[1.0.5] TAC Life Support v0.11.2.1 [12Dec]

[Corsini]

New version just uploaded! Now compatible with 0.21.1 and it includes resource containers! http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/40667-0-21-1-WIP-TAC-Life-Support-28Jul?p=523035&viewfull=1#post523035

Yes, I know that my parts are ugly. I am still learning. Nicer looking parts are coming soon^TM.

Good morning! (From Brazil)

I have a few mods installed as Soviet and European Pack and would like to include these features in the ATV and Progress spacecraft.

is there any way to be done?

[TaranisElsu]

Ion-whatever doesn't simulate air pressure. Do you think you'll want to try something like that so we can build properly functioning airlocks instead of allowing Kerbals to simply exit through hatches that "expose" the inside to vacuum?

I think that is a little beyond my goals for this mod. Though I will add it to my list of possible future improvements.

Not to complain, but why not make your resources actual resources so they can be tracked in the VAB?

It is an artifact caused by how I am dynamically adding my PartModule and resources during runtime. If you manually add resources, either by editing the part's cfg or using ModuleManager, then they will show up properly. I will be creating ModuleManager configs soon, but I just wanted to thoroughly test the dynamic approach first. The advantage being that I do not have to know about and make changes for every mod out there. Instead it automatically adds itself to all parts with crew capacity.

Good morning! (From Brazil)

I have a few mods installed as Soviet and European Pack and would like to include these features in the ATV and Progress spacecraft.

is there any way to be done?

It should automatically detect all parts with crew capacity and add my module and resources to them. So it should Just Work^TM. Please try it and let me know.

EDIT: I should also mention that it only adds resources to parts that do not already contain my resources. So if you want a pod to have more or less resources, then add them manually (or using ModuleManager) and this will not mess with it.

Edited July 29, 2013 by TaranisElsu

[balu0]

Nice addon! I will try it as I get home.

[rottielover]

This version is working flawlessly for me, well done!

Yea the containers aren't very pretty, but that's ok, I got the new procedural fairings and can make containers to hide them if I want

Wonder if you've had any thoughts about you and the IronCross dev's getting together to work on a combined crew support mod? Could be epic

[Frostiken]

New version just uploaded! Now compatible with 0.21.1 and it includes resource containers! http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/showthread.php/40667-0-21-1-WIP-TAC-Life-Support-28Jul?p=523035&viewfull=1#post523035

Yes, I know that my parts are ugly. I am still learning. Nicer looking parts are coming soon^TM.

I would suggest you go for a plugin modular tank approach instead of tacky 'stacked' parts like that. Nobody's going to want to make their ship 50 meters longer because they need a can of O2 stacked on top of a can of water, stacked on top of a can of food. In reality, food provisions for even a few months hardly takes up much space at all, and O2 / water are constantly recycled and can be converted back and forth as well as for electrical generation so again, you wouldn't need tons of it.

This implementation of having to cover your spaceships in **** or make them absurdly long is why I dislike most life support mods. The CSM for the Apollo missions was enough food, water and oxygen for three men to go over a week in space and included living space, fuel, RCS fuel, and tons of other systems, and, well, you can see how much space all that took up.

You'd be much better off with something like the modular fuel tanks mod, where you have a very small piece, which you can then, in the VAB, change the quantities of supplies with a subsequent increase in weight. The lack of such system is why, to be frank, life support mods are still a non-starter. I don't want to have to add a hundred cubic meters of 'supplies' to my ships that weigh unrealistic amounts and take up unrealistic space.

[Andersenman]

I can't play right know, so I'll ask: What happens with a kerbal when it dies? Is it removed from the ship or does a dead body stay behind? I'm thinking, maybe there could be a "resource" of dead kerbals that needs to be "depleted" before a ship whose crew died can be re-manned.

[Swifty]

This looks interesting. For me the two most important things for me when looking for a life support mod is:

Vessel im not focused on consume resources

Ability to generate them so I can make self sustaining colonies.

Btw I love you're fuel balancing mod, won't play ksp without it

Edit: Just had a go of it. It's an awesome mod already I especially like the way he is a read out saying how many days of x resource you have

Edited August 1, 2013 by Swifty

[Bloodbunny]

Amazing.. I used Ioncross for a good long time, but its been moved to my "notused" folder since trying this. Best part about it is that it affects ALL manned pods, and EVA as well. Finally, some true realism!

[Frayne]

A realistic and feature complete life support mod is pretty much the holy grail of KSP as far as I'm concerned so I wish you luck with this. At the moment all of my ships have placeholder parts that are meant to simulate the weight (at least) of what I will need in the future. I'm hoping that I will be able to edit these parts to include whatever system I decide upon, without having to rebuild everything from scratch.

We all want something that models environmental control, food, water and CO2 processing. Greenhouses and biodomes are the way to make any Life Support mod feature complete, so I'm using a great animated Greenhouse part by Morty_Jhones (I've also seen it attributed to another elsewhere so I'm not 100% sure who made it). The major gameplay challenge is that even if inflatable Greenhouses are too heavy and bulky to include in most of your ships or to lift them back off most planets. It would also be difficult to get them through some re-entries. This creates a logistic challenge where your smaller ships have to flit back and forth to top up their supplies. Call me a masochist but this is my bag!

Anyway I'll be keeping a close eye on this one.

[Mulbin]

Great mod!

I'm having trouble applying resources to stock pods though - for me 3 days is too long as I run a lot of very short missions (orbital, mun etc) and would like to have to manage resources, ideally I'd like 24 hours resources only in the stock pods.

I've tried adding resource lines to the command pods but they don't seem to override the default values, everything still has 3 days!

Any chance you could post an example of what I need to add to the part.cfg to get just 12 hours resource?

[IPster]

This looks great. I love persistent resources, now I have a reason to be afraid of settling on Eeloo.

I just wanted to make sure the forum posts don't give you the impression that everyone wants 100% recycle capability, stock KSP has that already. I would like to have an incentive to limit the stay my research crew has, or have to account for the time to the next transfer window when packing supplies. You might make it so that some places have more useable resources (maybe some planets can sustain infinite habitation), or have an option to not kill kerbals, so that players who don't want to resupply their moon base can just move the oxygen from the crew and have them fall asleep till they need to be woken by the computer(by transferring oxygen back in that pod). I also wanted recommend you consider making a part that has a few kerbal*days, or kerbal*weeks of all the supplies so that players doing short trips to the mun or minimus don't have to add as many parts to their ships.

I'm sure you already have thought of most of this, and so far you have done amazingly. I can't wait to see the release version.

[TaranisElsu]

I would suggest you go for a plugin modular tank approach instead of tacky 'stacked' parts like that. Nobody's going to want to make their ship 50 meters longer because they need a can of O2 stacked on top of a can of water, stacked on top of a can of food. In reality, food provisions for even a few months hardly takes up much space at all, and O2 / water are constantly recycled and can be converted back and forth as well as for electrical generation so again, you wouldn't need tons of it.

This implementation of having to cover your spaceships in **** or make them absurdly long is why I dislike most life support mods. The CSM for the Apollo missions was enough food, water and oxygen for three men to go over a week in space and included living space, fuel, RCS fuel, and tons of other systems, and, well, you can see how much space all that took up.

You'd be much better off with something like the modular fuel tanks mod, where you have a very small piece, which you can then, in the VAB, change the quantities of supplies with a subsequent increase in weight. The lack of such system is why, to be frank, life support mods are still a non-starter. I don't want to have to add a hundred cubic meters of 'supplies' to my ships that weigh unrealistic amounts and take up unrealistic space.

While I think that I have the weight of the supplies correct, I have not done the research nor the calculations to figure out how much space the different resources will take up so my parts are probably way over-sized. As I figure out the balance, that will get better. Note that the parts containing "Life Support" have all three resources so you don't need to add separate containers for Food, Water, and Oxygen.

This version is working flawlessly for me, well done!

Yea the containers aren't very pretty, but that's ok, I got the new procedural fairings and can make containers to hide them if I want

Wonder if you've had any thoughts about you and the IronCross dev's getting together to work on a combined crew support mod? Could be epic

Glad you like it

I can't play right know, so I'll ask: What happens with a kerbal when it dies? Is it removed from the ship or does a dead body stay behind? I'm thinking, maybe there could be a "resource" of dead kerbals that needs to be "depleted" before a ship whose crew died can be re-manned.

Dead Kerbals disappear. We can assume that they are given a proper space burial if/when a salvage vessel comes along.

This looks interesting. For me the two most important things for me when looking for a life support mod is:

Vessel im not focused on consume resources

Ability to generate them so I can make self sustaining colonies.

Btw I love you're fuel balancing mod, won't play ksp without it

Edit: Just had a go of it. It's an awesome mod already I especially like the way he is a read out saying how many days of x resource you have

I'm glad you like this and my fuel balancer mod . As has been mentioned, I am working on recycling parts. Soon^TM

This looks great. I love persistent resources, now I have a reason to be afraid of settling on Eeloo.

I just wanted to make sure the forum posts don't give you the impression that everyone wants 100% recycle capability, stock KSP has that already. I would like to have an incentive to limit the stay my research crew has, or have to account for the time to the next transfer window when packing supplies. You might make it so that some places have more useable resources (maybe some planets can sustain infinite habitation), or have an option to not kill kerbals, so that players who don't want to resupply their moon base can just move the oxygen from the crew and have them fall asleep till they need to be woken by the computer(by transferring oxygen back in that pod). I also wanted recommend you consider making a part that has a few kerbal*days, or kerbal*weeks of all the supplies so that players doing short trips to the mun or minimus don't have to add as many parts to their ships.

I'm sure you already have thought of most of this, and so far you have done amazingly. I can't wait to see the release version.

I'm glad you like it. Thank you. Note that command pods (or anything with crew capacity) automatically come stocked with three days of resources, which is plenty to make a trip to the Mun or Minmus and back with some time to spare.

Great mod!

I'm having trouble applying resources to stock pods though - for me 3 days is too long as I run a lot of very short missions (orbital, mun etc) and would like to have to manage resources, ideally I'd like 24 hours resources only in the stock pods.

I've tried adding resource lines to the command pods but they don't seem to override the default values, everything still has 3 days!

Any chance you could post an example of what I need to add to the part.cfg to get just 12 hours resource?

You can look at my supply containers for examples, or copy the following into whichever part's cfg file. Note that 12 hours = 0.5 * (# of crew) and 24 hours = 1.0 * (# of crew).

RESOURCE
{
    name = Food_TAC
    amount = 0.5
    maxAmount = 0.5
}
RESOURCE
{
    name = Water_TAC
    amount = 0.5
    maxAmount = 0.5
}
RESOURCE
{
    name = Oxygen_TAC
    amount = 0.5
    maxAmount = 0.5
}

Edited August 2, 2013 by TaranisElsu

[Atreiu]

I think I'll move from IonCross Life Support to this mod. Is there any recycling possibility right now? Can I remove all _TAC after resources names?

Interesting mod!

EDIT: Recycling idea: Plants parts that takes very much power ; converts WasteWater to Water ; CO2 to O2, absorbs low quantity of Waste and produces some Food (yes, Kerbals eat plants!). Plants can die and the whole plants part become inactive like Kerbal if theu hadn't enough WasteWater, Waste or CO2. Could be great!

Edited August 2, 2013 by Atreiu

[TaranisElsu]

I think I'll move from IonCross Life Support to this mod. Is there any recycling possibility right now? Can I remove all _TAC after resources names?

Interesting mod!

EDIT: Recycling idea: Plants parts that takes very much power ; converts WasteWater to Water ; CO2 to O2, absorbs low quantity of Waste and produces some Food (yes, Kerbals eat plants!). Plants can die and the whole plants part become inactive like Kerbal if theu hadn't enough WasteWater, Waste or CO2. Could be great!

Yes, you can remove the "_TAC" from the resource names. I did that to avoid conflicts with other mods. Make sure you change the name in both TacResources.cfg and LifeSupport.cfg (created after the first time that you run it).

Full file paths:

{KSP}\GameData\TacLifeSupport\TacResources.cfg

{KSP}\GameData\TacLifeSupport\PluginData\TacLifeSupport\LifeSupport.cfg

[7499275]

Oh goodie! Updated to .21.1 and added containers! I think it is now time to download this and give it a try! Cheers man!

[sidfu]

yay my probes need more than just electricty evenwith no on on them lol. mainlo its cause for some reason cn put 3 kerbils in a remote probe lol

Edited August 4, 2013 by sidfu

[TaranisElsu]

yay my probes need more than just electricty evenwith no on on them lol. mainlo its cause for some reason cn put 3 kerbils in a remote probe lol

Not sure that I understand what you are saying. Life support supplies are only needed by Kerbals. So a vessel with three empty hitchhiker containers would not use any supplies. It would have supplies, just nothing would be consuming the supplies.

[fenderzilla]

Is there any sort of greenhouse or something that will forever recycle CO2 into O2? I have a mun base and a minmus base and I don't want to have to always keep bringing them oxygen.

my idea is 3 kinds of greenhouses:

1: gas-recycle greenhouse

a hydroponic greenhouse of large-leafed plants. perfect for recycling large amounts of CO2 into breathable oxygen.

2: water-recycle greenhouse

a greenhouse full of plants with large root systems, great for extracting impurities from urine to recycle it into drinkable water.

3: nutrient-recycle greenhouse

a greenhouse full of fruit bearing plants, which use fertilizer from organic waste to grow rich fruit.

obviously, greenhouse 1 turns CO2 into O2, 2 turns Wastewater into Water, and 3 turns Waste into Food.

they'd have to be slow and super heavy to balance it, but that makes sense.

[freedomispopular]

Do any of the other planets have oxygen? Is this something that could be accounted for/implemented? i.e. you build a base on a planet with oxygen and therefore you obviously don't have to worry about oxygen requirements.

[TaranisElsu]

Is there any sort of greenhouse or something that will forever recycle CO2 into O2? I have a mun base and a minmus base and I don't want to have to always keep bringing them oxygen.

my idea is 3 kinds of greenhouses:

1: gas-recycle greenhouse

a hydroponic greenhouse of large-leafed plants. perfect for recycling large amounts of CO2 into breathable oxygen.

2: water-recycle greenhouse

a greenhouse full of plants with large root systems, great for extracting impurities from urine to recycle it into drinkable water.

3: nutrient-recycle greenhouse

a greenhouse full of fruit bearing plants, which use fertilizer from organic waste to grow rich fruit.

obviously, greenhouse 1 turns CO2 into O2, 2 turns Wastewater into Water, and 3 turns Waste into Food.

they'd have to be slow and super heavy to balance it, but that makes sense.

I will eventually have some sort of greenhouse part, soon^TM. My goal is to make the recycling as realistic as possible, while keeping it fun. Don't worry , it will get there.

Do any of the other planets have oxygen? Is this something that could be accounted for/implemented? i.e. you build a base on a planet with oxygen and therefore you obviously don't have to worry about oxygen requirements.

Laythe's atmosphere also contains oxygen, so Kerbals will not need oxygen supplies there.

[BoZo]

Is there any sort of greenhouse or something that will forever recycle CO2 into O2? I have a mun base and a minmus base and I don't want to have to always keep bringing them oxygen.

my idea is 3 kinds of greenhouses:

1: gas-recycle greenhouse

a hydroponic greenhouse of large-leafed plants. perfect for recycling large amounts of CO2 into breathable oxygen.

2: water-recycle greenhouse

a greenhouse full of plants with large root systems, great for extracting impurities from urine to recycle it into drinkable water.

3: nutrient-recycle greenhouse

a greenhouse full of fruit bearing plants, which use fertilizer from organic waste to grow rich fruit.

obviously, greenhouse 1 turns CO2 into O2, 2 turns Wastewater into Water, and 3 turns Waste into Food.

they'd have to be slow and super heavy to balance it, but that makes sense.

I started to convert this mod http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/greenhouse/ to be used with TAC for personal use but I havent tried it yet.

[Beeman]

I'd really like to see this mod feature compatibility with something like KASPAR, HOME, Fustek and others

More mod compatibility and collaboration everywhere, I say

[velusip]

I'd really like to see this mod feature compatibility with something like KASPAR, HOME, Fustek and others

More mod compatibility and collaboration everywhere, I say

Modulemanager support makes this quite easy to do. KASPAR and CK parts are perfect for this!

[Kethevin]

Could you help me with the basics a bit. I'm not sure if I'm understanding it correctly.

So basically as Kerbal's are there, the oxygen turns to CO2; waste and wastewater are created as water and food goes down. So at some point I bring more oxygen, food, and water. Is there a special container to pick up the waste and wastewater? Or is that not how it's done? Same thing regarding CO2, from above it sounds like it's stored, not recycled, so I'm assuming I need to remove it before it gets full. :-)

Also, do the resources drop when you are no longer focused on the craft in question?

Thanks for your time.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Kethevin

[johny.smrz]

Hi,

i love this plugin because i think a life support is currently big lack of KSP. I just started to make more fancy parts for storing, creating etc.....

I have some questions:

1) can i have permission to continue? (question for original autor)

2) is there a interes for my parts?

3) can author help me with creating of parts, i am absolute newbie with creating a parts (just good blender artist).

This is a photosynthesis module.

* contains 8 tubes with special alga "Algae Kerbae" wich makes O2 from CO2 and Light

* can create up to 200 units of Oxygen_TAC per day when fully sun illuminated (for 8 kerbalans)

* contains also artificial lighting wich helps witch produce enough light for 50% of performance when module is in dark but consume lot of energy (maybe about 300 units/min) or add 25% of performance.

this is just desired features for this module, nothing works now, i just need some help Well i want to make some other modules like half size of photosynthesis module, water cleaning module in vary sizes (consume energy and waste water => produce water), orbital garden module (consumes lot of energy and waste => produces food).

Well.... maybe there is more posibilities to enchance TAC life support.... for example, harvesting sources on planets (water one leythe), then from water can be produced oxygen and monopropelant (in real on ISS is produced oxygen from water and waste product is H2 wich can be used as propelant).

Chears, Jan

(sorry about my horrible english)