[WIP] MSI's Infernal Robotics - Model Rework (v02 Pre-Release Beta)

[V8jester]

Wait..... You mean you have a life outside of making us really awesome stuff we don't actually pay you for? Well everything you've done for the community has been very much appreciated. IR hasn't been the same since you stepped up and put your own "spin" on it.

[fatcargo]

Here are my basic suggestions for reworked model of Adjustable Rail.

Top row shows basic "T" channel for slider in red color, body in yellow.

From left to right : basic "fat" model, slimmer model for radial/surface attach, long thin with similar profile as your rework models and last one is a "heavy duty" that should only go in steps, slowly (with a heavy "humming" of hydraulics) - each stepping position can be locked by closing teeth on sides.

All presented model ideas are free for use by anyone.

[ZodiusInfuser]

Here are my basic suggestions for reworked model of Adjustable Rail.

Top row shows basic "T" channel for slider in red color, body in yellow.

From left to right : basic "fat" model, slimmer model for radial/surface attach, long thin with similar profile as your rework models and last one is a "heavy duty" that should only go in steps, slowly (with a heavy "humming" of hydraulics) - each stepping position can be locked by closing teeth on sides.

http://i.imgur.com/DdlqB1S.jpg

All presented model ideas are free for use by anyone.

Thanks for the render!

The red bit would need to be the side that you fix to the craft, as anything that gets surface attached to the part will move and the yellow bit has the larger surface. If anything the second design is more in line with what I had in mind, but its still not what I am after.

[fatcargo]

Thanks for reply, but i'm confused - how come AdjustableRail can be surface attached to parent and have another surface attached child to animate ?

Is this attachment method being phased out along with legacy parts ?

Does this mean that in future IR will always consider starting attachment node as root from which ALL surface attached (and via optional additional nodes) parts are child of IR animation performed ?

If so, i will try to make a design that fits the above limitation, though right now i don't see a nice way to do it - surface attach for root makes only sense here.

[ZodiusInfuser]

The way the plugin works is that anything that is node or surface attached to an IR part gets moved by that IR part, irrespective of if it itself is node or surface attached to a parent. What I was meaning in this case is that to keep the functionality of the current adjustable rail, there needs to be a larger surface than that red piece of your design for parts to get attached to.

Sorry for the confusion.

[fatcargo]

Aha ! So, to have surface attach functionality preserved for both parent and child parts is to have usable sizes. Thanks.

Here are next version of parts.

From left to right : square, round, flat and special via attachment node with additional extender.

I know you picked out one of them, but i've left all parts for demonstration purposes.

[ZodiusInfuser]

This is more the design I had in mind:

This preserves the large moving surface of the current design, but also fits in well with stock wings (at half scale) and can have other rails stacked on it. Maybe you can take this concept and refine it a bit more?

[smjjames]

When I tried to load the unfolding sampling rover, Toadicious tools threw an error, something about the solar panels. The craft didn't even load, well, the name was there, but the craft wasn't.

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at ToadicusTools.AnimationWrapper..ctor (UnityEngine.Animation anim, System.String statename, PlayDirection direction) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at TweakableEverything.ModuleTweakableSolarPanel.OnStart (StartState state) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part.ModulesOnStart () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part+.MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

I am using the latest version. Going to try loading in SPH and see if that helps, though it really shouldn't make any difference. Edit: Loads fine on launchpad.

Edited May 19, 2015 by smjjames

[ZodiusInfuser]

When I tried to load the unfolding sampling rover, Toadicious tools threw an error, something about the solar panels. The craft didn't even load, well, the name was there, but the craft wasn't.

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object

at ToadicusTools.AnimationWrapper..ctor (UnityEngine.Animation anim, System.String statename, PlayDirection direction) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at TweakableEverything.ModuleTweakableSolarPanel.OnStart (StartState state) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part.ModulesOnStart () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

at Part+.MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0

I am using the latest version. Going to try loading in SPH and see if that helps, though it really shouldn't make any difference.

I just noticed there's a new version of tweakable everything out that mentions solar panel fixes. Try downloading the ToadicusTools and TweakableStaging dlls from that.

Also, you should probably message me by PM, as that test craft isn't publicly released yet

Edit: Note that you have to scroll down the VAB to see that craft

Edited May 19, 2015 by ZodiusInfuser

[smjjames]

I just noticed there's a new version of tweakable everything out that mentions solar panel fixes. Try downloading the ToadicusTools and TweakableStaging dlls from that.

Also, you should probably message me by PM, as that test craft isn't publicly released yet

Okay, I wasn't sure if it was okay to post here or not on those.

[fatcargo]

This is more the design I had in mind:

https://www.cubbyusercontent.com/pl/IR_RailConcept.png/_0431c783a4994c8bbd0e0353cae339bf

This preserves the large moving surface of the current design, but also fits in well with stock wings (at half scale) and can have other rails stacked on it. Maybe you can take this concept and refine it a bit more?

After some tinkering i got this, as always mostly basic geometry, once settled it will be only a matter of refinement.

Left one is basic "T" channel mounting and on right side is a variation with a trapezoidal-threading screw for heavier loads. You can also add multiple sliding channels to make a wider and flat "palette"-sized rails. Ofcourse, the helical geometry of the screw does not need to be replicated to the last detail, nobody wants to kill the framerate.

[Ziw]

After some tinkering i got this, as always mostly basic geometry, once settled it will be only a matter of refinement.

http://i.imgur.com/E1aJf31.jpg

Left one is basic "T" channel mounting and on right side is a variation with a trapezoidal-threading screw for heavier loads. You can also add multiple sliding channels to make a wider and flat "palette"-sized rails. Ofcourse, the helical geometry of the screw does not need to be replicated to the last detail, nobody wants to kill the framerate.

These actually look very convincing.

[smjjames]

I have an idea for something, but I'm not sure how it'd work. Is there a part or a configuration of parts that can act like a spring?

i don't mean a triggerable spring, I mean one that acts something like a suspension spring.

Edited May 20, 2015 by smjjames

[fatcargo]

I have an idea for something, but I'm not sure how it'd work. Is there a part or a configuration of parts that can act like a spring?

i don't mean a triggerable spring, I mean one that acts something like a suspension spring.

Ask lo-fi, i think he made KF wheels. He's really into springs, suspensions and stuff. He even might provide a complete "springy" part for you.

[ZodiusInfuser]

I have an idea for something, but I'm not sure how it'd work. Is there a part or a configuration of parts that can act like a spring?

i don't mean a triggerable spring, I mean one that acts something like a suspension spring.

Parts that act as springs can easily be done with wheel collider. Now the question is, do you want to attach anything onto the end of that spring? Is so then there's no plugin at present that allows for it.

[smjjames]

Well, a spring was just one idea.

edit: Actually wait, is it possible to set rotation limits on an uncontrolled part? They'd still be uncontrolled obviously, just limited to a range of motion.

Edited May 20, 2015 by smjjames

[V8jester]

Well, a spring was just one idea.

edit: Actually wait, is it possible to set rotation limits on an uncontrolled part? They'd still be uncontrolled obviously, just limited to a range of motion.

I think I might possibly be able to assist with this one. Spanner, the same guy that made boomstick also made a "useful parts" mod in that mod he had a solid axle. If you mess with that axles cfg file it may help you write a custom one for a rotatron and then acomplish what you are looking for? I'm willing to help look into this, but

zodiusinfuser, will this even work? Have you messed around with his cfg file? It seems like a promising idea. I just updated that axle for 1.0.2 for myself

Here is a video I made before fine tuning the axle. By adjusting the IR settings you can stiffen or loosen the suspension, in the video it's super sloppy but works really well.

Edited May 21, 2015 by V8jester

[smjjames]

Not really what I'm thinking of, no.

[BudgetHedgehog]

Actually wait, is it possible to set rotation limits on an uncontrolled part?

AFAIK, no, that's not possible.

[Garek]

If you stack a lot of structural panels on alternating edges like /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/, they could propably act as a spring. I think I saw this in some ksp video and it worked surprisingly well. Of course, that's a lot of parts per spring, you need TweakScale to get springs with other diameters than 1 and 2 m. Also it won't stop at fully compressed because there is no self-collision, and instead compress further through itself until the connections break.

[Goddess Bhavani]

If you stack a lot of structural panels on alternating edges like /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/, they could propably act as a spring. I think I saw this in some ksp video and it worked surprisingly well. Of course, that's a lot of parts per spring, you need TweakScale to get springs with other diameters than 1 and 2 m. Also it won't stop at fully compressed because there is no self-collision, and instead compress further through itself until the connections break.

Funnnn!

I am so going to have to try this.

If the springs are too soft would it help if I added those tiny little IR Rework robo truss thingies to act as control arms or shock absorbers?

I will then be able to solve the age-old battle between users of live axles and independent suspensions on high powered terrestrial wheeled vehicles

[UAL002]

Quick question. Lets say I want multiple sizes for all the parts here. Lets also say that I don't like tweakscale because I dot wont any other tweakscaleables and it makes my other parts scaled wrong sometimes. Is there an alternative to tweakscale or just a config that only affects these parts?

Edited May 23, 2015 by UAL002

[ZodiusInfuser]

Quick question. Lets say I want multiple sizes for all the parts here. Lets also say that I don't like tweakscale because I dot wont any other tweakscaleables and it makes my other parts scaled wrong sometimes. Is there an alternative to tweakscale or just a config that only affects these parts?

No there's no other alternative. but do what I do and delete the patch folder that contains all the tweakscale configs for stock and other mod parts. That way you only get tweakscale applying to any mod that specifically includes support for it (like Infernal Robotics).

[UAL002]

No there's no other alternative. but do what I do and delete the patch folder that contains all the tweakscale configs for stock and other mod parts. That way you only get tweakscale applying to any mod that specifically includes support for it (like Infernal Robotics).

Yessir, will try and report back.

EDIT: Looks good so far. Last time I did this Dmagic parts got wonky, but not this time.

Edited May 23, 2015 by UAL002

[ZodiusInfuser]

For people who're wondering what is happening with this mod, I'm close to releasing the next update. The mecanums are ready to go, Active Struts now works and I fixed a number of bugs with the other packs that testers have reported. Currently waiting on KSP 1.0.3, which will hopefully fix an annoying wheel bug, as well as an update to Infernal Robotics and Kerbal Foundries.

In the mean time I've been preparing a number of example craft to show what can be done with the mod and all its packs. Here's an example:

If anyone has anything they wish me to include, please post below. Caveats are that it must be Stock + IR Model Rework, and you can only use Tweakscale on the IR parts.