[0.25]KSP Interstellar (Magnetic Nozzles, ISRU Revamp) Version 0.13

[Ashtoruin]

I just find it funny that it has so much dV even after weighing in at ~250tons when full of Kethane.

~Steve

EDIT: Hey Fractal_UK, how about making a couple flags for us?

Oh yeah, my tugs weigh near 300 lbs and a few flag would be awesome though that may be more zzz territory.

Edited October 8, 2013 by Ashtoruin

[NeoAcario]

Oh yeah, my tugs weigh near 300 lbs and a few flag would be awesome though that may be more zzz territory.

Why the heck would a Tug weigh 300tons? It's supposed to MOVE heavy things... not BE heavy!

2 more Qs:

Who's doing the awesome art?

When the CPU gets custom art... it's not going to have its dimensions changed at all, I hope? It's integrated pretty heavily into a few of my ships.

~Steve

EDIT: Gah, I'm slipping. only 13% efficiency launching my 570ton Antimatter Factory into 250km LKO. My avg is 18% !!

[forsaken1111]

300 tons isn't that heavy, and it doesn't matter how heavy something is in space so long as you have sufficient thrust.

[Fractal_UK]

Are you still planning on adding in some fusion reactors as well? They could provide a middle ground between the longevity of nukes and the high output of antimatter, and there are plenty of neat fusion reactions to use to vary the output. Also we could refine helium3 from the mun.

Yep, it's still planned. That was one of the other reasons to get these changes to the fusion resource system complete, we now have a basis on which to build to those fusion reactors.

[NeoAcario]

My 570ton Antimatter Forge... in case anyone's curious. 120 AM per day... just to get a fresh launch on their way to the harvester. I'm assuming harvesters do obscenely better at gathering AM? I honestly have no idea. How much can you get per harvesting device around 900km orbit over Moho?

~Steve

[Ashtoruin]

Why the heck would a Tug weigh 300tons? It's supposed to MOVE heavy things... not BE heavy!

Well the main fuel tank weighs 205 Tons fully fueled, plus 3 2.5m Engines and generators, plus a warp drive and monopropellant = ~300tons

My 570ton Antimatter Forge... in case anyone's curious. 120 AM per day... just to get a fresh launch on their way to the harvester. I'm assuming harvesters do obscenely better at gathering AM? I honestly have no idea. How much can you get per harvesting device around 900km orbit over Moho?

~Steve

Moho is crap for getting antimatter, but one of the best places to get Science, the two best places to collect antimatter with collectors are the sun and Jool

Also, if you're going to make antimatter in space, Collectors are really the way to go imo.

Edited October 8, 2013 by Ashtoruin

[Donziboy2]

Thanks for the heads-up...can't believe I missed that. Guess I'll relaunch that 570ton Antimatter Power Station I just got into a perfect 250km LKO. UGH! Transferring those smart kerbins over will be a pain. Better to know and do it now!

Thanks again... really enjoying the new toys.

~Steve

PS. Upgraded 3m Antimatter reactor with 96k sphere Kethane tank makes for INSANE dV. Over 50k on my massive science vessel! 6k thrust with 14k isp? Yes please!

The 3.5m upgrade AM Reactor + upgraded Gen on a Plasma Thruster with Xenon fuel will give you about 27K thrust and empty the small tank in under 10 seconds. And most likely cause rapid disassemble.

[NeoAcario]

Moho is crap for getting antimatter, but one of the best places to get Science, the two best places to collect antimatter with collectors are the sun and Jool

Also, if you're going to make antimatter in space, Collectors are really the way to go imo.

Ok... so how much do you get per collector? I'm assuming 1,000 km is the ideal altitude as Fractal_UK Said in an earlier post?

The 3.5m upgrade AM Reactor + upgraded Gen on a Plasma Thruster with Xenon fuel will give you about 27K thrust and empty the small tank in under 10 seconds. And most likely cause rapid disassemble.

I tend to avoid methods which invite the Kraken to take a swipe at my ships. 6k Thrust will be WAY more than I'll need.... even with struts all over my ships.

~Steve

Edited October 8, 2013 by NeoAcario

[K3-Chris]

I'm a bit confused here, I just transmitted about 1000 science from my science lab around moho, switched to a stack of cores on kerbin's surface second after, hit "Receive Scientific Data" and... I got 3 ish science, what?

[Hremsfeld]

I'm a bit confused here, I just transmitted about 1000 science from my science lab around moho, switched to a stack of cores on kerbin's surface second after, hit "Receive Scientific Data" and... I got 3 ish science, what?

Check your total science. It's an all-vessel flow, like monopropellant. If you've got a big enough stack of cores, it's possible that 3ish science each still adds up. Also, note that Receive Scientific Data works in increments of 100.

[K3-Chris]

I transferred all the silence to one core, transmitted multiple times, could receive once, got a total of 3.

[Fractal_UK]

I transferred all the silence to one core, transmitted multiple times, could receive once, got a total of 3.

Someone else reported this problem a while back, I spent some time working on it but wasn't able to reproduce it. If you could send me a copy of your WarpPlugin.cfg file found in your save folder, it would be much appreciated.

[K3-Chris]

Errm, no need to sent it, only contains a single line: "writtenat = 10/6/2013 11:44:57 PM" I used TAC Fuel Balancer to transfer the science to a single Computer Core before transmitting if that matters.

[Fractal_UK]

Errm, no need to sent it, only contains a single line: "writtenat = 10/6/2013 11:44:57 PM" I used TAC Fuel Balancer to transfer the science to a single Computer Core before transmitting if that matters.

Any chance you could try repeating this without using TAC Fuel Balancer and seeing if that improves the results?

I've just spent some time building some obscure ships with labs all over the place and docking ports seperating labs out, enabling/disabling crossfeed on them, etc. to try and make the science transmission go wrong but it carries on working fine every time. If I have all the science in one lab, it transmits only from one lab, if I have all the science spread out it transmits from all labs equally.

Sorry I can't help you more at the moment.

[Donziboy2]

Did you guys by chance install on top of an older version of the mod?

-Fixed 1.25m antimatter reactor antimatter consumption rates

Pardon me while I go cry in a corner....

Edited October 8, 2013 by Donziboy2

[ROFLCopter64bit]

Just a question, when 0.22 comes out, are you going to merge the science system you made with R&D? It feels like it would be better, since you wouldn't have to upgrade each individual part.

[Fractal_UK]

Just a question, when 0.22 comes out, are you going to merge the science system you made with R&D? It feels like it would be better, since you wouldn't have to upgrade each individual part.

That is the plan, yes. Hopefully I can figure out how to assign new tech nodes to really make this into an almost seemless extension of the stock tech tree, that's what I'm aiming for.

[Seyvern]

That is the plan, yes. Hopefully I can figure out how to assign new tech nodes to really make this into an almost seemless extension of the stock tech tree, that's what I'm aiming for.

I'd suggest if you are going to make it a seamless extension, you'll need to reconcile your Nuclear thermal rockets with stocks. Honestly your stock values drove me nuts and kept me from using hte mod for a while, but then I just altered things to bring your rockets in line with stocks. now I don't use stock NERVA anymore, which was the goal. I posted my spreadsheet values on page 120 or something around there.

-Seyv

[forsaken1111]

I'd suggest if you are going to make it a seamless extension, you'll need to reconcile your Nuclear thermal rockets with stocks. Honestly your stock values drove me nuts and kept me from using hte mod for a while, but then I just altered things to bring your rockets in line with stocks. now I don't use stock NERVA anymore, which was the goal. I posted my spreadsheet values on page 120 or something around there.

-Seyv

Its the stock engines that should be altered. Their values are wildly overpowered for what they're supposed to represent.

[Sigma]

Will there be a simpler way to acquire deuterium? Maybe some water tanks that you could carry with the spacecraft?

[Donziboy2]

I think the reactors are more for power generation for labs and such.

Or if upgraded in the case of the 3.75m and a DT Vista they give long term power for an Uber High ISP engine.

We will have to see what the fusion reactors give us.

[Patupi]

OK, first.... WOW! I haven't tried this (haven't had the time to DL and test yet. Definitely going to) but it looks fantastic! The effort put in and the variety resulting from all this looks very impressive. Unfortunately I missed this mod. Seeing 'KSP Interstellar' I thought it was just another hyperedit/warp drive mod which doesn't really interest me. Boy was I wrong. Wish I'd followed this from the beginning.

Well I've tried to read all this thread but... OK it's a lot; 140 pages (with standard posts per page at least) to sort through. I got to page 33 before I gave up. I've read the last three pages just to see but I'd like to suggest something.

I know science is an upcoming project in the stock 0.22 that's due... whenever, but the science upgrades in this might be done more like a traditional tech tree with some minor modification. I take it you still have to click 'upgrade' on a component to upgrade it to a new version? Why not move this functionality to the science lab itself?

IE a lab would now have two buttons. One 'Upgrade science facility' and 'Upgrade components'. The first would use science accrued, and basically would make the lab the 'next level'. How many levels it should have would be a good question. The second button would display a second menu with a list of components the lab could upgrade. Along side each item would be a 'highlight' button that would make the actual item highlighted in the same manner (perhaps a different color?) as when you move the mouse cursor over it. That way you could tell which of the vessels currently docked to the science facility you are affecting. Next to this button for each item on the list would be multiple 'upgrade buttons'. (EDIT:forgot to add, if the science facility isn't high enough for this tech this upgrade would be grayed out)

Multiple? Why start with antimatter reactors being able to be built from scratch? It's rather advanced tech after all. Start with something else that could be upgraded to antimatter (a specialist reactor? Maybe inertial confinement fusion? Barely believable that that could be upgraded to an antimatter reactor) Basically any item could be upgraded to it's next option (nuclear reactor Mk1 to Mk2) or to something else (nuclear reactor Mk1 to Toroidal Fusion Mk1... yeah, not a good choice. Totally different tech, but you get the idea). Thus a tech tree of sorts is born. Not every thing would have multiple options, but anything you think would be too advanced for Kerbalkind to start with could be put as an upgrade on an existing piece of equipment.

This component upgrading could use a second resource (development rather than science? As in Research and Development) or could be time based. IE when you click 'upgrade' to whatever you have chosen it changes to something else, a default 'non functional' version of the unit to represent the ongoing work. Then, as long as the component stays docked to the science lab, it will be upgraded after a fixed span of time. At the end of the time it would be replaced by the finished item.

This would mean that it would take time and effort to make a lab capable to upgrade components, but once it's there you could upgrade craft relatively easily, with perhaps time or other resource costs.

One problem this might bring would be size/shape compatibility between upgrades of different types. Are the models for fission reactors similar in size/shape to fusion reactors?

I'm sorry if someone else has suggested this previously but once the idea occurred to me I had to put it down before I forgot about it. This happens to me from time to time.

Edited October 8, 2013 by Patupi
details

[Scotius]

Fractal - i think you should add some passive heat radiation even from parts that are not radiators. If parts generate heat when they work, they also should cool off slowly when idle. On one of my ships i've opened a Gigantor for a moment, generated 4 units of heat and closed panel again - and the heat stayed in system for good (this ship has no radiators since it was launched before they were added).

[Fractal_UK]

I am aware that the basic nuclear thermal rockets are weak for KSP parts, this is because I've tried to use reasonably sensible values for nuclear reactor power/mass ratios, for example, the 3.75m part (which is the one that is arguably still decent in this mod) is based on the real NERVA engine. Since I'm comitted to having rocket engines that actually don't require more energy than they consume, I'm constrained by an absolute limit on the performance of the nuclear rockets. The only way I can add more thrust to the existing rockets is by taking away Isp and that really doesn't help or by making the nuclear reactors more powerful, which affects the balance of the whole rest of the mod.

I am however looking for something else that I can do to make these parts better - the toggleable propellants, I think, are a good start to this end but I am giving thought to more options. Nitrogen propellant might now be something to consider, since it's abundant in many atmospheres and would offer a straightforward refueling option but I am open to suggestions here.

Perhaps the right option is simply to make the upgraded reactor a bit cheaper, since although those don't have great thrust, they offer enough of a specific impulse improvement to still be very useful.

I'm open to suggestions anyway.

[Donziboy2]

Ok, did my homework for the night:) Time to make stuff go UP one way or another:P

I added the actually MW/kN to it so you can tell how much thrust your getting for your energy.

Edit, swapped image for an easier to read version.

Edited October 9, 2013 by Donziboy2