno if SM's ISQ is dealing with ISP in a more realistic manner, but even if it doesnt, a winged aircraft may be the only way to get back.

[GluttonyReaper]

The problem is that unlike stock, Real Fuels tends to handle ISP a bit more like RL.... as the atmosphere gets thinner and ISP improves, so does thrust, not how much the engine consumes fuel. This isnt bad for Kerbin, as its pressure is 1 Atmosphere. Eve is like 5 times that.

Just for reference, as of 1.0, stock handles ISP the same way. With the exception of RCS thrusters, I believe, engine thrust does scale with atmosphere pressure.

[Sovek]

So if thats the case. how does one get off of Eve and back in orbit stock.

Oh, and to make matters worse? KScale2 with 9hr kerbin days vs the stock 6. Getting into Kerbin orbit requires approx 5km/s of dV if you want to get into orbit and then deorbit

Edited September 27, 2015 by Sovek

[Nansuchao]

The way Scott Manley used in Interstellar Quest to leave Eve, isn't more doable, cause the Vista engine he used no longer works in atmosphere.

By the way now the thrust and fuel for the KSPI engines is way more accurate and near to real world, that you can build a plane able to land and take-off from Eve. It will be not easy but it's doable.

[Foxster]

Eve is really not that difficult these days compared to pre-1.0.

This will land at and return from sea level:

[Yukon0009]

He's using Real Fuels which has fuel boil-off and that fancy stuff, so your lander might not work under those conditions.

[Foxster]

He's using Real Fuels which has fuel boil-off and that fancy stuff, so your lander might not work under those conditions.

Yes. It was more a reply to "it (can) be very,very difficult to leave Eve with stock"

[Laie]

So if thats the case. how does one get off of Eve and back in orbit stock.

Mammoths, Aerospikes and Mainsails still work good enough even at Eve sea level.

Oh, and to make matters worse? KScale2 with 9hr kerbin days vs the stock 6. Getting into Kerbin orbit requires approx 5km/s of dV if you want to get into orbit and then deorbit

In that case... I don't know how the larger scale affects atmosphere, for starters. But this is KSP: as long as you can still get a TWR >1, it's possible. You just need to throw enough stages at the problem.

[Sovek]

it doesnt really affect the atmosphere, but you need to be moving much faster just to stay in orbit. Kerbin is about 50% more.... with an orbital velocity of 3.1 km/s

[xebx]

Eve is still one of the hardest place to land and reorbit. (with Tylo)

From sea level you need 7500-8000 m/s deltaV Ship, using mammoths or aerospikes or mainsails.

From 7500m (mountains, limit of the denser atmo) maybe 5500 or 6000 deltaV is enough and twr>1 is easier to reach.

And atmo entry/landing can be very short / explosive, a lot of heat generation.

When you are back to Kerbin, things are easy.

If you plan Eve from ASL + Kscale2 + 100% stock without isru, you will have some real challenge.

Edited September 27, 2015 by xebx