[1.02] BioMass - Renewable Bio Fuel and Supplemental Life Support Modules

[Patupi]

Note on atmospherics (in case you haven't already done this research. Please tell me if I'm being silly and duplicating things you've already done! )

From our universe:

Venus atmosphere:

Carbon dioxide: 96 percent

Nitrogen: 3.5 percent

Carbon monoxide, argon, sulfur dioxide, and water vapor: less than 1 percent

Titan atmosphere:

Nitrogen: 98.4%

Methane: 1.4%

Hydrogen: 0.1-0.2%

Hydrocarbons (ethane, diacetylene, methylacetylene, acetylene, propane, cyanoacetylene, hydrogen cyanide, carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, cyanogen, argon and helium): trace amounts

(Note, if we base Laythe off anything from Titan there would have to be severe changes. No oxygen on Titan of course, but we could stick with high nitrogen, low methane and similar trace elements. Not sure how much oxygen should be present. If jet engines work I'd suggest more than 10%. More likely 15% minimum)

(note, this is from the stratosphere. Not sure whether anything specific is known of low altitude atmospherics on Titan)

Mars atmosphere:

Carbon dioxide: 95.32 percent

Nitrogen: 2.7 percent

Argon: 1.6 percent

Oxygen: 0.13 percent

Carbon monoxide: 0.08 percent

Also, minor amounts of: water, nitrogen oxide, neon, hydrogen-deuterium-oxygen, krypton and xenon

I'll see if I can find threads of Laythe's, Eve's and Duna's specific atmosphere beyond the Wiki's

(EDIT: No luck as yet. I've found a few threads but all with non-specific info. I think the only mention was that someone thought there might be a high iodine content in Eve's atmosphere/hydrosphere to explain the color. Any other chemicals give a nice pink/purple color? Bear in mind high temperature/pressure too, so some chemicals might not give the right color under those conditions. From what I can find Potassium might also be a good purple coloured gas for Eve)

Edited December 27, 2013 by Patupi

[Patupi]

OK, didn't think of checking FAR, but his mod has recently specified atmospheric composition:

First implementation of atmospheric composition!

--Density (used for aero calculations) is now a function of pressure, temperature and gas properties, not just an upscaling of pressure

--Speed of sound is dependent on gas properties, with heavier gases resulting in lower speeds of sound

--Kerbin is given an atmospphere equivalent to Earth's: ~21% O2, ~78% N2, ~1% Ar

--Duna and Eve are given atmospheres similiar to Mars and Venus: ~95% CO2, ~5% N2

--Jool is given an atmosphere equivalent to a gas giant: ~90% H2, 10% He; it's temperature curve is also shifted to create more appropriate temperatures

--Laythe is given an oxygenated atmosphere with volcanic components: ~21% 02, ~9% N2, ~35% CO2, ~35% SO2

--Any additional bodies can be modified in the config.xml; properties default to Earth atmosphere

This might help, and keep things a little more consistent with FAR

[Fractal_UK]

Oh, I totally agree. Right now there isn't a good way to define gasses on a pre-planet basis. We're working on it, though.

You can certainly use the Interstellar resource system to do this for people with both of these mods installed. You can use ModuleManager configs to make new resources or change the resources that are extractable from planetary atmospheres. Here is an example of such a config node:

ATMOSPHERIC_RESOURCE_DEFINITION
{
	name = KerbinOxygen // unique ID
	guiName = Oxygen // display name of resource
	celestialBodyName = Kerbin // celestial body to apply constituent to
	resourceName = Oxidizer // resource that you can extract from the atmosphere in this proportion
	abundance = 0.20946 // abundance of resource in the atmosphere
}

You can modify existing nodes with MM or create entirely new nodes if you wish. This may or may not be a solution that is useful to you. Because these are simply config nodes, you can distribute them with your work without creating any kind of cross-plugin dependence.

Edited December 28, 2013 by Fractal_UK

[Patupi]

This is independent of mod dll? Interesting. I wasn't aware you could define it that way. I'm assuming stock system has no method of defining anything based on Biomes that MM could alter? Or from liquids rather than air? I assume it has to be based on planetary environments, as in 'Duna has no oxygen, Kerbin/Laythe has oxygen' from the stock game. This is an extrapolation of that. Nice that MM can utilize that directly with percentage recovery. Can you use this to extract multiple resources from one body's atmosphere? IE define 'ATMOSPHERIC_RESOURCE_DEFINITION' twice for one body for CO2 and Oxygen without them conflicting?

[Fractal_UK]

This is independent of mod dll? Interesting. I wasn't aware you could define it that way. I'm assuming stock system has no method of defining anything based on Biomes that MM could alter? Or from liquids rather than air? I assume it has to be based on planetary environments, as in 'Duna has no oxygen, Kerbin/Laythe has oxygen' from the stock game. This is an extrapolation of that. Nice that MM can utilize that directly with percentage recovery. Can you use this to extract multiple resources from one body's atmosphere? IE define 'ATMOSPHERIC_RESOURCE_DEFINITION' twice for one body for CO2 and Oxygen without them conflicting?

No, it isn't independent of the mod dll but it doesn't create any kind of dependence because the base game cannot do anything with ATMOSPHERIC_RESOURCE_DEFINITION config nodes so if you distribute some suitable MM configs, people with Interstellar will see the new resource definitions and those without will see nothing change, i.e. nothing will break. In the long run, I might be interested in stripping this resource system out of Interstellar so it's easier for other mods to hook into directly especially if these are the kind of problems other modders are running into.

There is no specific requirement to respect the the existing planetary environment but it's a good idea to do so thematically. You shouldn't define the same resource twice but you can edit the existing definition with MM.

[seanth]

In the long run, I might be interested in stripping this resource system out of Interstellar so it's easier for other mods to hook into directly especially if these are the kind of problems other modders are running into.

Yes, please.

I'm a fan of mods that do one thing and do it well. So, while it makes sense that Interstellar wants to be able to harvest gasses fro other planets, it would be much nicer to have the gas harvesting dll separate from the other parts needed for Interstellar. Having to rely on the entire Interstellar dll just for the ability to harvest gasses isn't very convenient.

[Patupi]

No, it isn't independent of the mod dll but it doesn't create any kind of dependence because the base game cannot do anything with ATMOSPHERIC_RESOURCE_DEFINITION config nodes so if you distribute some suitable MM configs, people with Interstellar will see the new resource definitions and those without will see nothing change, i.e. nothing will break. In the long run, I might be interested in stripping this resource system out of Interstellar so it's easier for other mods to hook into directly especially if these are the kind of problems other modders are running into.

There is no specific requirement to respect the the existing planetary environment but it's a good idea to do so thematically. You shouldn't define the same resource twice but you can edit the existing definition with MM.

Sorry I misunderstood. Utilizing your resource routines separately would be very handy. I personally use KSPI a lot, but I know it's not everyone's cup of tea. Having this part of it as something anyone could use apart from that would be a help, even if only to cut down on memory usage from minimizing mods.

Thanks for the clarification Fractal_UK. Guess it was just too late for me over here and I wasn't paying enough attention to what you were saying.

[azyouthinkyouiz]

"Then, the BioReactor consumes the BioMass to create Liquid Fuel and Oxidizer. During the reaction an excess of oxidizer is produced. The excess can then be used in the Compressor to out put either MonoPropellant or XenonGas."

No, it doesn't. It uses all of your biomass without producing anything at all.

[Roboto]

"Then, the BioReactor consumes the BioMass to create Liquid Fuel and Oxidizer. During the reaction an excess of oxidizer is produced. The excess can then be used in the Compressor to out put either MonoPropellant or XenonGas."

No, it doesn't. It uses all of your biomass without producing anything at all.

If you could post more details about your problem we would be happy to help you, but in the couple months and 24 pages of posts here, I haven't seen anyone else report this problem.

[azyouthinkyouiz]

Sorry, you're right of course. I built an orbital construction-enabled station and would like to use this to produce fuel rather than hauling it up if possible. I have all the relevant parts attached to the station and can successfully produce biomass, but when I use the green bioreactor to convert the biomass into fuel, it empties all of my biomass-storing parts and doesn't produce fuel. There is room in the fuel tank connected to the bioreactor. Kerbal: 0.23, Biomass: Dec 19, 2013

[Zzabur]

I got about the same problem. I am using the greenhouse and it produces Biomass, i can harvest Biocake using the greenhouse. But the Algae bioreactor and the Bioreactor don't seem to work. On the algae bioreactor, i got items in menu to start reaction, but it doesn't do anything when i activate it, and the Bioreactor doesn't have any menu at all (except fuel levels) so i can't activate it.

I will post screenshots to make it more explicit, but it seems that except greenhouse, all other modules are'nt working at all on my game session.

Edit : It seems that the "harvest seed" on the algae bioreactor is working fine, i get some biocake at a low rate, but using the "biomass harvest" give nothing. I get some kethane too, but i don't know which module gives me that. I am uploading screenshots, but i got a problem with cloud

Edit2 : using fuel balancer mod, i managed to place some seeds and biomass in the algae bioreactor, and it produce now properly. The bioreactor seem to produce too some liquid fuel. But i don't know if i got all biomass parts, because :

-no modules can refine oxidizer

-no modules can make waste and wastewater

-no modules can make xenon or monopropellant

-Food seem to be useless, i can't do anything with it

I am using the biomass biology + downloaded from github(19 Dec 2013)

It seems the old version from the spaceport works properly though.

Edited January 3, 2014 by Zzabur

[KeithStone]

Dunno if you were aware, but it looks like open resource system is starting to catch on, Interstellar is hooking in for the next release... http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/64595-Open-Resource-System-%28ORS%29-Mod-Resource-API-version-1-0-0

Edited January 6, 2014 by KeithStone
first page of ORS instead of last.

[seanth]

snip

I am using the biomass biology + downloaded from github(19 Dec 2013)

It seems the old version from the spaceport works properly though.

We're in the process of rolling out a new github release (hopefully today, 2014-01-06). This thread is being superseded by http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/53009-0-21-BioMass-Renewable-Bio-Fuel-Modules?p=854819&viewfull=1#post854819, so I guess watch for things there?

[JeffreyCor]

Same problem as those reporting above, bioreactor is consuming biomass and not producing fuel. I used to work, but no longer is. Found this is Spaceport version 9.1.14 edition but also had in prior version, downloaded and installed updated hoping it would have a fix.

I copied over an over version of Biomass and it has the same problem. It appears an update with another mod is interfering with this one.

After finding a problem with Kethane also not producing fuel it looks like it could be a problem specific to my space station and not a mod problem. Guess I have to build a new station

Edited January 10, 2014 by JeffreyCor

[Roboto]

Same problem as those reporting above, bioreactor is consuming biomass and not producing fuel. I used to work, but no longer is. Found this is Spaceport version 9.1.14 edition but also had in prior version, downloaded and installed updated hoping it would have a fix.

I copied over an over version of Biomass and it has the same problem. It appears an update with another mod is interfering with this one.

After finding a problem with Kethane also not producing fuel it looks like it could be a problem specific to my space station and not a mod problem. Guess I have to build a new station

OK let me know if you still have problems. I just updated the spaceport version a day ago, and was pretty sure it was working, but you never know.

[JeffreyCor]

made a quick and ugly assembly on the runway to test if things are working together, and that processed biomass into fuel as it should. I have no idea why it would stop working on one ship/flight alone. Maybe another weird thing of being a pre-release of the game.

[seanth]

Since people are still posting here:

Testers Wanted!

Required:

**Kethane Mod (for the generator module):

**Module Manager

I believe I have sorted out the most significant problems with the version that allows for difficulty levels. For those interested in helping by testing, please download the latest (2.4a). I'm especially interested in people familiar with Module Manager because I have a sneaking suspicion my Module Manager files might have errors.

I will be updating things as I get feedback. Once testing gets a bit further I'll move it to github. I just thought people would like "snapshots" to see how things are working. Next up is to look at the generation of fuels and gasses.

To help testers, there's a file giving some basic expectations on how the difficulty levels should work here.

My focus has been on how the greenhouse behaves, but compressors also have difficulty levels. Please do give it a try and see how it is for playability.

Edited January 16, 2014 by seanth

[BigD145]

Did you have to refolder parts again in Science+? I like things organized but damn all the craft with parts are deleted...

[royying]

I can't make the mod work to generate biomass,

any dependance mod or dll need to install?

[seanth]

I can't make the mod work to generate biomass,

any dependance mod or dll need to install?

Yes. You need the kethane dll for basic things to work. If you continue to have problems, please post at http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/62631-BioMass-Ongoing-Development

[KvickFlygarn87]

I can test!

[seanth]

I can test!

Cool. We've moved the test versions on to github: https://github.com/VigilanteInc/BioMass

If you run into problems or have ideas/opinions, please post at http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/62631-BioMass-Ongoing-Development. You can always submit issues on github, too.

[Doctor Axel]

Hnnnnnng, this mod looks awesome. I eagerly await its integration with TAC.

Has any thought been given to in-the-field harvesting of life support resources? Like water from crater ice, or biomass from hydrocarbons, stuff like that? Maybe outside the scope of this mod but it would dovetail nicely...

[Roboto]

Hnnnnnng, this mod looks awesome. I eagerly await its integration with TAC.

Has any thought been given to in-the-field harvesting of life support resources? Like water from crater ice, or biomass from hydrocarbons, stuff like that? Maybe outside the scope of this mod but it would dovetail nicely...

As is, this mod does integrate with TAC pretty solidly. Give it a shot. The version on spaceport is much more stable currently, but is more geared toward casual gameplay.

We have thought about some future plans for more advanced features, and your ideas there are also pretty cool and worth consideration, but at the moment we are focused on fleshing out a really cool interface and dll work.

We have a new team member on board, Jaraxle (please welcome him when you see him) who has shown us some really awesome stuff hes building for the mod. We will have more info on what that all includes pretty soon. Can't really let the Kerbal out of the bag yet, but the next release we make is looking like it will be a HUGE step forward!

[Doctor Axel]

awesome stuff

I think I will. ^^ If I'm more interested in the TAC stuff than I am the fuel conversion stuff, should I download the spaceport version or the github version? I saw in the RnD thread that some changes would need to be made to the TAC config files, is that still true?