Military Sim Spin-Off?

[9911MU51C]

I was just wondering what people would think of a military spin off of KSP, BUT before I'm attacked for even suggesting it, actually read my idea.

Now, I was thinking with the kerbal physics and construction, it'd be fun to try a military sim based off of it. Like, you could have maybe 25 or so players around Kerbin that all can build rockets and planes, and they have a goal of beating eachother using alliances and whatnot, so there's a hint of politics. Now, think of it like this, You could build space stations and such, and that station could launch orbital missiles or lasers, BUT you'd need to protect it from enemy missiles or ships. At the same time, you are flying attack bombers to enemy bases to say, damage their Hangar so temporarily they cannot launch planes, but they could choose to build turrets and SAM's using some form of income (possibly from mining and building workshops/revenue buildings that could also be attacked to hurt your income?). Now, all that would be with the KSP physics. Your wing gets shot, and you spiral out of control with chunks of your plane wobbling and breaking. Your station gets hit? it sends pieces flying in all directions, but depending on the damage maybe it's still semi-usable. It could have much potential as a strategic global war game with KSP construction and physics.

NOW before you reply, remember I'm not suggesting they change KSP in any way or form. I like the science and exploration feel in KSP. All I'm saying, is the physics and construction in KSP would work great for more genres.

[Dr. Muttonstache]

It does sound like a neat idea, as a completely separate game however.

[9911MU51C]

I know, I would rather not see weapons in KSP. People tend to have the mentality to attack any ideas of changing KSP like that anyway

[Outback_Zach]

I think your suggestion is great. I fully agree that the ksp engine could be used in different genres. I have always enjoyed games that allow customization (spore, ksp). The engine would allow for realistic damage and who with a length want to see a station being blown to smithereens by small craft.

[vexx32]

Once the KSP basics are all fleshed out, they could most likely swap some features out for others at some point to create a totally different game; wargames like you suggest would be a potential spinoff that could work quite well.

[Splode]

You're right, KSP does have a lot of potential. If they ever upgrade the engine enough for multiplayer, you could get some excellent space race political stuff happening.

[9911MU51C]

And if it was modern-ish combat only focused on Kerbin and LKO, then there would be no need for time warp (except docking, that would need a perfectly timed rendezvous to not need time warp)

[lobsterbark]

To get this to work, I imagine the all the moons and planets would be removed, and every thing would be scaled up, to compensate for bad hitboxes and such on the ground. Also, of course, different planet ect. Would it be more rts like, or just a sort of build shoot stuff build kind of thing.

[9911MU51C]

I was thinking more you can build ships and whatnot at your own pace out of the real-time game with a singleplayer testing area to see if ships act right and handle correctly, and in the match you can still build but to modify ships and whatnot, since sitting there building ships that might work isn't exactly smart. Then it'd be the same gameplay as KSP when it comes to deploying a plane (at a cost) then piloting it to it's target to drop its payload. Or to fly your rocket either into orbit or to its target if its an ICBM (which are quite fun to make in KSP )

[Fel]

Good in theory, horrible in practice (except with close friends).

People wouldn't build their own rockets / planes... they'd just download the "best for version number" build. It makes it really annoying to play your own build when someone has worked out and mass distributed builds that you're EXPECTED to be using.

Another issue is that TRUE space combat, while infinitely more exciting... has an insane level of difficulty. KSP works because it allows you to take your time and get things right... but imagine trying to dock urgent supplies to your space station while using maneuvering thrusters to avoid the missiles being launched at you AND having to dogfight the fighter that is chasing you.

And then we have to deal with MechJeb.

I mean, being able to "battle" your creative juices could be fun... but it brings too much min-maxing into play; and the JOY of KSP quickly becomes lost as everyone uses the XxPwnzorsxX build.

[lyndonguitar]

I would rather see a 4x space trading style spinoff, ofcourse there will be military elements but space trading will be the main focus, especially if they implement interstellar travel

[AlternNocturn]

To do this Squad would have to retcon the game's lore where Kerbals are a peaceful race. Also, who would they go to war with? There are no countries on Kerbin, the whole planet is united.

[theflyingfish]

To do this Squad would have to retcon the game's lore where Kerbals are a peaceful race. Also, who would they go to war with? There are no countries on Kerbin, the whole planet is united.

There is no such "lore". While The community seems to have agreed upon certain theories as being accepted in general, Squad has never released nor condoned any "lore" about the game itself. Any "lore" is simply conjecture that members of the community created to support some storyline in the roleplaying forums, or a reason for the existence of the space program. Until career mode is released we will most likely have no more information on the origins of the Space Program or the Kerbals themselves.

For all we know, the reason that there are no cities on Kerbin is could be because most of the race was destroyed by war, and the Space Program is an attempt to start an offworld colony.

But After KSP is "finished", far off In the distant future, I could see Squad releasing a military part expansion pack as an add-on to the complete KSP. I would greatly like to see hardcore simulator aspects, such as radar parts, missile racks, gun pods, and a part of the game where we could design our own missiles and the seeker heads that control them, kind of like a "build your own missile" part.

[Splode]

It doesn't have to be the same game, it could be a total-conversion mod.

I think building in real time would be fine, you'd have to work quickly, so sacrifices would have to be made, just like real space programs. Apollo 1 would never have been the disaster it was if time wasn't so critical!

Space combat would be pretty interesting, and probably intensely difficult: it seems fairly easy to defend yourself, as you can see whatever is coming at you a long time before it actually hits you.

[Tristavius]

The big problem: try doing a game like this without time acceleration, it'll be very, very dull. And how do you have time acceleration with multiple people...

[Comrade Jenkens]

I've been thinking a game with this engine and construction would be brilliant for a while. I love KSP being about peaceful things and don't want that to change but they could do so many different things withthe building mechanics. I like the idea of kerbals being a peacful race so i'd much rather it wasn't set on kerbin and with a different species. The idea of making huge walkers and tanks the size of battleships would just be too cool to ignore and the challenge of designing them according to physics would make the possabilities endless.

a lot of mechanics would have to differ to make combat more practical but it would easily be possable and would definatly breath new life into the genre.

Of course this is all just theoretical

[LaydeeDem]

Yeah. It's definitely possible to use KSP's engine for a different game. Just look at Maxis, a lot of the pathfinding and logic in SimCity was probably based off of the ai creature pathfinding in Spore.

[EndOfTheEarth]

There are some issues with this, that stand for RL combat as well:

1) There wouldn't be much point in building a space platform of any sort, unless it was capable of firing solid-state anti-BM lasers.

2) US and China have proven that it's extremely easy to take out enemy spacecraft, and considering that docking is still a snap, while re-entry is a pain, people would probably be better at it.

3) KSP is a 1st/3rd person simulator, which means that you can't control multiple ships at once at this time. Either everything would have to be automated (taking the fun out of actually attacking anyone) or battles would just be 1 SAM vs 1 Plane, or 1 SAM vs 1 Rocket, over and over and over again.

4) Wars move quickly. If you're messing with a new rocket in the VAB, and you get attacked, then what?

Therefore, to make KSP into a wargame would involve completely reinventing the UI and user experience; in short, it wouldn't be the same game.

[musicpenguin]

I want a Arma 3 style KSP fps. You build missles/planes/cars and attack the base with them. A different game. No moons or planets only kerbin or whatever. Thousands of players like planetside. Eh. Sounds fun to me, Would buy it.

[9911MU51C]

To do this Squad would have to retcon the game's lore where Kerbals are a peaceful race. Also, who would they go to war with?

You're forgetting, this has nothing at all to do with KSP. Just it's engine and construction.

The big problem: try doing a game like this without time acceleration

As I said before, if it is only atmosphere-based and maybe some LKO, you don't need time warp. Docking would take a lot of precision to get flying at the right time to rendezvous as you circularize. As for long plane flights, I would suggest either making the planet smaller, or making bases/countries closer

There are some issues with this, that stand for RL combat as well:

1) There wouldn't be much point in building a space platform of any sort, unless it was capable of firing solid-state anti-BM lasers.

2) US and China have proven that it's extremely easy to take out enemy spacecraft, and considering that docking is still a snap, while re-entry is a pain, people would probably be better at it.

3) KSP is a 1st/3rd person simulator, which means that you can't control multiple ships at once at this time.

4) Wars move quickly. If you're messing with a new rocket in the VAB, and you get attacked, then what?

Therefore, to make KSP into a wargame would involve completely reinventing the UI and user experience; in short, it wouldn't be the same game.

1) it could be used to attack any enemy sub-orbital ICBM's of any kind, or be used to drop several payloads from one launch (MIRV)

2) My idea is you could add turrets and whatnot to auto-defend any stations/buildings you don't actively use

3) If it had 25 people, you could have 10 people organizing an attack in realtime flying their own class-built planes. Example, 8 fighters and 2 heavy bombers versus one of the enemy hangars

4)As I stated in the initial post, you would have out-of-server building to build and test ships, while only doing slight modifying in-game.

And, remember, this isn't KSP. Simply the same engine and construction.

[sporkafife]

I think that the system squad has managed to forge out of the Unity engine is a great one, that could be used in a few different circumstances. A possible war type scenario is one of these applications and I can see how it would work amazingly.

However on a completely personal note, I'd feel less inclined to buy a game where spaceflight is used for destructive purposes. For instance I don't see much interest in Eve online and I was always the guy who in the later stages of Spore would always trade with other planets and very rarely attack anyone. This is purely because I've always believed in keeping space neutral of all forms of weaponry and all working together to explore it and keeping our petty differences on the one planet.

I could go on forever, but I would still fully support squad in making a game like this and wouldn't think bad of anyone for wanting it

[9911MU51C]

(Accidental double post)

Edited May 10, 2013 by 9911MU51C
accidental double post

[9911MU51C]

I think that the system squad has managed to forge out of the Unity engine is a great one, that could be used in a few different circumstances. A possible war type scenario is one of these applications and I can see how it would work amazingly.

Thank you! haha, some people seem to instantly reject any form of spin off, as if they assume squad will finish KSP and then just give up making games. Does it hurt to think of possibilities?

and on a side note, technically it wouldn't really be space-war, because it's mainly planet based, with only the space being used as a tool to get an orbit and whatnot

[musicpenguin]

But with trolls making a rocket and going on a escape trajectory....

[Holo]

But with trolls making a rocket and going on a escape trajectory....

/kick troll

Alternately...

"You just wasted all your money on a useless spacecraft. Hence, I win."

-FINANCIAL VICTORY TO PLAYER A-