So, my 4-year old son has been watching me play KSP, and...

[nyrath]

This is wonderful that KSP is encouraging the youngster to imagine what other planets are out there. Building creativity is very important.

I'm reminded of an old Dr. Seuss book called On Beyond Zebra, about the secret letters of the alphabet that are past the letter "Z"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Beyond_Zebra!

[PolecatEZ]

My four-year-old overheard a conversation between mom and grandma on the phone and my wife says something about the school system not being a good atmosphere for something or other...he pipes up with "Well, you can't breathe very well in the upper atmosphere!"

He's also obsessed now with Minmus, all of this play with his brother with Legos or Angry Bird pieces centers on missions to Minmus, getting stuck on Minmus, getting home from Minmus, orbiting Minmus, crashing on Minmus. Just a non-stop stream of chatter about Minmus. I really need to accelerate the 79 days needed to reach Duna or Eve...

[Deadpangod3]

Not if they both had lowish gravity and orbited each other really, really fast....

Bob: Ahh, I feel sick. I feel so dizzy..

Bill: Bob, we told you not to look at the stars!

They'd basicly cancel out their momentum and fall towards the sun, that's what happens every time in simulation games when I try to do that,

[Kerbface]

They'd basicly cancel out their momentum and fall towards the sun, that's what happens every time in simulation games when I try to do that,

Well I'm pretty sure it's quite possible to have planets and even stars orbiting each other. Pluto and Charon are kind of this, though obviously Pluto affects Charon a lot more than vice versa.

[Deadpangod3]

Stars arent really orbiting anything very fast, also Pluto and Charon (insert protest for Pluto speech here) aren't equals sized, its like a very small version of the Duna system, now two planets that aren't orbiting anything can probably orbit each other.

[Pedonymous]

Stars arent really orbiting anything very fast, also Pluto and Charon (insert protest for Pluto speech here) aren't equals sized, its like a very small version of the Duna system, now two planets that aren't orbiting anything can probably orbit each other.

It'd be nice if there was a barycenter system in place for KSP.

[Kerbface]

Stars arent really orbiting anything very fast, also Pluto and Charon (insert protest for Pluto speech here) aren't equals sized, its like a very small version of the Duna system, now two planets that aren't orbiting anything can probably orbit each other.

Why would 2 planets fall towards the sun they were orbiting just because they were orbiting each other? Why would their relation to each other in the same solar orbit change the solar orbit? Why would whether or not they were the same size affect this? Why would they have to be going at some unbelievable speed? Orbital speeds are simply dependent on proximity and mass of the objects. I don't see what makes it different from Pluto and Charon except that they would affect each other more equally.

[Tw1]

They'd basicly cancel out their momentum and fall towards the sun, that's what happens every time in simulation games when I try to do that,

Ah, you may have a point....

Sure the mutual momentum wouldn't be enough?

Shared atmosphere or not, planets with a common barycentre would be cool. The barycenter could act like the SOI of both planets as you approach from a distance, but you'd then enter the SOI of one specifically. To prevent any chance of you orbiting around the barycentre, while between the one SOI would be slightly larger than the other.

I imagine the game would be pretty finicky when calculating orbits that when between these.

But maybe you could achieve a figure eight shaped orbit!

What do you reckon? Feasible for Arde and Binbin? (I'm starting to like those names.)

Edited May 1, 2013 by Tw1

[Deadpangod3]

Why would 2 planets fall towards the sun they were orbiting just because they were orbiting each other? Why would their relation to each other in the same solar orbit change the solar orbit? Why would whether or not they were the same size affect this? Why would they have to be going at some unbelievable speed? Orbital speeds are simply dependent on proximity and mass of the objects. I don't see what makes it different from Pluto and Charon except that they would affect each other more equally.

I'll explain it a little:

•---><---• the behind one pulls on the ahead one, canceling out velocity, when their side by side (one blocking the sun from the other) they don't gain any, so basicly their slowing down every time one is ahead/behind the other,

[Pontiac]

One morning, just before I was going to drop my 7 year old off at school, I told my 6 year old, in an excited voice, that I had something really really awesome to show him on my computer. He was like "What is it?" and I said "You'll have to wait until you're done eating, and I drop off your brother at school." He said OK and went back to watching TV.

So after I get back, I kick up KSP, and start building a rocket. Soon, my boy came down excitedly and said "Daddy, I'm done eating... What was it you wanted to show me?". I pointed to the screen "Look!! I can make rockets and make them go into space!"...

His reply....

....

Me.. Right now...-> *bows head and starts to weep a little bit* *sniff*

Him> Daddy... .. Umm.. Can I have a drink then go play on my computer?

*sighs and goes and cries in a corner*

[ackroe]

Ha! Win cant wait to explore Binbin

[loppnessmonsta]

http://www.nowykurier.com/toys/gravity/gravity.html

I came across this thing a long time ago. I don't know how accurate it is, but I've been able to get 2 "planets" that orbit each other while simultaneously orbiting their "sun" on a stable orbit a few times. But I guess if theirr mass was even slightly different, one would be the main body and the other would just be a huge moon that introduced a wobble or something? idk. This thing is fun, though.

[Kerbface]

I'll explain it a little:

•---><---• the behind one pulls on the ahead one, canceling out velocity, when their side by side (one blocking the sun from the other) they don't gain any, so basicly their slowing down every time one is ahead/behind the other,

How is this different to the situation the Earth and moon are in? Both pull on each other but they are falling towards each other in an orbital trajectory so they don't get closer to each other and it's more or less a closed system so it doesn't cause them to slow down in the Sun's orbit. Every time one is "ahead" they would "pull the other one towards it" equally with conservation of momentum. The one ahead pulls the one behind and the one behind pulls the one ahead. And since they're orbiting each other they don't get closer when they pull. The forces would all cancel each other out.

[Deadpangod3]

How is this different to the situation the Earth and moon are in? Both pull on each other but they are falling towards each other in an orbital trajectory so they don't get closer to each other and it's more or less a closed system so it doesn't cause them to slow down in the Sun's orbit. Every time one is "ahead" they would "pull the other one towards it" equally with conservation of momentum. The one ahead pulls the one behind and the one behind pulls the one ahead. And since they're orbiting each other they don't get closer when they pull. The forces would all cancel each other out.

That's because one is alot smaller then the other, and the moon is a lot farther away, plus lower gravity

[Kerbface]

That's because one is alot smaller then the other, and the moon is a lot farther away, plus lower gravity

Okay, so actually why are they different though? The details are different, I don't see how the concept changes at all. It's still a closed system. Forces acting equally. Wouldn't them slowing down their orbit around the sun violate conservation of momentum?

This just sounds like attatching a magnet to the end of a fishing rod that is tied to a car and expecting the magnet to make the car accelerate towards the magnet.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Kerbface

[thefizu]

so this thread is basically anticipating the planets we will see in the future ksp... how can a dev ignore the imagination of a child? HOW?

anyway i would like to share my experience too, with my 6 yo daughter...

she builds rockets (mostly solid fuel) and plan missions with my probes... is amazing to see how some concepts (gravity, mass, acceleration... but also delta V) can be quickly understood by young minds...

One of the first things i decided when i bought the game was "ill play this with her..." and i think is a great point for a game... but i think that "game" is a limitative definition for KSP, seeing how far it can bring his players...

[The Jedi Master]

One morning, just before I was going to drop my 7 year old off at school, I told my 6 year old, in an excited voice, that I had something really really awesome to show him on my computer. He was like "What is it?" and I said "You'll have to wait until you're done eating, and I drop off your brother at school." He said OK and went back to watching TV.

So after I get back, I kick up KSP, and start building a rocket. Soon, my boy came down excitedly and said "Daddy, I'm done eating... What was it you wanted to show me?". I pointed to the screen "Look!! I can make rockets and make them go into space!"...

His reply....

....

Me.. Right now...-> *bows head and starts to weep a little bit* *sniff*

Him> Daddy... .. Umm.. Can I have a drink then go play on my computer?

*sighs and goes and cries in a corner*

Aw man...

I used to have plans to leave the solar system and try to find other star systems no one had found yet because it would take to long...

[jfjohnny5]

My 2-year old niece used to love to sit on my lap when I was playing Dungeon Defenders. She liked to hit the space bar and "make the guy jump." I can only imagine the hilarity that would ensue if she played KSP with me and had the same 'space bar fascination.'

[Deadpangod3]

Okay, so actually why are they different though? The details are different, I don't see how the concept changes at all. It's still a closed system. Forces acting equally. Wouldn't them slowing down their orbit around the sun violate conservation of momentum?

This just sounds like attatching a magnet to the end of a fishing rod that is tied to a car and expecting the magnet to make the car accelerate towards the magnet.

The moon makes up for the velocity lost when its on the opposite side, because the earth is the central body,

Two planets orbiting each other don't have a central object so they don't really make up for the lost velocity, unless there's so, somehow another body ahead of them pulling, without messing up their orbits, which is pretty much garrenteed

[andysim212]

Imagination is a powerful thing. So many games gloss over this important part of life and are made to be played with no imagination at all. Same with toys. Remember when you just got some Lego blocks and had to use your imagination to make something, now you get just the parts you need to make a predefined item and you cant really do anything else with it. This is why I will always love sandbox games. Like Minecraft and KSP.

Make your own story.

[Specialist290]

Imagination is a powerful thing. So many games gloss over this important part of life and are made to be played with no imagination at all. Same with toys. Remember when you just got some Lego blocks and had to use your imagination to make something, now you get just the parts you need to make a predefined item and you cant really do anything else with it. This is why I will always love sandbox games. Like Minecraft and KSP.

Make your own story.

Seconding this. Some of the best games I've ever played were the most fun because I was coming up with my own story for what was happening rather than following a line of preplotted breadcrumbs. KSP happens to be one of those.

[Needles_10]

Redbull gives you wings.

Imagination gives you wings, control surfaces, and rocket propulsion.

+1 for using your imagination and not drinking that using Redbull as rocket fuel. It gets stale when I pour it into a Rockomax tank! Any fuel tank, even solid boosters (whaaa?), the liquid turns stale and smells bad.

[Wabur]

Man, I really want there to be a Binbin now.

[hugix]

Arde & Binbin should definetly be the names of two moons of the upcomming gas giant!

[Juanfro]

When we send people to Mars, after their triunphan return one of the guys from the mission will say in an interview "When I was a kid I used to play an awesome game called Kerbal Space Program"