Craft with probes and Non-pilots don't require a signal for SAS

[pokeman]

So in my current career save I have been playing with the new comms system and I've ran into a small quirk. Turns out that a ship with a probe core maintains full SAS control without a com signal if its manned by a kerbal. Sounds good when thats a pilot giving commands to the ship but you also retain control even when it's a scientist or engineer. This means that once you've unlocked probes you no longer need to maintain a com signal or have a pilot for full attitude control, the only thing you lose is science transmission and the ability to place new maneuver nodes. It seems to me that the much loved scientist + probe core combo would be less appealing if it required a signal for SAS hold etc, adding a bit more of a trade off to leaving Jeb behind when you go beyond com range. What do you guys think? Do you still find use for pilots in the mid/late game?

[Jarin]

Probes out of contact can always use SAS hold, whether a Kerbal is onboard or not. You can't steer, and you can only point in directions that the probe is capable of aligning to, so more advanced probes are more maneuverable due to better programming (and only the most advanced capable of holding maneuver nodes). You can also only operate at max throttle or no throttle. So no fine control in anything.

Edited November 11, 2016 by Jarin

[pokeman]

That's true but with a scientist or engineer you get all the fine control (steering, throttle) and SAS hold and aligns with no signal, even with the "require signal for control" option toggled. So currently any kerbal can make a probe core function while out of range of comms.

Edited November 11, 2016 by pokeman

[Tyko]

I'm okay with that...think of it as the KSC radioing instructions to the kerbal on board. It makes them capable of inputting instructions into the flight computer even if they can't fly well themselves.

Edited November 12, 2016 by tjt

[KSK]

Quote

I only thing you lose is science transmission and the ability to place new maneuver nodes

That seems like a decent trade off. No pilot, no maneuver nodes. I'm OK with things as they are.

[magnemoe]

5 hours ago, KSK said:

That seems like a decent trade off. No pilot, no maneuver nodes. I'm OK with things as they are.

Yes
I play without the limited control if offline so an probe without communication is pretty dead. 
On the other hand any novice pilot gets full benefit from an advanced probe core.

An in game explanation is that the kerbal just press the sas button and use the throttle. You need an pilot to do nodes. 

[tater]

Seems silly to me on multiple levels. The only time most spacecraft are "controlled" by a pilot is perhaps docking. Maneuver nodes (the RL equivalent) would be the one thing that would virtually always be done by a computer.

[Tyko]

32 minutes ago, tater said:

Seems silly to me on multiple levels. The only time most spacecraft are "controlled" by a pilot is perhaps docking. Maneuver nodes (the RL equivalent) would be the one thing that would virtually always be done by a computer.

You can place the maneuver node when you still have a connection and then fly the craft according to your maneuver node even if you don't have a full connection. I think of it as programming the probe.

KSP players aren't people sitting in the KSC. Because it's a game and it's fun to fly spacecraft we alternately play the role of pilot or even probe core. 

[tater]

I understand that, but it's frankly sort of goofy in practice. I think the UI could be better designed around automation, frankly. Like the ability to place some kinds of landing nodes that can somehow deal with EDL. Like set a periapsis, and the probe can then be set to pop chutes, and perhaps even try to burn to maintain some descent rate or something.

[pokeman]

16 hours ago, magnemoe said:

Yes
I play without the limited control if offline so an probe without communication is pretty dead. 
On the other hand any novice pilot gets full benefit from an advanced probe core.

An in game explanation is that the kerbal just press the sas button and use the throttle. You need an pilot to do nodes. 

The limited control toggle doesn't seem to work in this case though, unless we assume scientists can tell probes what to do without KSC or a pilot. I'm alright with how the system works it just seems weird.

Edited November 13, 2016 by pokeman