[0.23.5] TreeLoader - Custom Career Tech-tree Loader 1.1.5

[123nick]

where can one find tree-edit? i looked EVERYWHERE and i cant find it!

[Pingonaut]

Traditional Tech: A stock node tech tree

Aims to make the progression of unlocks closer to the history of human flight and space tech by reorganizing the stock nodes and moving parts within them.

Oooh excited to see this in action!

[LuciferNZ]

Huh… I seem to be having issues getting SCANsat to work with Yargnit's tree. I'm posting this here since I think the modified tree is the reason I'm having issues.

However, after loading the game, the tech tree still refused to contain the parts, and upon re-opening the persistence file I discovered that my modifications had been removed.

Anyone care to point out what I'm doing wrong? I'd really like to get these mapping parts into my career game!

Edit: Actually, come to think of it, no mods except for Kerbal Engineer one have worked with this tree. Is it that only supported mods can actually be used? Is there no way to manually add other mod parts?

Unfortunately no, the TreeLoader will not include mods unless the mod has been added explicitly to the tree.

Thats why Ive made a tech tree for Mod inclusion Its in testing, but you should see it soon to load.

(Edit: TreeLOADER, not TreeEdit...)

[TelluriumCrystal]

Unfortunately no, the TreeLoader will not include mods unless the mod has been added explicitly to the tree.

Thats why Ive made a tech tree for Mod inclusion Its in testing, but you should see it soon to load.

(Edit: TreeLOADER, not TreeEdit...)

It's my understanding, however, that treeloader only downloads the information for a particular tree once. So thus it should be possible to modify said information and add mods to the tree? Is that not what the tree.cfg file is for?

Surely there must be some way (no matter what hackery is required) to force mods to be available in my career game. I really don't want to have to start over again…

[vardicd]

It's my understanding, however, that treeloader only downloads the information for a particular tree once. So thus it should be possible to modify said information and add mods to the tree? Is that not what the tree.cfg file is for?

Surely there must be some way (no matter what hackery is required) to force mods to be available in my career game. I really don't want to have to start over again…

I've found that by editing the mod part files to fit the stock techtree, they show up no matter what tree I load in my game, I'm using Kethane, KAS, Engineer, remote tech, and others and they all show up.

[vardicd]

Ok, I've got a curious bug, I've been playing with Traditional Tech by Nazari 1382, and I've noticed that my science haul per mission is getting cut bad. I had one experiment the report told me was worth 120, but on recovery I got 8. and it doesn't happen with any other tech trees, has anybody else seen this? I sent a message to Nazari about it, but I'm looking for other inputs. Does anyone know of any mod conflicts that can cause this?

[LuciferNZ]

@vardicd - did you happen to send a whole heap of trasmitted data of the same type? Because the returns get smaller for the same research topic (each biome etc)

[vardicd]

@vardicd - did you happen to send a whole heap of trasmitted data of the same type? Because the returns get smaller for the same research topic (each biome etc)

No it was a one experiment shot, new science part, here's links to screenshots I took of the experiment, and the results on recovery.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B80kA-XeDQQlWDlHRWM2WWJPLUE/edit?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B80kA-XeDQQlemJtaVFtWThtNzg/edit?usp=sharing

[Keloooe_Pest]

This is a must have in my KSP install! I am loving the new layout

[LuciferNZ]

No it was a one experiment shot, new science part, here's links to screenshots I took of the experiment, and the results on recovery.

On further experimentation, its now happening on all tech trees including stock, so I'm going to try a fresh install after work in the morning.

What science part is that, it has odd transmit data.

The data value = 0.1 in the second screenshot is the bug Im guessing? Are those science parts stock?

Ive run many MANY mods with my modded science tree (Using TreeLoader), and had no problems so far, although Im using stock science parts. (Correct me if Im wrong, and thats a stock sci part)

[LoSboccacc]

Playing with traditional tech tree and I am loving it so far!

Having to get that precious biome science finally got me a reason to perfect plane building

It may feels a bit grindy at times because you need to really go at all places just to unlock science generating parts, but I like the slow progression, would be pointless otherwise to unlock everything up to rockets at the beginning.

[Nazari1382]

Glad to hear. It's brand new, so it still may need some changes. But I started a new game yesterday and I think the amount of effort you need to put in to get to the first rocket unlocks is tuned well.

[BrickedKeyboard]

I'd like to be able to use KSP Interstellar and Kethane with a modified tree.

How do I do this? Does someone else have the part files already unlocked, or is there some option in the GUI?

The current tree is kind of silly, at the beginning of the game you are ridiculously limited, then pretty soon there's an overwhelming number of options and no need for them. (such as all the airplane ones)

[Nazari1382]

Start a new game with Treeloader installed and it will let you select a tree when you start.

[BrickedKeyboard]

Feedback on "tradional tech" : The nodes "experimental aerodynamics, aerospace tech, experimental motors, robotics, nanolathing"

all contain no parts. I think that these nodes need a part or two, each, players don't like empty unlocks.

[spudcosmic]

When do you think the public will be getting TreeEdit?

[BrickedKeyboard]

Alright, I found out that simply cutting and pasting the top 3 nodes from the "KSP Interstellar" config file into "tree.cfg" from Yargnits tree 1.0a works perfectly. I've tried all the trees available in the loader, and Yargnit's is still the best one. This is because while I really do like the idea of being required to explore Kerbin by rover and aircraft, the trees that require that have a bunch of "dead nodes", which grant nothing if you research them.

Anyways, Treeloader should work differently than it does. It's sort of ass backwards, no offense. The way it should work is this :

1. The program should look in every single mod folder for a file called "additionalnodes.cfg". It should parse these files, and add these new nodes to the "tree.cfg" used in this save's playthrough. If a node of the same name already exists (many of the custom trees make extra nodes for mods), it should add the parts listed in the additional node.

2. This part is probably why you haven't added this feature already. I noticed that the variable "pos" defines where the node will go in the tech tree in absolute coordinates (with 3 coordinates? what's the third one for?). This means that nodes can end up in spots that look bad or even overlap with other nodes. You'd have to write an algorithm to fix this - such as dividing the space around the node "start" into a grid of a minimum space to comfortably draw a node. Then, you'd have to scan the grid for a free spot that does not have a node box in it that is as close as possible to the parents of the new node added by the modder.

Another key thing : if a part is defined in multiple locations, for example, if it is defined as being part of a stock-game node AND is also listed in "additional nodes", then the latter entry overrides it, so it will not appear in a stock node. I think Tree loader already works this way.

End result : if this works, then modders can add extra nodes for their stuff, and users can pick any custom tree they want, and all their modded stuff will be there, in extra nodes. Also, if users don't have TreeLoader installed, they will still get all their parts in the vanilla tree, if the modder defined them that way.

[Nazari1382]

Feedback on "tradional tech" : The nodes "experimental aerodynamics, aerospace tech, experimental motors, robotics, nanolathing"

all contain no parts. I think that these nodes need a part or two, each, players don't like empty unlocks.

These nodes were created by Squad as placeholders to contain mod parts. So if a mod author designates their parts as one of these end-tier nodes, they will show up in the stock tree and any tree still containing those node names, like mine. It's up to mod authors what node they put stuff in, but those top level nodes are empty in stock because they're mod nodes.

Edited November 6, 2013 by Nazari1382

[Keloooe_Pest]

Oh wow, with the fuel lines at the end of the tree I need to redesign my current launch vehicles completely!

[LuciferNZ]

Alright, I found out that simply cutting and pasting the top 3 nodes from the "KSP Interstellar" config file into "tree.cfg" from Yargnits tree 1.0a works perfectly. I've tried all the trees available in the loader, and Yargnit's is still the best one. This is because while I really do like the idea of being required to explore Kerbin by rover and aircraft, the trees that require that have a bunch of "dead nodes", which grant nothing if you research them.

Anyways, Treeloader should work differently than it does. It's sort of ass backwards, no offense. The way it should work is this :

1. The program should look in every single mod folder for a file called "additionalnodes.cfg". It should parse these files, and add these new nodes to the "tree.cfg" used in this save's playthrough. If a node of the same name already exists (many of the custom trees make extra nodes for mods), it should add the parts listed in the additional node.

2. This part is probably why you haven't added this feature already. I noticed that the variable "pos" defines where the node will go in the tech tree in absolute coordinates (with 3 coordinates? what's the third one for?). This means that nodes can end up in spots that look bad or even overlap with other nodes. You'd have to write an algorithm to fix this - such as dividing the space around the node "start" into a grid of a minimum space to comfortably draw a node. Then, you'd have to scan the grid for a free spot that does not have a node box in it that is as close as possible to the parents of the new node added by the modder.

Another key thing : if a part is defined in multiple locations, for example, if it is defined as being part of a stock-game node AND is also listed in "additional nodes", then the latter entry overrides it, so it will not appear in a stock node. I think Tree loader already works this way.

End result : if this works, then modders can add extra nodes for their stuff, and users can pick any custom tree they want, and all their modded stuff will be there, in extra nodes. Also, if users don't have TreeLoader installed, they will still get all their parts in the vanilla tree, if the modder defined them that way.

Then why use TreeLoader in the first place? ModuleManager will do this for you as it stands (change tech postion, or add in mod parts).

The entire POINT of TreeLoader/Edit, is so that you can *override* the set techtree.

I do see what you mean about additions for mod packs that arent included in the tree though - although that should work as is anyway (they'll pop into the stock node points).

Thats why Im making up a tree with as many mods as I can, so that you will in fact have a tree with mod support. (Im up to ~30 mods, including Kethane, KAS, IonCross, B9, AIES, Kosmos etc).

[TimMartland]

I really hope the ability to create your own trees is added soon - it kinda sucks that its a private feature. On the other hand I play with yargnits tree on and it really enhances the game and, if you play realistically, means you will still hunting for science to finish your tree well into the late game.

[ROFLCopter64bit]

If you guys can't wait for TreeEdit to become public, use mine for the time being.

[LuciferNZ]

I really hope the ability to create your own trees is added soon - it kinda sucks that its a private feature. On the other hand I play with yargnits tree on and it really enhances the game and, if you play realistically, means you will still hunting for science to finish your tree well into the late game.

AFAIK its not private?

Having your tree accessible to TreeLoader general users however, I think is.

[John FX]

Tree coming along nicely. Playtesting the first few nodes there is just enough science available with a rover body, probe core, temp sensor and wheels to get the next node. A few nodes in and I have managed to fly a plane over the mountains, water, highlands and shore to read the temp there. Now I just need to land...

[Botch]

Is there anyplace that describes what the intent of the various trees are in the way Yargnit's is explained in the OP? There are like six choices and the labels aren't all that informative.