Exo's Rubberband and Duct Tape Emporium. SSTOS, Weird Space Ships, and more!

[KissSh0t]

Just tested out your Aurora SSTO.. all I can say is wow twitchy little... well.. not so little.. but damn that thing is twitchy.. You can lose control just by pulling up..

Need to fly it carefully and then it is all good.

I Took it apart to see what you did with the innards... some good stuff in there ;>

*edit*

Just noticed while flying it that there is part of the top wing not connected together.. half way on the rear top wing, you will see it if you roll left and right.. you will notice that the wing pieces come apart slightly, you could stitch them together if you wanted to.

*edit*

Hahaha~ Wow.. I failed my first try at getting into orbit xD

I didn't expect it to flame out before 30 thousand and ended up flat spinning then fumbled around trying to turn the jet engines off... key's 1,2,3... then burned everything it had.. and couldn't get to orbit xD

I took some screenshots to show what I did.

It has a very nice shape I think.

Edited August 20, 2013 by KissSh0t
PICTUREZ

[Giggleplex777]

Good to see your XB-70 didn't end up like this:

[Exothermos]

Yeah, the roll axis is a little twitchy due to the short wingspan. You just have to be delicate on that axis. You shouldn't be flaming out that low though... Are you shutting down engines as you climb? Weird. I'll test the uploaded file when I get home to make sure I didn't upload something broken. I certainly could have as I have a habit of uploading things early in the morning in an insomniac stupor.

[cesarcurado]

Why not use infinite fuel too? You are already doing the impossible, why not go all the way?

Because he doesn't feel like. His SSTOs, his ways.

I love your tiny SSTOs, OP, they look so cute! lol

Edited August 20, 2013 by cesarcurado

[KissSh0t]

Yeah, the roll axis is a little twitchy due to the short wingspan. You just have to be delicate on that axis. You shouldn't be flaming out that low though... Are you shutting down engines as you climb? Weird. I'll test the uploaded file when I get home to make sure I didn't upload something broken. I certainly could have as I have a habit of uploading things early in the morning in an insomniac stupor.

It's not broken.. I just kinda rushed it up there and didn't expect it to flame out so soon as I was looking at the altitude and not the air intake xD

It can definitely be improved though. It is a nice design.

*edit*

Ohh cwap.. I didn't shut down the engines as I climbed xD

Edited August 20, 2013 by KissSh0t
cwap xD

[Exothermos]

Good to see your XB-70 didn't end up like this:

Haha, woooops! Got anymore pics of this one? How'd you go about doing that long gooseneck of the fueselage?

Edit: KissSh0t, thank you for the very constructive advice! I made some changes for the better. It really was just an example of my penchant for over engineering. I removed the small alieron controls and buttoned down that stray wing panel (I didn't see what you meant until I accelerated time, then WOAH). Also, when trouble shooting I found a completely superfluous fuselage part that I had placed early in the build process when I was going to arrange my intakes in a different way. Well, it wasn't completely superfluous... it made those cool hood scoops. But a non functional hood scoop is just posing!

The result is a muuuch more docile plane. You can also turn off the reaction wheels by hitting action group 8. I find that unnecessary, but it's an option v0v. Craft file is updated to reflect changes. Or you can do the extremely simple mods in the SPH if you are like me and are just really really lazy about moving those .craft files from Downloads over to the KSP folder. UGH.

Edited August 21, 2013 by Exothermos

[KissSh0t]

Hehe~ Good to see you saw what I was pointing out : >

I would also like to see more of the aircraft by Giggleplex777 that crashed...

: I

*edit*

Spurred on by your new Aurora SSTO... I'm trying to make something kinda crazy.. It has 10 Jet Engines x___X

Edited August 21, 2013 by KissSh0t

[Giggleplex777]

It's not very good, and pretty old, too (0.19).

But here's it seconds before another crash (after digging through thousands of screenshot):

Just a little too short.

Edited August 22, 2013 by Giggleplex777

[KissSh0t]

Noooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!

Ohh boy.. you really did come in low...er than the runway.

xD

[Exothermos]

I think that Valkyrie is awesome, and is much truer to the original shape than a space plane can be, thanks to center of mass / center of thrust considerations. I really Like the slow curve in this part:

How u do dat?

@ KissSh0t: I've been building a lot of stuff with those 4x and 3x adapters too. I have yet to make anything worthwhile, but I'm sure something will come to fruition eventually.

Edited August 24, 2013 by Exothermos

[KissSh0t]

Try using 2 x4's one either side to have 8 Jet engines xD

All the new parts are awesome.

[KissSh0t]

I am trying to make something based on your ship again Exo~

The nose bit on the new one you are doing is cool so I am trying something similar.

Here is what I've got so far, thought I'd share it's early stage.. maybe something I did give you idea... I don't know.. xD

[Exothermos]

Hey, cool! I'm glad the design resonates with you. Your design so far even looks a little cleaner.

I've been pretty quiet this week in this sub forum because i've been testing and improving the same ship. These big, complicated designs take a bunch of careful tweaking. Especially considering this one has so many flight regimes that it must perform in. Jet /rocket flight LKO, Planetary Transfer, Duna gliding and powered parachute STOL landing (see below), Payload sequence, Rocket SSTO to LDO, Transfer again, Kerban Reentry and powered landing while much, much lighter. That's a lot of stuff to get right.

One place I don't think I really succeeded in this case is that I'm sure now that, with the heavy rover, I don't have enough internal DV to get to Duna. I will have to have an assist tug. That's OK though because I will use the tug in orbit around Duna as a mobile Gas Station wich will help future missions tremedously. So it is kind of a "two missions in one" package (Or atleast that's how I'm rationalizing it)! In any case I designed craft with contingencies like that in mind with the CoM and CoT lined up on that Shielded Docking Port.

I streamlined the skinning a bit up at the front because I moved the intakes to the back of the craft to fix the common "drag-flipping" problem that forward-mounted intakes induce upon reentry. This let me smooth out the lines up front, and I like the way it looks and handles much better.

I've been testing various landing techniques, and I think I found one that is reliable and safe. Essentially it is powered paragliding! Deploying drogue chutes right at the CoM slows the aircraft and power from the rockets propels it forward generating lift from the wing surfaces. At the last second I fire some retrorockets to further slow it down. On Kerban I've gotten landing speeds as low as 25 m/s horizontal and 1m/s vertical fully loaded. Even if the parachute performance is twice as bad on Duna (which is not really the case) this should be pretty darn safe. Here is an early test.

Also, the parachutes make the top view look like a maniacally happy four-eyed snaggletooth monster. So thats... good?

This is my standard medium duty tug refueling the SSTO after achieving LKO. The Transfer vehicle / Duna fuel tug will probably be similarly sized, but far simpler.

I also have sent my first Test Mission to a 10,000k orbit to await a transfer window to Duna. I have a couple other Duna Missions fow which I would like to use the same window. Since I hate sitting through accelerated time waiting for the window, Might as well do them all at once! But it is a lot of plates to juggle, so it is taking a while. So now the building is mostly over, and the real tweaking and bug hunting begins!

Edited September 6, 2013 by Exothermos

[KissSh0t]

I like the idea of a tug system.. that is clever.

I'm going to try for Duna too.. but using vertical rockets for landing pointing downwards from the body... not sure how that's going work out :T

Your craft will be cool though... I look forward to seeing it landed on Duna. It seems very big.

[BostLabs]

Ok, I have only one thing to say to all you guys in here that are part clipping and air hogging.... Wow! Ok I'll say a few more words now. Those are some really cool designs guys! Who cares if you are bending 'the rules' a bit. Heck, most of my space craft are more about looking cool (to me) than anything else. If they fly then I'm happy. I'm going to have to sub to this so I can see some moar!

[KissSh0t]

Hey Exo... I just figured something out... you know those big grey fuel tanks... the big red ones even. You can build the intake arrays inside of them so you can't see them at all... literally air intakes inside of the tanks.

I reckon pa1983 would like that idea too because he uses the big tanks in his Aircraft.

[Rune]

Hey Exo... I just figured something out... you know those big grey fuel tanks... the big red ones even. You can build the intake arrays inside of them so you can't see them at all... literally air intakes inside of the tanks.

I reckon pa1983 would like that idea too because he uses the big tanks in his Aircraft.

I myself always leave my intakes somewhat visible. Totally a personal preference, but I like the idea of the being there, you know, if only for the kerbals to have somewhere to fall into

But the most useful arrangement I know of, really, is the linear strut-intake-strut-intake-etc... You can place it anywhere, the intakes are still selectable with a bit of skill, and although symmetry starts being a problem for me, for action group purposes it's better t just copy the stack and place two. Not the most part-efficient arrangement (you could place all the intakes in a single strut), but I find it appealing and convenient.

Rune. As always, Exo, your SSTO's look like the belong in a space sci-fi arcade/simulator game. That's a compliment.

[KissSh0t]

I really like using the Cubic Octagonal Struts and making intake arrays.. then hiding them inside the body some how... I sort of treat Air Intakes like rocket fuel.. want more air the higher you go? add more Air Intakes to catch that air xD

[pa1983]

I dont realy like to clip in to parts so I would not put intakes inside a fuel tank since that wold never work IRL at all and it makes it to easy, more challenging to find space to place intakes if they have there own space. I stack them with spacers of some sort to avoid excessive clipping to at least keep it some what real. I dont mind intake a abuse for a number of reasons. The current system is unrealistic in so many ways any way. But I do consider them some sort of compressor stages so an extension of the jet engines. I also have nacelles with 3m intakes give or take to imitate skylon like crafts.

I would say landing performance on Duna is at least half as bad. I have landed close to 20m/s STOL style on kerbin with all fuel remaining and the closes I landed on Duna was 38m/s but one have also burned off about half the fuel at that point making the craft lighter.

40m/s is good for Duna after that it gets dangerous. I would recommend Vertical engines because if your heading for a hill and that happens a lot you cant pull up at all or slow the decent rate enough to avoid slamming in to it so hard that it wont explode.

I have less then 1:1 trust to wight ration on Duna now. Before I had more then 1:1 and it was easier to land because I could avoid hills easier. Now If I am to slow one can only hop to reduce the vertical speed enough to compensate for the ground rising. But sometimes even that is not enough.

Edited September 6, 2013 by pa1983

[KissSh0t]

I can't figure out how you did the side bits Exo so I'm just doing something different entirely xD

Using two of those Mk2 to Size One Adapters back to back but using a Cubic Octagonal Strut to make the second one connect so that gap isn't between them.. then put the Nuclear engine in so only the nozzle sticks out.. the engine is connected to the same Cubic Octagonal Strut inside.. so it makes a kind of compact Fuel Pod / Engine... Mmmmm..

This was done Stock.. this is not using Clipping.. Everything I do is without cheating..

*Edit*

Finally got it to fly... the center of lift is actually quite a bit in front of the center of mass yet it flies nearly perfectly.... I'm a bit confused by this lol..

Went in a different direction with the wings compared to yours Exo.

Edited September 7, 2013 by KissSh0t
3 More Images.

[Exothermos]

That NERVA sidepod is a nice looking little sub-assembly. Have to remember that one. My Mk3 tanks are attached to a Structural Beam. In fact beacause of the stresses involved, the whole craft sits on an "A" frame beam structure. This ensured that the landing gear and leg forces are distributed to very strong parts, as well as the parachute forces.

Here are some under the skin shots. Feels like looking under her skirt before she's even been able to make an entrance, but that's OK. I like talking construction. Probably more than actually playing the game sometimes. That's probably pretty telling.

@pa1983: Yeah, I have 8 little 24-77 rockets on the underside right now for vertical authority. It seems to do the trick as far as softening the landing, but now you have me reconsidering. I might need put a couple aerospikes under there instead. Now that I have comited to the Transfer Tug plan, "dead" weight concerns are eased significantly. We'll see. This weekend I will complete the first Duna test flight, and I'll post the pics of the debris field... uh... i mean landing when I have them.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Exothermos

[KissSh0t]

Mmmmm... I like the frame setup.. that's really cool *___*

[pa1983]

I try to use one big engine instead of a small one to save parts if possible and wight. Also RCS is good to have when landing since authority will suffer as the craft moves slower and slower.

Also land at the lowest possible area on Duna. That would be the old lakes. The dark low patches around the equator. About 500-600m altitude that is. Air is MUCH thicker there then say at 1800m. I can probably loose another 1/3 of the required landing speed that way and also decent rate will be much lower at 600m then say 1200-1800m.

[KissSh0t]

I would love to see you make a Medium sized aircraft pa1983... not a large one!! We know you can do that very well... A medium sized one!! Make a Medium Sized Aircraft!!!!

( ノ ￣ ▽ ￣ )ノ

[pa1983]

I got a small one. 130 parts or so. Can try that one out. Problem with "medium" is that BIGGER is better. Bigger holds more cargo with fewer parts per ton and m³. Its the same law that apply to real aircrafts and ships. So even a medium SSTO hulling 1/4 the payload would still require 1/2-2/3 the parts if I build it the way I do to get the efficiency needed. Bigger it is the more efficient the engines are to since you have more intakes to run the last few jets on before going rockets. I could do a medium 500 part on but it would probably be crappy in terms of capability.

What we need is more aerospace parts like bigger wings or some way of resizing wings with out mods to get part count down. But Squad quite frankly dont seem to care the slightest about spaceplanes. Baned suggestions on parts is just a way to say we dont care what you think. The new "what not to suggest list" makes me sick realy. Whats the point off the forum if every thing is baned that could be suggested? List would be sorter if they wrote what could be suggested. Some suggestions makes sense to ban but that was before they changed it and made it a mile long. If they dont like a suggestion just ignore it. There more interested in carer mode and that makes sense but still rockets get new parts here and there with every release but spaceplanes haven't gotten a new wing or a new landing gear not even a bug fix for the old on yet. A few wings cant take long. Even I know enough about Blender to spit one out in a few minutes. But I want a stock part for a game that I paid for not do it my self.

Edited September 7, 2013 by pa1983