KSP1 Computer Building/Buying Megathread

[DuoDex]

@Camacha This is my build : http://pcpartpicker.com/user/DuoDex/saved/T2RCmG

[Camacha]

@Camacha This is my build : http://pcpartpicker.com/user/DuoDex/saved/T2RCmG

On stock speeds I would be surprised if that system ever made it over 300 watt. Pushing it through extreme benchmarks like Furmark and with full overclocks you might do 400 watt or a little over. A 600 watt PSU should be plenty. A little headroom is not a bad thing too, since the efficiency is typically better when not totally loaded up.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Camacha

[peachoftree]

Lots of players using AMD cards successfully in KSP, that's a non-issue. PhysX is most certainly NOT disabled in KSP, it's the primary physics engine. What is disabled is running PhysX on a GPU. GPU-accelerated PhysX is actually fairly rare, not many programs actually take advantage of it.

A page or two ago I did recommend that a poster avoid AMD cards and use nVidia, but that was because they were planning to run Linux and nVidia's drivers are much, much better on Linux. On Windows, pick whichever card meets your price and performance criteria, either brand is fine.

Ah, As I plan to run linux I should probably go with nVidia

[Captain Sierra]

Okay, I'm kind of in freak-out mode right now.

I was playing KSP (stock win32) and had music going on my Chrome in the background, and my system locked up, hard. I couldn't even move the mouse.

I did a forced shut down, which is generally successful fix. Not great for the software, but sometimes you just gotta dump everything out of the system.

I tried to reboot it, and it won't even reboot to BIOS. MOtherboard is reporting all systems nominal, but is also reporting error with the CPU preventing boot.

It's been working for a week, and I checked the temp on the heatsink, no overheating (if I was going to melt something, I would have done it already).

Specs:

mobo: ASUS Crosshair V Formula-Z

cpu: AMD FX8320 Black edition unlocked

mem: 8GB DDR3 1600MHz

If you need more specs I can get them. Cant imagine why they'd be needed.

A brand new latest gen CPU should not just die on me. Also, my return policy from Newegg expires December 28, so I kinda need an answer by then.

[concerned]Help.[/concerned]

[Camacha]

Okay, I'm kind of in freak-out mode right now.

First of all, reseat all power and data cables. If one providing power to the CPU worked itself slightly loose, weird things can happen. Unplug and replug everything, including any cables that have nothing to do with the CPU. Maybe you could check your cooler at the same time for any obvious movement or other problems.

In this specific case it might be interesting to make a MEMtest memory stick to see if that does work. I would expect it not to, but you never know. If that changes nothing its time for the standard elimination protocol.

- Revert any tweaks or overclocks you have access to (though without BIOS that will be sparse).

- Disconnect any and all external devices, except for the bare essentials (mouse, keyboard, monitor). This includes all USB sticks and peripherals.

- Do the same on the inside of your case. No DVD player, only one stick of RAM, only one hard drive.

- Still no response? Start eliminating devices or swapping out parts with any spares you might have lying around. Try disconnecting the HDD and see what happens, or switching out one RAM stick for another. Do this for the few devices that are left to see if you can get a different response. If your motherboard has error reporting you should probably see different appropriate messages appearing.

If all that yielded no result it is time to check and reseat the CPU. Remove the cooler, check for any obvious flaws, reseat the CPU, reapply TIM and remount the cooler. If you still have no result there is not much left to do without another motherboard or CPU. In that case you might consider sending it back under warranty.

A brand new latest gen CPU should not just die on me. Also, my return policy from Newegg expires December 28, so I kinda need an answer by then.

[concerned]Help.[/concerned]

I am not sure about local laws, but new products generally have a longer warranty than a couple of weeks

[Captain Sierra]

I worked partway through that list but stopped because I found something.

The motherboard displays Q-code FF when everything is nominal. It displays code 50 when the memory modules are mis-seated. I know from having the issue first time I built it.

The display was not changing its code even with no memory or hard drive connected. It did not indicate no boot device or memory problems. I purposely put everything back, then reseated one of my RAM stick improperly and it didnt give me code 50.

I'm concerned this means its my mobo thats bad not my CPU, and thats a heck of a lot more hassle to reinstall than a processor.

As for the return policy, I've not looked at AMD's warranty on it, but I know Newegg's return policy is only 30 days.

[briansun1]

I worked partway through that list but stopped because I found something.

The motherboard displays Q-code FF when everything is nominal. It displays code 50 when the memory modules are mis-seated. I know from having the issue first time I built it.

The display was not changing its code even with no memory or hard drive connected. It did not indicate no boot device or memory problems. I purposely put everything back, then reseated one of my RAM stick improperly and it didnt give me code 50.

I'm concerned this means its my mobo thats bad not my CPU, and thats a heck of a lot more hassle to reinstall than a processor.

As for the return policy, I've not looked at AMD's warranty on it, but I know Newegg's return policy is only 30 days.

Should be atleast 2 years.

Anyways was looking at the previous pages and saw talk about power consumption. How do you guys calculate that?

Edited December 16, 2014 by briansun1

[DuoDex]

Should be atleast 2 years.

Anyways was looking at the previous pages and saw talk about power consumption. How do you guys calculate that?

PCPartPicker myself. Its estimates tend to be on the high side but IMO better safe than sorry.

[Camacha]

I worked partway through that list but stopped because I found something.

[...]

I'm concerned this means its my mobo thats bad not my CPU, and thats a heck of a lot more hassle to reinstall than a processor.

Did you buy both the motherboard and processor at Newegg? That should make life a little easier. I would suggest to test as much as you can before drawing any definitive conclusions. What you discovered is certainly interesting, but I think it needs some more investigating.

Did you clear the CMOS, by the way?

As for the return policy, I've not looked at AMD's warranty on it, but I know Newegg's return policy is only 30 days.

Like I said, I am not at all familiar with the local legislation, but I can hardly imagine that being legal. They will do everything to discourage you from returning anything for sure, but that is a different matter.

Anyways was looking at the previous pages and saw talk about power consumption. How do you guys calculate that?

I mainly look at reviews that have actually measured the power consumption of components. The main power draws are the CPU and GPU. You add those together, providing numbers are given for separate components and not total system consumption. If they provided system consumption you need to look at idle and load power and do a bit of guestimating what each component does. After that you typically add about 10-30 watts for the motherboard and roughly 10 watts for every (fairly recent) HDD, a little less for SSD's. Add a handful of watts for every fan and other specific devices and you should be pretty much spot on. Please note that older components are a little less frugal, since the emphasis of development has been on power economy only for the past ~4 years.

A much more rough indiciation is looking at TDP's, but since those can be, for various reasons, pretty inaccurate, the result is not highly accurate either (to say the least). If I have the actual system at hand I measure the actual power consumption, either at the socket or through a multimeter at the relevant power plug/cable/connection/soldered pin.

[cantab]

Return policies generally vary depending on why you are returning. If you just don't like the product it's going to be at the retailer's discretion and the time to return will be short if any. If it's faulty you can expect stronger rights. Of course it also depends on the jurisdictions involved.

And yeah, I've been in the "Oh my, it's broken, this is gonna cost me a fortune :0.0:" boat before. The thing to do is try and keep calm and patiently work through solving the issue. It's certainly possible to permanently break components (I've done it) but it's also possible and much more common to just have something not seated right or muck up a bios setting.

[Captain Sierra]

I'm clearing it now (or rather letting it stand for 20 min to fully discharge). I already reseated the processor and worked through everything else. My mobo has a feature I can read diagnostics off it on another machine, but the connection isnt working, so somethings definitely up with it.

[Camacha]

And yeah, I've been in the "Oh my, it's broken, this is gonna cost me a fortune :0.0:" boat before. The thing to do is try and keep calm and patiently work through solving the issue.

No matter how many of these incidents I have had and how many I have consequently solved, mild or not so mild panic is always the first reaction. Oh noes, I broke my toy! And, of course, the obligatory This is the worst time this could happen!

Edited December 16, 2014 by Camacha

[Captain Sierra]

No matter how many of these incidents I have had and how many I have consequently solved, mild or not so mild panic is always the first reaction. Oh noes, I broke my toy! And, of course, the obligatory This is the worst time this could happen!

Considering I was planning on doing another livestream on Friday to verify everything was working for the Kerbal 365 kickoff event (Thursday, Jan 1, 1PM EST), this is close to the worst time it could happen. Closer to Jan 1 when the motherboard wouldn't get here until after the first would be THE worst time, and that it went this early, I am thankful.

I cleared the CMOS and nothing. I booted without RAM and without a hard drive and the boot device and DRAM indicator lights never came on, and the Q-code display continued to tell me "all systems nominal". Evidently systems are very much not nominal. I'm reaching the conclusion that there is a mobo problem. Reseating the CPU did not help anything either. I'm gonna get on the phone early tomorrow morning and get an expedited RMA with Newegg on the mobo.

[Camacha]

I cleared the CMOS and nothing. I booted without RAM and without a hard drive and the boot device and DRAM indicator lights never came on, and the Q-code display continued to tell me "all systems nominal". Evidently systems are very much not nominal. I'm reaching the conclusion that there is a mobo problem. Reseating the CPU did not help anything either. I'm gonna get on the phone early tomorrow morning and get an expedited RMA with Newegg on the mobo.

It sounds like the prudent thing to do. If something dies and stays dead so adamantly, chances are pretty decent that it actually died.

[Alpinwolf]

Do we know that booting without any RAM at all will give any results? I would expect it to need a minimum of 1 module, but you might try other slots. Of course, I say this 2 weeks after you probably returned the parts, and on the eve of the K365 thing you had for a deadline.

So how goes the fight?

[Dgr]

Hey guys, so last time I was looking to buy a pc this thread helped a lot. I didnt buy it, as other things took priority at the time, but now I am able to buy again and with a bit more budget. I have chosen to buy pre built, and have spec'd this from pc specialist:

cpu -i5 4690k

motherboard -asus z97-a

memory - 8gb kingston 2133mz

graphics - gtx 970 4gb

hard disk 1- 120gb kingston ssd

hd 2 - 1tb 7200rpm 32mb cache

power supply - corsair 750w

cpu cooler - corsair h60

OS - 8.1 64 bit.

How does that look? Im no tech genius, I know the bare minimum about cpus, gpus etc. I will be using it for video editing, KSP, Iracing and maybe a flight sim or two, along with web browsing etc. Will it be enough for high settings in game with decent fps?

[cantab]

High-end gaming PC right there. The CPU is as good as it gets for KSP and can be overclocked to get the most out of it; that said keep in mind that KSP will still lag if you build a ship with a gazillion parts! The graphics card is top tier and gives up very little to the much more expensive GTX 980.

8GB of RAM is standard for gaming and most other uses, but I advise you find out if your video editing would benefit from more. If you do get the 8, I advise you ensure you have free RAM slots for future upgrades.

I do think the SSD's a bit small. It's enough for what you list but if you get into more games you'll start filling it up, so I advise you step up to a larger SSD if you can afford it.

[Dgr]

Hi Cantab, thanks for your reply.

Il be using the SSD for the operating system, nothing else. The 1TB disk will hold everything else. I wont overclock to start with, as I dont have enough knowledge but I intend learning and eventually overclocking (hence the liquid cooler). The 8GB RAM is only 1 stick, so I can always stick another on too. I dont know if the motherboard is good for overclocking though, Im going to read up on how to tell before I purchase.

[Kinglet]

Hi Cantab, thanks for your reply.

Il be using the SSD for the operating system, nothing else. The 1TB disk will hold everything else. I wont overclock to start with, as I dont have enough knowledge but I intend learning and eventually overclocking (hence the liquid cooler). The 8GB RAM is only 1 stick, so I can always stick another on too. I dont know if the motherboard is good for overclocking though, Im going to read up on how to tell before I purchase.

There really isn't much to learn about overclocking as it is supported by the manufacturers. Just make sure the heat won't melt your computer. And that your computer will support it.

[DuoDex]

Hi Cantab, thanks for your reply.

Il be using the SSD for the operating system, nothing else. The 1TB disk will hold everything else. I wont overclock to start with, as I dont have enough knowledge but I intend learning and eventually overclocking (hence the liquid cooler). The 8GB RAM is only 1 stick, so I can always stick another on too. I dont know if the motherboard is good for overclocking though, Im going to read up on how to tell before I purchase.

In my experience, having 2x4 GB of RAM will result in better performance. Just a thought. Also, liquid cooling that 4690k will probably be a bit overkill, unless you're planning on doing 4.5+ gigahertz overclocking. I've currently got a 4690k and I'm running at 4.3 GHz ~60 centigrade with a fan.

Also, if you're stretched for price at all, consider going to a 280X or 290X. Those do give up a bit to the 970 in performance, but in my opinion they more than make it up in the price point.

[steve_v]

liquid cooling that 4690k will probably be a bit overkill, unless you're planning on doing 4.5+ gigahertz overclocking. I've currently got a 4690k and I'm running at 4.3 GHz ~60 centigrade with a fan.

Agreed, the H60 is a good unit but IME you'll still get better cooling performance per dollar from a high end air cooler, with less complexity and fewer moving parts.

Then there's pump noise, which I personally find more irritating than a fan.

consider going to a 280X or 290X.

Unless you intend to run GNU/Linux or BSD on it, where AMDs drivers are horrible or non-existant. Edited January 3, 2015 by steve_v

[Camacha]

What Kingston SSD is that exactly? In general I would advise to stick to the big two (or maybe three): Crucial, Samsung or Intel. I would say the Crucial MX100 is a great choice at the moment. For all intents and purposes they are as fast as the competition - do not get fooled by crazy numbers that supposedly say Samsungs are that much faster - and they provide a little extra data security in the form of power caps too. A Samsung EVO is a good choice too and on paper a tad faster, but uses more fragile memory and is less robust in case of power failure. Both are excellent drives though, and provide a lot of quality and value for a very reasonable price.

Intels tend to be more expensive, but have a good track record. I would steer clear of lesser known drives and manufacturers unless you are certain it is not going to be a problem.

The 8GB RAM is only 1 stick, so I can always stick another on too.

It is preferable to use equal sets of 2 sticks, since it means that you use dual channel mode when installed correctly - matching sims typically go in similarly coloured slots. This gives you a nice memory bonus and should add a percentage of extra performance. Ideally you want to have the same make and model, not just matched sizes.

So, for example:

- Using 1 x 8 GB and 2 x 4 GB: no dual channel

- Using 2 x 4 GB and 2 x 2 GB: dual channel advantage

- Using 2 x 4 GB of different brands or models: motherboard defaults to lowest settings of the two, not advisable

Edited January 3, 2015 by Camacha

[Dgr]

SSD is a Kingston hyperX 3k. Samsung evo is actually a little cheaper so its just down to which is most reliable.

Im not paying outright - so a few extra $ doesnt really matter. I have spoken to a friend who agreed with the comments about the h60. I'l look into it, trying to decide if I should just put a h100i on there and that way there is relatively good cooling for clocking. Regarding clock speed, once I have got my head around it all I will be looking to get as high as I (safely) can. If the performance is there, use it right?

RAM - I cant get the RAM I want in 2x4, so I am pretty stuck with just the one stick.

Edit: would 16gb (2x8) 1600mhz be a better choice than 8gb (1x8) 2133mhz? Im not sure if I will really see the benefits of the extra speed of the single stick anyway.

Edited January 3, 2015 by Dgr

[Red Iron Crown]

IMO the only time an all-in-one water cooler makes sense is if you're space constrained somehow, like in a mini-ITX build. For all other builds a good air cooler is cheaper, quieter, and more reliable while performing about the same.

I echo Camacha's advice about SSD brands, if it's not Crucial, Samsung or Intel then keep looking.

Two sticks of slower RAM is better than a single stick of faster RAM.

[Camacha]

SSD is a Kingston hyperX 3k. Samsung evo is actually a little cheaper so its just down to which is most reliable.

That Kingston uses a SandForce controller. Those have had major problems in the past, so I would steer clear of them. The EVO is the way to go, or an MX100.

Edit: would 16gb (2x8) 1600mhz be a better choice than 8gb (1x8) 2133mhz? Im not sure if I will really see the benefits of the extra speed of the single stick anyway.

Higher clock speeds in RAM are usually offset by CAS or other variables, so in effect you gain little. You can check the various numbers yourself. I would go for 2 x 8 GB, since you have 4 memory slots anyway

- - - Updated - - -

IMO the only time an all-in-one water cooler makes sense is if you're space constrained somehow, like in a mini-ITX build. For all other builds a good air cooler is cheaper, quieter, and more reliable while performing about the same.

Seconded. You gain little or nothing going with a premix water system performance wise and the pumps are usually more noisy than a good air cooler. Nothing beats the reliability of a proper air cooler. Only a custom loop will get you really great numbers when it comes to temperature, but that is only for people who really, really want it