New vapor planet - Anun home of the anunnuka

[PB666]

http://robwaugh74.tumblr.com/post/138272238309/people-are-saying-the-new-planet-9-is-going-to

If you are going to have a virtual planet you might as well have virtual race of earth destroying aliens on it.

hmmm, mythology, theoretical astrophysics, religion . . . . . I think I may have hit a common theme here.

 

[Scotius]

So, "ancient aliens" flew past the asteroid belt cheerfully ignoring all gold available there. Instead they settled in Africa, and started mining operation - genetically engineering local apes to get somewhat competent manual labour force. Since there is no mention of  heavy equipment, like bulldozers, drills and combines issued to newly created Homo sapiens, i presume they were given pickaxes, shovels and buckets instead. I guess Annunaki ran out of cargo space for serious mining equipment - they needed all the space for their advanced genetics lab.

[Darnok]

37 minutes ago, Scotius said:

So, "ancient aliens" flew past the asteroid belt cheerfully ignoring all gold available there. Instead they settled in Africa, and started mining operation - genetically engineering local apes to get somewhat competent manual labour force. Since there is no mention of  heavy equipment, like bulldozers, drills and combines issued to newly created Homo sapiens, i presume they were given pickaxes, shovels and buckets instead. I guess Annunaki ran out of cargo space for serious mining equipment - they needed all the space for their advanced genetics lab.

 

Ancient aliens used escape pods to leave their home planet. Probably best choice to stay for while was Earth, they mined what they could to return and rebuild their home planet after crisis will be over.

Of course on their home planet gravity could be different than Earths gravity, so for hard labor they needed cheap work force... dumb apes were near by, so they made them a bit smarter. Gold could be very important for development of their technology, so they had mined as much as they could and since then all smart-apes on every continent started to think that this shiny metal has great value.

Once alien planet was thrown away on different orbit, aliens returned home. But over time it passed near Earth at least one more and smart-apes wrote that down in old book, they called it "Great flood", since seas and oceans washed entire planet.

Of course water level didn't raise a bit and water didn't washed entire planet at once. Gravity from alien planet caused huge tidal wave and since planet was passing near by Earth for many days, Earth during that time made many turns around its axis, so almost every corner of Earth was flooded.

 

Edited January 29, 2016 by Darnok

[peadar1987]

And none of this left any evidence whatsoever. Cool story bro

[Darnok]

5 minutes ago, peadar1987 said:

And none of this left any evidence whatsoever. Cool story bro

What evidence you would expect from alien visit and few days flood made by tidal waves as high as "mountains" (Interstellar like wave, but less steep)?

[YNM]

Now hopefully they don't use Bad News for FTL propulsion. It'll be Bad News. (or prolly, we're surrounded by Bad News ?)

[peadar1987]

5 minutes ago, Darnok said:

What evidence you would expect from alien visit and few days flood made by tidal waves as high as "mountains" (Interstellar like wave, but less steep)?

Massive erosion, silt layers in the sediment record, evidence of a global extinction event, peculiarities in the orbit of the moon, evidence of hugely increased vulcanism, and that's just the low-hanging fruit.

[Darnok]

34 minutes ago, peadar1987 said:

Massive erosion, silt layers in the sediment record, evidence of a global extinction event, peculiarities in the orbit of the moon, evidence of hugely increased vulcanism, and that's just the low-hanging fruit.

Case where wave wasn't that large... In past humans were making settlements near water, so great flood didn't had to be that great to go deep in land, yet most of people would remembered there was a flood on entire (known by them) world.

"silt layers in the sediment record" - Tidal wave that swept few times thousands years ago wouldn't act like flood... it would be more like tsunami, where water rises and then lowers very quickly. While during flood water stays in one place for long time, so imo those are two different cases.

"peculiarities in the orbit of the moon" - 360 days long Earth year and 27 days Moon orbit fits this?

"evidence of hugely increased vulcanism" - there are two events like this... one is myth about Atlantis that was destroyed by vulcano or Earth quake "evidence of a global extinction event" - second is both extinction of dinosaurs and massive volcanoes activity at same time.

Also in second case tidal wave, depends on its size, could mix layers and bodies of dead animals (case where wave was huge), so carbon dating would be inaccurate.

Quote

the oldest dates that can be reliably measured by radiocarbon dating are around 50,000 years ago

 

Edited January 29, 2016 by Darnok

[Scotius]

To wreak havoc on Earth and then scoot over to the edges of our Solar system, this planet would have to cross asteroid belt at least two times. It would perturbate orbits of every space rock near its orbit, scattering them in every direction. Such traces would easily last for millions of years - making such event obvious and easily confirmable. Yet there is no observable scattering of main belt bodies.

[insert_name]

cant believe someone's actually defending this on our fourms

[A35K]

54 minutes ago, Darnok said:

peculiarities in the orbit of the moon" - 360 days long Earth year and 27 days Moon orbit fits this?

What do you mean by this?!? Are you expecting the Moon to have a 365 day orbit? There is no logic in this theory. If they were so advanced, why didn't they mine asteroids and such instead of coming all the way here, in the solid planet that requires the SECOND highest amount of delta-v to get to orbit from in the entire solar system?

Edited January 29, 2016 by A35K

[Darnok]

1 hour ago, Scotius said:

To wreak havoc on Earth and then scoot over to the edges of our Solar system, this planet would have to cross asteroid belt at least two times. It would perturbate orbits of every space rock near its orbit, scattering them in every direction. Such traces would easily last for millions of years - making such event obvious and easily confirmable. Yet there is no observable scattering of main belt bodies.

Something like pushing Neptune to new orbit and destroying planet on orbit where is asteroid belt today? It could pass asteroid belt only once so far.

 

50 minutes ago, A35K said:

What do you mean by this?!? Are you expecting the Moon to have a 365 day orbit? There is no logic in this theory. If they were so advanced, why didn't they mine asteroids and such instead of coming all the way here, in the solid planet that requires the SECOND highest amount of delta-v to get to orbit from in the entire solar system?

No, just some sources say Earth orbit was 360 days long and Moons exactly 27 days.

Because back then there could be no asteroid belt? And staying on planet that is passing asteroid belt is very very stupid idea

1 hour ago, insert_name said:

cant believe someone's actually defending this on our fourms

Sorry, just writing some hypothesis... myths... stories... etc in one place

[Scotius]

Dude...pushing Neptune around? A freaking ice giant? Are you seriously suggesting that civilisation capable of such feat would be forced to use hairless apes to dig in the dirt?

 

[Slam_Jones]

3 hours ago, Darnok said:

Something like pushing Neptune to new orbit and destroying planet on orbit where is asteroid belt today? It could pass asteroid belt only once so far.

 

No, just some sources say Earth orbit was 360 days long and Moons exactly 27 days.

Because back then there could be no asteroid belt? And staying on planet that is passing asteroid belt is very very stupid idea

Sorry, just writing some hypothesis... myths... stories... etc in one place

 

I want to believe you're trolling... but humanity has disappointed and surprised me before...

[Darnok]

33 minutes ago, Scotius said:

Dude...pushing Neptune around? A freaking ice giant? Are you seriously suggesting that civilisation capable of such feat would be forced to use hairless apes to dig in the dirt?

 

 

Where I said planet was pushed by civilisation? If large planet would get close to Neptune it could change its orbit and push him away... some scientists say that Neptune had different orbit at beginning of our solar system.

one of hypothesis I googled in few seconds...

http://www.space.com/4755-trading-cosmic-places-neptune-uranus-swapped-spots.html

[PB666]

6 hours ago, insert_name said:

cant believe someone's actually defending this on our fourms

Right? Giant floods, enslaved apes, I disagree with Scotius (or his demonic end of the world planning cat, lol), Im having a good laugh here.

2 hours ago, Darnok said:

Where I said planet was pushed by civilisation? If large planet would get close to Neptune it could change its orbit and push him away... some scientists say that Neptune had different orbit at beginning of our solar system.

one of hypothesis I googled in few seconds...

http://www.space.com/4755-trading-cosmic-places-neptune-uranus-swapped-spots.html

Every planet had a different orbit at the beginning of our solar system, not factoring early and late bombardment phase . . . its called the N-body problem. You don't need mystical alien worlds. Also, the sun has lost at least some of its mass due to fission, and there has been an appreciable contribution of various and sundry kuiper belt objects to the orbits and mass of the outer planets.

[magnemoe]

4 hours ago, Scotius said:

Dude...pushing Neptune around? A freaking ice giant? Are you seriously suggesting that civilisation capable of such feat would be forced to use hairless apes to dig in the dirt?

 

This, Larry Niven had an idea of landing an giant fusion drive on Uranus, yes think death star size but more like an high pyramid. An starship is simpler to build. 

more fun an species living so far out would be mostly like Nivens outsiders, Titan would be to hot for them, earth would be as hospitable as Venus for us.
 

[fredinno]

11 hours ago, Darnok said:

Case where wave wasn't that large... In past humans were making settlements near water, so great flood didn't had to be that great to go deep in land, yet most of people would remembered there was a flood on entire (known by them) world.

"silt layers in the sediment record" - Tidal wave that swept few times thousands years ago wouldn't act like flood... it would be more like tsunami, where water rises and then lowers very quickly. While during flood water stays in one place for long time, so imo those are two different cases.

"peculiarities in the orbit of the moon" - 360 days long Earth year and 27 days Moon orbit fits this?

"evidence of hugely increased vulcanism" - there are two events like this... one is myth about Atlantis that was destroyed by vulcano or Earth quake "evidence of a global extinction event" - second is both extinction of dinosaurs and massive volcanoes activity at same time.

Also in second case tidal wave, depends on its size, could mix layers and bodies of dead animals (case where wave was huge), so carbon dating would be inaccurate.

 

God, how is someone here actually defending the consipracy theorists? How does he survive?

10 hours ago, Scotius said:

To wreak havoc on Earth and then scoot over to the edges of our Solar system, this planet would have to cross asteroid belt at least two times. It would perturbate orbits of every space rock near its orbit, scattering them in every direction. Such traces would easily last for millions of years - making such event obvious and easily confirmable. Yet there is no observable scattering of main belt bodies.

In theory, it could be inclined enough to not pertube it- but it would make visible signs to NEOs and Earth, so it's irrelevant anyways.

5 hours ago, Darnok said:

Where I said planet was pushed by civilisation? If large planet would get close to Neptune it could change its orbit and push him away... some scientists say that Neptune had different orbit at beginning of our solar system.

one of hypothesis I googled in few seconds...

http://www.space.com/4755-trading-cosmic-places-neptune-uranus-swapped-spots.html

That's the Nice Model, and took place via gravity assists from plantesimals. There's none of that now, and in any case, the Solar system is much more stable now. So, no.

3 hours ago, PB666 said:

Right? Giant floods, enslaved apes, I disagree with Scotius (or his demonic end of the world planning cat, lol), Im having a good laugh here.

Every planet had a different orbit at the beginning of our solar system, not factoring early and late bombardment phase . . . its called the N-body problem. You don't need mystical alien worlds. Also, the sun has lost at least some of its mass due to fission, and there has been an appreciable contribution of various and sundry kuiper belt objects to the orbits and mass of the outer planets.

No, it's actually lost mass due to E=Mc Squared.

[PB666]

4 minutes ago, fredinno said:

God, how is someone here actually defending the consipracy theorists? How does he survive?

In theory, it could be inclined enough to not pertube it- but it would make visible signs to NEOs and Earth, so it's irrelevant anyways.

That's the Nice Model, and took place via gravity assists from plantesimals. There's none of that now, and in any case, the Solar system is much more stable now. So, no.

No, it's actually lost mass due to E=Mc Squared.

Err, meant to say fusion, there are no Mc2 losses without fusion, except heat released from gravitational collapse. 

[Darnok]

15 hours ago, A35K said:

What do you mean by this?!? Are you expecting the Moon to have a 365 day orbit? There is no logic in this theory.

 

4 hours ago, fredinno said:

God, how is someone here actually defending the consipracy theorists? How does he survive?

 

You guys  sound like guy above, you read what I said, but you don't understand even half of it.

What conspiracy theories I am defending? That tidal wave isn't same as flood? Or that Earth and Moon orbit were different? Or that carbon dating have limit 50.000 years? Or that asteroid belt could not exist at time when dinosaurs extinct event started and it could be caused by some planet?

Edited January 30, 2016 by Darnok