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Cilph

By Cilph
in KSP1 Mod Releases

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louiz347

louiz347

Posted
Posted

Hello, I also had the problem that the terrain disappears and I need to restart the game and a ship gotting duplicated... I trying to reproduce it to upload a log with the error.

Also, I noted that mechjeb got crazy before this happened, it happened twice with me and mechjeb simple did not knew what to do on both times, it just kept wobbling the ship, and when I went to space center, all gone.

I will get the log next time. :)

--

Another issue, but now I don't know if this is supposed to happen or if it's a bug.

I have 3 satellites on Kerbin and another 3 on Mun, rerouting all communications from mun.

All of them using communotron 16 and reflectron KR-17.

But, tried to launch a ship to Mun using a communotron 16 and a communotron 88-88 (pointed to Kerbin and activated)... and soon as I go out of the range of comm. 16, I lost connection, even if I have power and with comm. 88-88 pointed to Kerbin.

But once I got in range with the mun satellites for comm. 16, I got the connection again.

So is this the behavior of comm 88? I mean maybe it JUST work for long ranges? or it's a bug?

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Styrr

Styrr

Posted
Posted (edited)

You have to take the cone angles into account. The 88-88 has a cone angle of only 0.06 deg. When being at the distance of Mun and pointing on Kerbin it is highly unlikely that a satellite is within this cone. For such small distances the KR-7 is absolutely sufficient in terms of range and has a cone of 25 deg which means for short distances the area which the dishes cone is covering is sufficiently large.

EDIT: Of course you also have to make sure some dish within the cone is pointing back to your probe.

Edited by Styrr
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togfox

togfox

Posted
Posted
*sigh* I get that it changes the method used to determine range. I said that right in the message you replied to.

So, I'll try again. What does this mean? How does it effect the game? Why should I choose or not choose to use this method? Why is it so hard to get an answer to such a simple question?

I'm not sure you'll get the answer you're looking for. Whats on offer is a different way of calculating ranges. It's not a case of one is better than the other. It's not that one provides more range than the other either. Depending on the antenna configuration and ranges involved, some methods will come out on top but not every time.

It's like asking if you should start a gravity turn at 5000m or 10000m. The answer is "it depends on a lot of variables".

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RabidMonkey

RabidMonkey

Posted
Posted
Whats the proper way to use "active vessel" selection?
After some trial and error, I figured out that what you need to do is point the dish on the active vessel to a craft with a dish targeted to "active vessel". It's a shortcut for making the necessary two-way connection so you don't have to manually target both ends, but it is only present when you're actively flying the "active vessel". When you go to something else, the connection is severed.
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match

match

Posted
Posted (edited)
*sigh* I get that it changes the method used to determine range. I said that right in the message you replied to.

So, I'll try again. What does this mean? How does it effect the game? Why should I choose or not choose to use this method? Why is it so hard to get an answer to such a simple question?

Ok doke, I'm feeling rather saucy. I'll give this a shot. Instead of speaking theoretically, let's put this to a more tangible scenario.

Let's say you have a little Reflectron DP-10 circkling Kerbin. It has a range of 500 kilometers. If you put another Reflectron DP-10 up in orbit, it can communicate with the first as long as they are within 1000 km of each other. (500km + sqrt[500km * 500km]) -Their operating ranges must overlap.

Now let's say you put up a Communitron 88 (40,000km range) and target a Reflectron. It's operating range is now 4,972 km (500 + sqrt[40000 * 500]). This accounts for the weaker antenna's limitations. While the Communitron 88 is built for long distance transmission, the Reflectron is not. Therefore, the operating range is affected adversely for the 88, but the DP-10's range increases almost tenfold since it is communicating with a more powerful antenna.

I believe the theory behind this is that it places the limitation on the hardware rather than the media. That is, while the mechanics behind antennae transmission/reception can be measured by the quality and design, placing a limitation on the range does not mean the signal stops at this point. The radio waves (or whatever medium is being used) continue to travel after they have reached the limits of the operating range. They will suffer from signal degradation as they travel away from the origin, but the signal doesn't simply vanish. This presents a more realistic scenario when dealing with transmission distances rather than basing it on an imposed distance range.

TL;DR A stronger antenna can do more with less. It can provide a "cleaner" signal to a lesser antenna; It can "hear" a weaker signal farther than it was originally rated to travel.

Edit: Oops- The 88 is 40,000,000km (40Gm, not 40Mm), which increases the operating range of 88 : DP-10 to ~142,000km

Edited by match
catastrophic prefix failure
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Sma

Sma

Posted
Posted (edited)
KSP_Data/output_log.txt.

I would say you should add that to your signature, but you know how well people pay attention to directions/instructions. ;)

BTW, were the log files I sent worth anything from the test? I know the one was rather large and I'd imagine hard to sift through.

To those having the ghosting line issue, try clicking on the 3rd icon from the left at the bottom. The one with the dish and omni. It seemed to me that when you change it to any except the one that shows both the lines work as intended. It's only when it was set to display both that it was having issues for me. Though that was on the test version.

I have yet to have a chance to play around with the newest release, been getting ready to fly out of town. I'll give it a shot while im in the air though. Should be fun playing KSP while going ~400mph (give or take 50-100mph). It's fun to use a GPS on a plane, especially if you set a destination, see how fast it tries to recalculate lol.

Edited by Sma
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Beetlecat

Beetlecat

Posted
Posted
...

Let's say you have a little Reflectron DP-10 circkling Kerbin. It has a range of 500 kilometers. If you put another Reflectron DP-10 up in orbit, it can communicate with the first as long as they are within 1000 km of each other. (500km + sqrt[500km * 500km]) -Their operating ranges must overlap.

...

Wait --is that right? I was(am?) sure that the devices doing the transmitting/receiving would need to be within 500k of each other (or whatever the shortest range is). Otherwise, for instance, the built in 3k probe antenna would never lose connection with KSP (as long as line of sight was maintained) since the operating range of Mission Control extends far beyond that.

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match

match

Posted
Posted

I actually have not turned this on yet to test it out, I was merely following the formula presented to try and give the NathanKell option some substance. Although I think Cilph mentioned that the range multiplier should be halved when using this, which would bring it back in line to the RT2's original range design.

Will play with it some over the weekend, time allowing.

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J.Random

J.Random

Posted
Posted
I noticed "MultipleAntennaMultiplier = 0" in the cfg, where do we stand with multiple omni's on a craft now?

Final omni range equals to range of the most powerful omni antenna + (sum of ranges of additional omni antennas)*MultipleAntennaMultiplier.

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T.Lancer

T.Lancer

Posted
Posted

How do I rename craft I have lost contact to? It won't let me rename them if they have no connection, not from the focused craft or the map screen. I would like to be able to mark ships I can no longer contact as debris so the don't show up anymore. I don't see the reason for not being able to do this.

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Kalloran

Kalloran

Posted
Posted

So, I researched the "Electrics" upgrade...and unfortunately my Reflectron SS-5 is not showing up as an accessible antenna. It shows as being researched, but my available antennas are as follows:

Communotron 16 - Researched (Start), Accessible

Comms DTS-M1 - Researched (Flight Control), Accessible

Reflectron KR-7 - Researched (Electrics), Accessible

Reflectron DP-10 - Researched (Flight Control), Accessible

Reflectron SS-5 - Researched (Electrics), Not Accessible

Assistance on this matter would be appreciated, or a link to a post that talks about it. Thanks!

-- Kalloran

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RHodeidra

RHodeidra

Posted
Posted (edited)

Problem when deploying probes causing the entire screen to go blue.

Some mouse-overing still works but its near impossible to find anything.

Restarting KSP does not fix it so save is corrupted.

Other mods are deadly reentry, KW, B9 and Engineer Redux

EDIT: I delete the entire folder so no logs left.

Tabula Rasa until I find it again and then I'll give logs

Edited by RHodeidra
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Fail-o-matic

Fail-o-matic

Posted
Posted
Problem when deploying probes causing the entire screen to go blue.

Some mouse-overing still works but its near impossible to find anything.

Restarting KSP does not fix it so save is corrupted.

Other mods are deadly reentry, KW, B9 and Engineer Redux

Others are having the same issues. Posting your log file like BIGD45 did would be helpful to Cilph

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asmi

asmi

Posted
Posted

Just got weird behaviour: http://i.imgur.com/YZ8dg2P.png

After I've checked the log, it's filled with this:

ArgumentOutOfRangeException: Argument is out of range.

Parameter name: index

at System.Collections.Generic.List`1[RemoteTech.ISignalProcessor].get_Item (Int32 index) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.VesselSatellite.<get_SignalProcessor>b__4 () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.RTUtil.CachePerFrame[iSignalProcessor] (RemoteTech.CachedField`1& cachedField, System.Func`1 getter) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.VesselSatellite.get_SignalProcessor () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.VesselSatellite.get_Visible () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.NetworkRenderer.CheckVisibility (RemoteTech.BidirectionalEdge`1 edge) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.NetworkRenderer.<UpdateNetworkEdges>b__2 (RemoteTech.BidirectionalEdge`1 e) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at System.Linq.Enumerable+<CreateWhereIterator>c__Iterator1D`1[RemoteTech.BidirectionalEdge`1[RemoteTech.ISatellite]].MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at System.Collections.Generic.List`1[RemoteTech.BidirectionalEdge`1[RemoteTech.ISatellite]].AddEnumerable (IEnumerable`1 enumerable) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at System.Collections.Generic.List`1[RemoteTech.BidirectionalEdge`1[RemoteTech.ISatellite]]..ctor (IEnumerable`1 collection) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at System.Linq.Enumerable.ToList[bidirectionalEdge`1] (IEnumerable`1 source) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.NetworkRenderer.UpdateNetworkEdges () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at RemoteTech.NetworkRenderer.OnPreCull () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

full log file is here.

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rottielover

rottielover

Posted
Posted
Final omni range equals to range of the most powerful omni antenna + (sum of ranges of additional omni antennas)*MultipleAntennaMultiplier.

I'm a little stupid so let me make sure I understand...

Let's say I have 4 of the 500km omni's (the dipole whatever it's called now). So it would be 500+(500+500+500)*0 = zero? Or did you mean 500 + ((500+500+500)*0) = 500 ?

In any case, what would the recommended setting for the Multiplier be? Maybe 0.25 ? Wouldn't that yield a total range of 875km in my scenario above?

Many thanks in advance.

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J.Random

J.Random

Posted
Posted
I'm a little stupid so let me make sure I understand...

Let's say I have 4 of the 500km omni's (the dipole whatever it's called now). So it would be 500+(500+500+500)*0 = zero? Or did you mean 500 + ((500+500+500)*0) = 500 ?

In any case, what would the recommended setting for the Multiplier be? Maybe 0.25 ? Wouldn't that yield a total range of 875km in my scenario above?

Many thanks in advance.

Stop using "standard" calc view. ;) Multiplication is done before the sum, so it would be 500 in both cases. Yes, in the second example it would be 875. I don't think there's any "recommended" value.

I've proposed a "diminishing return" calculation on github, but Cilph hasn't answered to that yet and I'm not sure how much impact it would make on performance.

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