Project Minmus - Three crafts in one

[Gijs]

I've been playing Kerbal Space Program for a couple of days/weeks now. I really like the learning curve in this game. First I was happy I could get my ship into orbit. Then I was happy I could get it back safely as well. Then I got to the Mun (but not back). Then I was able to dock crafts, build a space station and refuel my ships. Then I could get to the Mun and back. And my latest pride is Project Minmus.

It consists of one big lander with attached to it two crafts: one small ship and one rover. The small ship can be used as a one-man return craft. It can easily get back to Kerbin. You could even stop by the Mun if you wanted to. It also has a bunch of equipment used for testing. You could get it into orbit around Minmus and then land it again if you want to. The rover isn't really that great for the low gravity at Minmus. You have to drive really carefully. In case you flip over, it has RCS to get it back on its feet.

Both the rover and the one-man ship are roughly the same weight, but at launch it's best to keep an eye on your navball because you might tilt over a bit.

Here are the three of them on Minmus:

The main ship only has place for two, but you can always put an extra Kerbal in the one-man ship if you want. The main ship has parachutes, but the one-man ship has not (I forgot to add them). But because you have plenty of fuel left in the one-man ship, you should be able to land at Kerbin.

The main ship also has a big docking port at the top. Just in case.

The rest of the staging is below the main ship engine. Just regular asparagus staging. 5 x 3 of the second largest tanks, 1 in the middle and 4 at the sides.

So, what do you think? I'm just happy it can get to Minmus and back. Next step is Laythe, or maybe Duna. I heard nuclear engines are best for that.

[Procyon]

Nice, would love to see the launch configuration.

[SDIR]

How do you learn to dock in a COUPLE OF WEEKS??? And that ship looks pretty nice. Looks like it could act as a sort of inter-body base, able to jump from place to place. And I agree, nukes would be good. But it may be easier to just re-use the ship you have on Minmus now and just use a nuclear powered tug instead. That way if you make it to Jool or Duna, you can hop around each of the moons without worrying about fuel all that much; and you can also put that large docking port to use as well.

[128MB]

Gijs you learned quick took me half a year to achieve what you did by now.

[Gijs]

How do you learn to dock in a COUPLE OF WEEKS??? And that ship looks pretty nice. Looks like it could act as a sort of inter-body base, able to jump from place to place. And I agree, nukes would be good. But it may be easier to just re-use the ship you have on Minmus now and just use a nuclear powered tug instead. That way if you make it to Jool or Duna, you can hop around each of the moons without worrying about fuel all that much; and you can also put that large docking port to use as well.

Is that fast or slow? I don't know, first I thought docking was incredibly difficult. But now I just set target on the docking port I want to dock at, use "control from here" on my own ship, then roughly put the two at the same angle and then just use the navbal with target mode. I don't even have to use chase cam. Can be confusing that sometimes left, right, up and down are inverted, but there is no left, right, up and down anyway in space. I just look at the navball, and I just "slide" in place, at the end only at a speed of 0.2 m/s. Then I turn off SAS and the rest it does automatically. The only thing I have to watch out for is that my angle of approach isn't too horizontal. If I dock larger payloads, that can make the whole thing wobble too much to dock. But that is easily fixed by backing up for a moment, positioning yourself roughly in front of the target and then try again.

I like designing ships as much as flying them, so I won't be using the Project Minmus design for interplanetary trips. It is designed to land on Minmus (and Mun), and that's what I will use it for.

Right now I'm in the process of designing an interplanetary ship called Miss Gilly. She is supposed to get to Gilly, but should be able to get to other places as well (and back!). As long as these places don't have an atmosphere.

By the way, I do not use MechJeb. Still not really sure what it is, but apparently one half of the community uses it, and the other doesn't. And apparently it is important to mention it.

Oh, and here are the craft files:

Project Minmus (original, without rover and one-man ship): http://www.mijnbestand.nl/Bestand-WTG3VPPUVBZN.craft

Project Minmus Mk2 (with rover and one-man ship): http://www.mijnbestand.nl/Bestand-8KRR3WCPL6I3.craft

Note that Mk2 lags a little at launch. Also, as said before, the launch is a little unstable because of the unstable payload (rover and one-man ship). I think it has a few parts too many.

The launch stage probably isn't the most efficient, but it gets into orbit.

[shand]

How do you learn to dock in a COUPLE OF WEEKS???

I practised bumping noses the day before the update and docked the day after. some things come easier to some people..

OP - why dont you try a more vertical payload loading. the one man return vessel could easily sit atop the other one. the rover could be below the main vessel - you probably dont need that central rocket. and the amount of RCS may be more then you need.

Of course the only benefit of this is it will look prettier

Try Duna next (some people say try ike first, but lets face it, go big or go home). i prefered to design a complete new vessel, but tweaking that one would also work as SDIR says

[Gijs]

Gijs you learned quick took me half a year to achieve what you did by now.

What can I say. Scott Manley is really helpful.

With docking, I learned that you don't have to mess around with getting the orbit exactly aligned. As long as it is roughly the same, and as long as it interesects somewhere (within the 50-100 km range would be good), then you should be able to dock. The further away you are, the more fuel you are going to waste of course. But 50km isn't as far as you would think. Thrust towards the target, be sure to thrust the opposite direction soon enough, repeat this a few times, and eventually your orbit will align by itself (naturally so: being in an orbit besides another ship means you are in the same orbit).

At first I could get to the Mun, but not back. So I learned to dock and built a whole space station around Kerbin. It lagged like hell because of all the parts. Now I don't use it. With Project Minmus, you can get to Minmus and back without refueling.

[shand]

Scott manley is the booombb.

Gijs, i like you. great lateral thinking!

have you tried a apollo style mission - leaving a support/command module in orbit around mun and docking back with it.

I managed one that was either "perfect" or "not enough fuel" depending on if you think using RCS for final circularisation - intercept and docking is "not enough"

[Gijs]

I practised bumping noses the day before the update and docked the day after. some things come easier to some people..

OP - why dont you try a more vertical payload loading. the one man return vessel could easily sit atop the other one. the rover could be below the main vessel - you probably dont need that central rocket. and the amount of RCS may be more then you need.

Of course the only benefit of this is it will look prettier

Try Duna next (some people say try ike first, but lets face it, go big or go home). i prefered to design a complete new vessel, but tweaking that one would also work as SDIR says

My ships are anything but efficient. Bringing too much RCS and batteries with me is something I have always done. I don't even know why.

Regarding the central rocket: you are probably right. At first I didn't have it. Now I have. But with the fuel ducts, it runs so quickly out of fuel that it's rather useless.

I already wrote another post answering some of the questions, but it is awaiting approval. I uploaded 2 craft files, which is probably why.

And you are right, I used this method because it looked prettier. I saw the beam structure (and balancing out two crafts) in a video somewhere and I wanted to try it. But the rover -below- the ship? How does that work with the launch staging? I have actually tried something like this, where I turned around the whole lander and put it upside down on my launch stage. The rover was on top, but actually on the bottom when you landed. Problem was that all my controls where inverted. Which made it more difficult than you'd think.

The rover is **** anyway, but I'm just happy I could get to Minmus and back. My next ship will be more efficient.

[Gijs]

Scott manley is the booombb.

Gijs, i like you. great lateral thinking!

have you tried a apollo style mission - leaving a support/command module in orbit around mun and docking back with it.

I managed one that was either "perfect" or "not enough fuel" depending on if you think using RCS for final circularisation - intercept and docking is "not enough"

Ah, that sounds like a fun project. But first things first. A trip to Gilly with my new ship I'm designing: Miss Gilly. It will also be my first interplanetary rocket. (One post still needs moderation approval because I uploaded 2 craft files, but I tell some more about Miss Gilly in there).

[shand]

hehe awesome i'll be sure to check it out!

rover below the ship works if you replace the central engine with it. (and maybe the RCS if you need a bit more room), so you'd have the outer rockets for power, staging can just be tacked onto the bottom of the rover simples - just strut around it!

I'm OCD symmetrical -but i've just downloaded the gimble balancing mod so i may give things like your design a go sometime!

[Gijs]

hehe awesome i'll be sure to check it out!

rover below the ship works if you replace the central engine with it. (and maybe the RCS if you need a bit more room), so you'd have the outer rockets for power, staging can just be tacked onto the bottom of the rover simples - just strut around it!

I'm OCD symmetrical -but i've just downloaded the gimble balancing mod so i may give things like your design a go sometime!

The gimble balancing mod probably is useful with Project Minmus. The first stage works okay, but once you start to turn and approach 15km, using the wasd keys all the time can be tiresome.

I just like to try new things. With the first Project Minmus I noticed how useful those 4 outer rockets are. Make the whole thing really stable and very easy to land. Then I improved it a bit and added the rover and extra ship. Originally I only wanted to bring the rover, but I designed the one-man ship to balance it out.

Ah yeah, with strutting it can work. It always looks so fragile though.

[iDan122]

It took me 2 years to master Orbiter 2010 and a week to learn to rendezvous in KSP. My very first intercept was 35km apart, yay.

[shand]

Ah yeah, with strutting it can work. It always looks so fragile though.

Personally i'm using the procedural fairings mod, so my whole payload is in a fairing on launch - makes things a lot stronger, and looks so - i try not to use struts between bits of my vehicles that arent likely to be physically wielded together. on a side note i also use procedural tanks and subassembly manager to make standardised launch vehicles.

[DisarmingBaton5]

It took me a few days to learn to dock (first try!), but the docking itself took a long time. (I would guess 1-2h)

Anyway, nice crafts! I suggest expanding your fleet to include more base components, and build a... base.