Kethane Pack 0.9.2 - New cinematic trailer! - 1.0 compatibility update

[zYnthethicz]

No, its good, I have the same. Its basic view in map view.

Next time please use thumbnail, not so big pictures

But, it's not the map view, it's the main menu?

Edit: I understand now! I was a little too quick to write here thinking it was a bug.

Thumbnail? How do i use this? All i saw in "Reply" was "Insert Picture".

Edited July 1, 2013 by zYnthethicz

[KhaosCorp]

ITS AN EASTER EGG guys! This has been said soooo many times. It amazes me how few in the KSP community seems to not know what an easter egg is.....

[HoY]

Just a question, can I scan a planet with multiple probes on different orbit at the same time?

No, but you can scan a planet with One probe with Multiple scanners onboard. Tomorrow I'm going to post a .craft here with a satellite that's capable of scanning a body at 1000x time warp that's completely stock with kethane, in the hopes that people look at it and take some engineering hints into their own designs.

[FaceDeer]

That's not an easter egg. An easter egg is hidden, something you have to look for or pay close attention to spot. This is pretty much the opposite of hidden.

[Luxmaster-CZ]

No, but you can scan a planet with One probe with Multiple scanners onboard. Tomorrow I'm going to post a .craft here with a satellite that's capable of scanning a body at 1000x time warp that's completely stock with kethane, in the hopes that people look at it and take some engineering hints into their own designs.

What is the secret? Just many many scanners, and enough power supply?

[KhaosCorp]

That's not an easter egg. An easter egg is hidden, something you have to look for or pay close attention to spot. This is pretty much the opposite of hidden.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easter_egg_(media)

Does not have to be hidden.......

@Lux:

yes that's the base idea, but your orbit altitude and inclination is VERY important too

[Luxmaster-CZ]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easter_egg_(media)

Does not have to be hidden.......

An Easter egg is an intentional inside joke, hidden message, or feature in a work such as a computer program, movie, book, or crossword.

I dont see a single option this could be a easter egg

[Majiir]

An Easter egg is an intentional inside joke, hidden message, or feature in a work such as a computer program, movie, book, or crossword.

I dont see a single option this could be a easter egg

It's not a bug. It's a feature.

[KhaosCorp]

So then uninstall if it bugs you so much!

No one is forcing anybody to use Kethane or any other mod.

Even if you don't like something there is a right and wrong way to express such.

If you don't like a mod either post something constructive or uninstall it....being an ass over every little thing is not really acceptable option.

Majiir himself stated it was an EE so get off your high-horse!

and try reading more than the first sentence in the wiki post........

[Melfice]

Let's just call it an ascended bug, and be done with it.

[Majiir]

Let's just call it an ascended bug, and be done with it.

Except it's not. There was no accident that resulted in this. It wasn't a bug that I decided to make into a feature. I sat down, decided I wanted to do it, and did it.

[Tanya Sapien]

personally I love the new overlay, and the modified main menu is pure liquid eye candy to me. What's so unappealing about it anyways?

I mean; you install Kethane because you want to take your engineering to the next level, right?

and this geodesic grid is the perfect expression of engineering progress.

It's a sexy new look for a dull menu we've all stared at hundreds of times. If change is so frightening to you then stay on Kerbin, I'll be on Duna when you figure out how to enjoy science.

[Melfice]

Except it's not. There was no accident that resulted in this. It wasn't a bug that I decided to make into a feature. I sat down, decided I wanted to do it, and did it.

I may have unintentionally missed some previous messages of yours saying that it's a feature.

So, I apologize and stand well and justly corrected.

[TMS]

No, but you can scan a planet with One probe with Multiple scanners onboard. Tomorrow I'm going to post a .craft here with a satellite that's capable of scanning a body at 1000x time warp that's completely stock with kethane, in the hopes that people look at it and take some engineering hints into their own designs.

Please do.

[neurotoxin]

Ok first, why not stop with the main menu thing? The latest release gives the option to disable it anyway. It's over and done with. Just stop with it already.

Secondly, Majiir I really do love this mod and being sick of seeing the negativity in this thread thought I'd post to show my appreciation for the effort you've put in. The new grid is amazing and makes finding overlapping resources much easier. That being said, I would also like to provide some constructive criticism. I think it would be awesome to have a "show all resources" option. I know (from reading earlier in the thread) that you'd have to add a lot to make it able to display multiple resources simultaneously in a single cell but maybe until that time comes it could just show the larger deposit in said cell? It would make finding overlapping resources between Kethane and EL much easier and since it's a separate view it would still allow the detailed views of a single resource. Just a spit ball thought.

Anyway, thank you for the hard work and keep it up. Don't let the negativity or nonconstructive criticism get to you.

[KhaosCorp]

Please do.

hehe should I post the scandrill again =P

[Majiir]

I may have unintentionally missed some previous messages of yours saying that it's a feature. So, I apologize and stand well and justly corrected.

No worries, the thread moves fast. I just wanted to clear it up because some have said it was a bug that I decided to badge a feature. In truth it was intentional from the start, and during implementation I found (and fixed) some bugs with the main grid system.

I think it would be awesome to have a "show all resources" option. I know (from reading earlier in the thread) that you'd have to add a lot to make it able to display multiple resources simultaneously in a single cell but maybe until that time comes it could just show the larger deposit in said cell? It would make finding overlapping resources between Kethane and EL much easier and since it's a separate view it would still allow the detailed views of a single resource. Just a spit ball thought.

I could do some simple blending of the deposit colors where they overlap, which wouldn't look great but might work.

But before you ask for that, consider this detail: scan masks are stored separately for each resource. Most people don't notice since the Kethane detectors currently scan all available resources, but the detectors were built to be configurable, and in the future I think at least the compact scanner will only find Kethane, not other resources. So if we blend colors, the question is: how do you indicate information about cells where there isn't a resource? Do you also blend the black/gray cells? If so, you'd get a strong gray when both resources are scanned (but none present) and a lighter one when only one is scanned. I suppose you could always hover to get detailed information, but it makes the visuals very confusing. You'd also have to decide whether it's best to blend gray/black from one resource with the deposit colors from another; it could have a real muddying effect most of the time.

In short, I think a primitive, not-so-great version is possible without much effort, but making it look good and work well is sort of a design challenge.

[Pontiac]

What if you were to take the each cell and convert them into pie charts? Each resources is given a color. The resource is assigned a color either by user preferences, mod specific, or just at random (But Kethane always being Green). This would eliminate blending, and show a clear designation that a particular cell has more than one resource. I don't think you'd have to go as far as splitting it up on a percentile base (Like if one resources only has 10 units, but it takes a LONG time to pull that 10 units, where as Kethane is a second or two to yank 10 units, I don't think it'd be fair to show the entire cell as being Kethane).

[neurotoxin]

-snip-

In short, I think a primitive, not-so-great version is possible without much effort, but making it look good and work well is sort of a design challenge.

Oh definitely I understand that. I liked one of the previous ideas that was made earlier in the thread but I think you had mentioned there was some problems with it. I don't know HOW possible it would be but possibly adding an indicator IF another resource is present. Example of my idea below (forgive my amazing MSPaint skillz yo.) Assume kethane as the primary deposit in multiple resource mode and display a indicator for any other resources located in the same cell.

Like I said, I have absolutely no idea how difficult this might be from a programming perspective (I haven't learned much farther beyond console utilities in java) just an idea. I know I wouldn't wanted a blending, especially considering how ugly some colors may get when mixed with others.

Kethane deposit with ore:

Kethane deposit with ore and another resource:

EDIT: The multiple resources view would be used primarily as a quick reference point for overlapping resources which a user could identify deposit sizes easily by just switching views to said resource and hovering. Multiple resources view would show no deposit values (or all if you would/could code that in) and would serve only as a reference point.

Edited July 1, 2013 by neurotoxin

[Gaius]

Would it be possible to not blend the colors, but simply draw them side by side, so if you were displaying two resources at once, the left half of the hex would be one color and the right the other? And for more, you just keep slicing the hex into narrower pie-wedges?

EDIT: Whoa, double-ninja'd! xD

[FaceDeer]

I really hate to harp on the main menu thing, but I've installed 0.7.2 and I can't find the option to turn off the main menu grid display. The control in the map view looks the same as it did in 0.7.1 and the "show overlay" radio button doesn't seem to affect the main menu's display when turned off. GameData/Kethane/settings.cfg doesn't have any additional settings in it that I can see. What am I overlooking?

PS, the reason I'm focused on this is because it's the only issue I've had with this new update. So that's a good thing?

[Moon Goddess]

The problem with the above two posts has to do with the say he draws the hex's

The above thing would mean he'd have to draw each hex as 6 triangles really adding to the computer resources Kethane uses.

EDIT: the above 2 posts above FaceDeer's

[Majiir]

I explained earlier in the thread why splitting up hexagons into different colors is a technical challenge. Not impossible, but it would involve changing the mesh structure and that screws with things like cell<->vertex lookups.

Another option would be to texture cells that contain other resources, like with a dot or something. It would be the same color as currently, but at least it would be an indication that "something's up" under that cell.

[KhaosCorp]

The problem with the above two posts has to do with the say he draws the hex's

The above thing would mean he'd have to draw each hex as 6 triangles really adding to the computer resources Kethane uses.

EDIT: the above 2 posts above FaceDeer's

Not only this, but also it would limit the amount of resources the map could handle. If each hex were, for instance, split into 6 pie sections that means the map would only be good for Kethane and 5 other resources. As is its infinite (in theory) since there is no shared space.

I think marking the hex with a icon or * if it has multiple resource hits is the best idea toward this so far. Granted its not seeing it all at once, but its a step up from randomly mousing around looking for multiple resource hexs.

[neurotoxin]

The problem with the above two posts has to do with the say he draws the hex's

The above thing would mean he'd have to draw each hex as 6 triangles really adding to the computer resources Kethane uses.

EDIT: the above 2 posts above FaceDeer's

I liked one of the previous ideas that was made earlier in the thread but I think you had mentioned there was some problems with it.

I knew there were issues with it but since we were on the topic I felt I should fully explain what I had pictured.

I explained earlier in the thread why splitting up hexagons into different colors is a technical challenge. Not impossible, but it would involve changing the mesh structure and that screws with things like cell<->vertex lookups.

Another option would be to texture cells that contain other resources, like with a dot or something. It would be the same color as currently, but at least it would be an indication that "something's up" under that cell.

That would be great. Any indication that there's more than one resource in a cell that doesn't muddy up the cells would be a step in the right direction in my opinion. Either way I'm just happy we got the new overlay. Just wanted to offer my 2 cents.