The HELO challenge

[Fengist]

I am trying not to be nit-picky, but can you please define "primary lift"? I don't want want to put a bunch of effort into a design only to have it DQ'd. Maybe some sort of ratio of total lift rating of all lifting surfaces divided be total mass? i.e. 10 total units of lifting surface decided by 10t mass is a ratio of 1. 20 units of lift would give you a ratio of 2. So maybe 1 or less? .5?

And to be even more of a pain, lifting bodies can be somewhat effective with FAR, and I'm not sure how you regulate those...

Cool challenge and lots of really neat entries.

I'll basically repost an answer I gave above to a similar question.

I recently submitted to a challenge and was 'disqualified' because I made my landing at 1,500 m instead of 2,500+ m. I'm not going to bother to resubmit to that challenge because my design worked and performed exactly as I wanted it to and more than served it's purpose, regardless of the challenge rules. Above anything else, this challenge is about designing an aerial vehicle that's capable of doing more than just flying around in circles at warp speed. It's about creating something that is not only fun to fly, but has utility as well. The big goal is to take what you design and test here and have it hopefully, come in useful in other challenges. If you're satisfied that your design meets the challenge criteria, then I'm satisfied. Go show me what it can do.

Rather than being a VTOL challenge, which I'm considering duplicating this into so that more choices are available, this is about Helicopters. Even modern helicopters tend to blur the distinction. We've had one entry already that was essentially a lifting body once the rotors got it off the ground. My own entry flies like a rock when the rotors are shut off. Basically, I'm looking for a helicopter. Does it take off and land vertically? Does it have rotors? Is it incapable of STOL? If the answers are yes to those three, I'm satisfied.

You may have seen some of my pics of a VTOL I've been toying with which I ultimately decided didn't qualify even though it met all the requirements. It was too much of an aircraft instead of a Helo. Ultimately, it's your design. If you like it and can make a case for it being a helicopter, then I'm satisfied.

Edited January 27, 2014 by Fengist

[ihtoit]

yeah it's like I said, a "helicopter" is an aircraft that relies on rotating airfoils for lift and some forward thrust, with *tiny* control surfaces that are there for one thing and one thing only: controlling the direction and orientation of the nose. You might have noticed that the Bell Jetranger has those two winglets on the back, in front of the tail rotor? They're there to control pitch and yaw, they offer no lifting capabilities on top of that. A famous TV example of a helicopter is Airwolf, described in the show as a supersonic lifting body with rotors. Now, there are two things wrong with the premise of a supersonic helicopter: the rotors can't handle the stress of supersonic flight (no material yet tried, not even carbon nanotube fibre, can handle supersonic rotation on top of an aircraft; even SCRAMjets have to slow the air down so the engine can breathe), and the Bell 222 (the airframe Airwolf was built on) is about as aerodynamic as a brick, so apart from the fairly impressive looking shape could not be described as a lifting body at any speed. Not to mention the fact that the pontoons on the actual aircraft had to be painted to make it look like it had inboard weapons and inline jets* because the props made for it in "deployed" mode failed FAA inspections (the missile pod had a habit of falling off mid-flight), the closeups of the deployed pods had to be shot using a scale model.

*I've seen gas turbines that'd probably have fit in the "jet intakes" on Airwolf but I doubt they would have been able to deliver the thrust to weight ratio required to take a five thousand pound helicopter to the end of the runway before running out of fuel, never mind beyond the sound barrier at 70,000 feet!

Now, there's an idea for a sub-challenge: build a utility helicopter using the specific helicopter powerplants supplied in FS, to carry no less than two Kerbals to the island and back (so round trip range of ~65km?) while keeping the weight as low as possible. Usual no futzing with ALT+F12 to cheat your way through with a pair of command chairs strapped to a girder... etc. Remember the Bell 222 carries eight and weighs 8,000lb (3 tons) fully loaded.

Edited January 27, 2014 by ihtoit

[leafty]

I never went to the alternate KSC base, so I decided to go for the Chinhook award with a modified version of the Helijet nicknamed the "Head Chopper". Quantum mechanics allows Kerbals not to feel the discomfort of the blades going through your head or so, I heard from Cave Johnson . He also mentioned something about those burn marks too...

Javascript is disabled. View full album

[Fengist]

I never went to the alternate KSC base, so I decided to go for the Chinhook award with a modified version of the Helijet nicknamed the "Head Chopper". Quantum mechanics allows Kerbals not to feel the discomfort of the blades going through your head or so, I heard from Cave Johnson . He also mentioned something about those burn marks too...

http://imgur.com/a/3OGd2

LOL, excellent! Leaderboard Updated.

[Northstar1989]

The Kerb-Vinci Experimental Nuclear-Electric Turbo Jet Copter.

Has two medium fission reactors from Near Future Propulsion powering 8 electric rotors and a couple of B9 jets and can raise/lower the wheels to dock onto payloads. I've been on the VAB roof, delivered a 42T payload with 2 Kerbals to the dirt runway, delivered a 10.5T payload with 6 Kerbals to KSC2 and attained 20,000m at 730m/s level flight. It should do a lap of Kerbin in under six hours with an additional fuel payload but I've not tried yet. Unfortunately those particular reactors (the only ones I have in .23) appear to be virtually infinite

http://imgur.com/a/UMpf2

I have NO IDEA how you managed to power eight electrics with two medium NearFuture reactors. Even a much more powerful KSP-Interstellar 0.625 m reactor (750 EC/s with adequate radiator mass) can barely power 4 of the 50 kN electric propellers (normally used in planes- but work fine in helis- just they produce less thrust, but use less power) on 1.5x thrust ("Cargo Mode") on my most recent helicopter design (I'd post it here, but it was a drone control module with Kerbal passengers- forcing me to design a new manned heli instead...)

I'll have an entry to this challenge soon. Probably tomorrow at the latest.

Regards,

Northstar

[Northstar1989]

I present the HELO (High-Electricity Large Onithopter) Model A, the last helicopter you'll ever need

Featuring eight (8!) electric helicopter rotors, a multi-ton reactor system, and a maximum TWR greater than 7 on the runway (over 11 with "Cargo Throttle" activated- I hope you guys were using it for your challenges too), she's a real beauty...

Unfortunately, the HELO is also only my third helicopter ever, so I'm not that experienced in landing in tight spaces- especially without using MechJeb ASAS (you might see the icon on the side, but I won't use her except for circumnavigation, per the rules- though I strongly object to manually holding an angle of attack for a half-hour or so just to get to KSC II. The stock ASAS just doesn't cut it for really long distances- as it can't auto-adjust with the curvature of the planet like MechJeb's ASAS...), which allows me to precisely set an angle of attack and roll, say 1-degree and 5-degrees...

Landing of the helipad is HARD! If it wasn't, this wouldn't have happened (technically she's landed, and nobody was hurt, but I don't think this counts...)

I'll be posting on meeting the various challenges soon. The hardest one with this craft and my skill-set should be the 40-ton lift, I think- because the HELO's SAS-force is rather limited... (and if I placed the KAS winch even slightly off from the Center of Mass, it'll exert a LOT of torque on such a light craft... The whole thing weighs only 8.629 tons- more than 1/4th of that being reactor weight, and 1/2 being in rotors...) all the others should be a breeze.

Regards,

Northstar

Edited January 31, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

VICTORY!

Strangely, the HELO's landing legs sank into the Helipad a little, and the Kerbals in the Odin command pod weren't able to exit (if this happens again at the KSCII, you'll have to allow me to count the challenge anyways. That's a LONG flight just to be unable to count the challenge just because the craft clipped into the ground a little... The HELO holds exactly 6 Kerbals, including the pilot/co-pilot)

The passengers were able to exit, however.

More sub-challenges coming up next. Oh, and if I figure out some way to make the Navball not flip upside-down if I flip the cockpit hatch-up, you'll have to allow me to still count it as the same craft. After all, the only reason I didn't build it that way in the first place is because the Navball flips. You would think Kerbals would still be able to calibrate a Navball correctly no matter which way the cockpit hatch was facing, right?

Regards,

Northstar

[Ryu Gemini]

Did not make this for the challenge (or any challenge), but I may as well post it here too.

Science Train V (Stable Edition), which is not so much a helicopter as it is a flying science station for nabbing science from different parts of Kerbin. It has no wings, after I couldn't for the life of me get it to stay even remotely stable with the damn things. It does have powerful engines though, and pointing the VTOL engines forwards and combining their thrust with the turbojets grants it enough push to get it to the altitude where the turbojets really do their thing (at which point its not really a helicopter anymore, admittedly). These two screenshots are the ones I just have lying around already, and are not intended as proof for any sort of challenge criteria.

It must be landed vertically. The VTOL engines fortunately have a semi-automatic hover capability that can be set up with some work and a bunch of action groups, which make it easy to maintain altitude until you are stationary, so you can plop down the last 10 or so meters straight down. With that admittedly cheat-like function, I probably could land on that building. I did land on a mountaintop with a landing zone about twice its size at least, though I don't have a screenshot of that.

It can achieve both altitude points if you allow the use of its jets. Otherwise, I am uncertain of its maximum VTOL-only altitude.

It made it about 1/4 of the way around the planet (the polar region) before running below 1/3 fuel, at which point its balance started getting wonky and its massive array of torque wheels started no longer able to balance the thing. I am fairly sure I achieved that in less then 90 minutes, but again that was using turbojets. Once you get high enough and have some turbojets at their prime altitude, things like "wings" or "rotors" are merely shiny and unnecessary toys, admittedly, and you can just scream along the edges of the sky with a brick for all it matters, so long as said brick is pointed at the proper angle and has necessary torque to maintain that heading (my brick does with loads to spare, and is the only "plane" I've ever flown that can just pull a 90-degree turn at 20km cruise speeds and not give a crap about it). The jets are mounted on structural pieces though, I could probably increase range a bit if I swap them for actual fuel-containing hulls. I need to keep transferring fuel into that back-most tank to maintain balance until its the only tank left full. Probably cannot circumnavigate in one shot at present though. Not unless I add some big drop-tanks (should have enough lift to lift some though).

It can seat 6 kerbins, 3 in that flying fortress cockpit, 2 in the science lab, and 1 in that chair I strapped to the side for the sake of SCIENCE! (it helps get readings of various sorts, mostly the "I should not be taking EVA reports under these conditions, please let me back in the plane!" ones).

Again, not really intended for this challenge, but thought I'd just chime in since I coincidentally made the thing today.

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[Northstar1989]

So, the first challenge I attempted was the island runway...

Another day, another dollar- wait WHAT?

The stupid thing still has some serious landing problems in my inexperienced hands- mostly related to my doing a poor job of hovering near the ground, and bouncing the landing legs against the ground- leading to the thing rolling over far enough to bounce one of the helicopter rotors against the terrain and break it. From there, I'm just lucky if all the other rotors don't hit the ground and break off as well (like near the VAB helipad)...

I'd spread the legs further apart, to better protect it from bouncing at least, but that would make precision landings like on the VAB helipad difficult at best, and I want that darn da Vinci prize!

Thankfully, the legs didn't clip into the ground this time (Noooooo- they just bounced off it like it was made of rubber...)

Well, at least I got some Science from it (what, what? I've already been here like 100 times when this save was still in 0.22 and 0.21...)

Regards,

Northstar

Edited January 31, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

Completing the Boulet Award (this is at the top of an unsustainable climb- I could definitely do higher, but I think this is more than good enough...)

And the Church Award by over 1000 meters:

And the Eggington Award- not sure on this one whether m velocity vector was allowed to be below the horizon- so I took two screenshots of the HELO near top speed. The last image in the album is of my safely slowing down to a more reasonable speed:

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Interestingly, the HELO Model A doesn't come close to the top speed of my earlier drone helicopter the 'Hornet' (around 240 m/s- akthough it can also safely fly at similarly large pitch differences relative to the horizon at 3000m instead of 8000m, thanks to its much higher SAS force relative to the lift from the tiny wings mounting the rotors...), even though its TWR is higher. Not for the challenge by any means, but here's an image of the Hornet in what's actually level flight in terms of altitude. At least 95% of its thrust is coming from the rotors- the small rocket nozzle at the back, despite its long flame trail, only produces 0.4 kN of thrust (but at an ISP of over 1000- using a KSP-I thermal rocket nozzle with a 0.625 meter Thorium reactor. Very low mass ejection, but at very high speeds- hence the very long flame trail...)

For those curious, the 'Hornet' was actually designed for the "Flying Duna" challenge (http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50619-Flying-Duna-AGAIN) and to support my long-term colonization efforts on Duna. A helicopter is nigh-worthless for me on Kerbin thanks to the extreme water-lag I typically experience (making helicopters unusably slow thanks to FPS drop) except maybe to haul materials into the mountains to the west of the KSC to build a mountain launchpad someday... But on Duna, where the terrain is much rougher, and there are no oceans to lag my computer to death, a helicopter is much more useful...

That's half the reason I'm sticking to nuclear helicopters with very high TWR for this challenge, actually- whatever lessons I learn in flying such helicopters here will serve me well on Duna- where even a nuclear-electric like this can barely maintain 5000 or 6000m... (any actual designs I utilize there will have passenger capacity for 4 or less, and a drone core though- it's actually lighter to control an aircraft with a drone core and have a separate dedicated lightweight crew compartment than to control it with a cockpit... On planes I utilize cockpits because they add more length to the fuselage and aren't subject to shutting down if the electricity fails, but with electric helicopters, that's less useful...)

Regards,

Northstar

Edited January 31, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

Sheesh! It takes a lot of effort just to get a 40-ton cargo spawned!

I had to throw launch clamps and a detachable probe core (probe cores aren't allowed for the challenge, right?) on the thing just to get it to spawn on the Launchpad!

If I launched it without the launch clamps, it did some sort of weird trampoline thing several hundred meters into the air shortly after spawning on the Launchpad! If I launched it without the probe core, well, I had no way to detach the launch clamps. All just to get what you see here...

I built an SAS unit into the top of the cargo. Mostly just because it was the only thing I could find that weighed exactly 0.29 tons (the extra weight needed on top of the fuel tank and KAS port to make the total exactly 40 tons), and I didn't want to carry a pound extra of cargo. If the thing flies steady without it, I'll manually disable the reaction wheel when I hook it up to the chopper (without a command module, I have no way of doing it before)- so it's just a big dumb cargo load...

Regards,

Northstar

Edited January 31, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

Starved for an ingenious way to get a Kerbal on top of the 40-ton cargo I made to hook up the KAS port without having to add ladders in 2x symmetry (so the Center of Mass remains in the right place) and re-design the whole thing, as well as increase the part-count, I had this brilliant idea. Here it is during a test-run- prepare to crack up laughing:

"Shelsey, you get down there!"

"Suspended by nothing but the winch, boss?"

"It holds 40 tons of cargo, it'll certainly hold you!"

I'll be transporting the cargo out to the island soon.

Regards,

Northstar

EDIT: You know, this also would have been a pretty cool way to reduce the weight necessary to transport 6 Kerbals to the KSCII (and thus increase the TWR and maximum speed- saving time). Instead of designing a 6-man copter, I should have just designed a 5-man copter, and suspended the 6th Kerbal below on the winch needed anyways for the cargo transports... Or, I could have strapped him in a lawnchair to the 10-ton cargo itself...

EDIT #2: If the hatch bug with the front cockpit continues to bother me, this is also an innovative way to unload 6 Kerbals without needing to install Crew Manifest so they can move internally between compartments freely... Just stick two extra Kerbals on top of the 10-ton cargo, in two lawnchairs in 2x symmetry (which 0.2 tons could also count as part of the cargo weight- though the 0.9t weight of the Kerbals themselves clearly wouldn't count...), and then I won't need to disembark the pilot/co-pilot.

Edited January 31, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

Phillie Kerman volunteered for winch-duty this time, after seeing how scared Shelsey looked after the test-run.

But after a 5 minutes of floating around near the cargo to no avail, all decided: $%#! this, we're adding a ladder:

By the way, Fengist, you cannot IMAGINE how much I am hating you right now for disallowing MechJeb in most maneuvers. Do you have any *IDEA* how hard it is to line up a 4-rotor chopper over a fuel tank a fifth the size of the helipad, and hold it steady there long enough to lower a Kerbal onto it by winch, without Mechjeb to set PRECISE heading relative to the horizon that won't wobble all around like the stock ASAS? (even a couple degrees off sends the 'chopper flying off at 5-10 m/s horizontally)

This isn't high-speed jet flying. There's no inherent thrill to doing it manually. It's not FUN to try and make maneuvers that precise without the aid of a real autopilot... (they certainly don't in real-life, believe it or not: autopilot trimming-adjustment is ALWAYS used to aid maneuvers like winch-drops... That's basically what the the MechJeb ASAS is on Surface Mode... a trimming tool.)

Regards,

Northstar

Edited February 1, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

The cargo, after several attempts at ladder design until I found one my Kerbal could actually get on top of... (apparently, the Kerbals need another ladder on the horizontal surface in order to make a right angle onto a ledge from the top of a ladder)

Of course, all that effort *might* have been avoided if I had been allowed to use MechJeb's ASAS when I was trying to simply winch the Kerbal on top of the cargo...

Regards,

Northstar

[Ryu Gemini]

Well, since last night I was tired and didn't notice this thread was by the same person as the VTOL challenge thread, I decided that for the sake of not just dumping the same thing into both threads I ought to appologize by at least testing out the Science Train as it would be with pure helicopter-style. That is to say, I tore off the jet engines, threw a counterbalance on the back, and took it up to see what it did.

Max altitude it can go with the firespitter VTOLs alone: About 6600ish.

I considered making a dedicated copter, but then I read some of this thread and realized that these people actually know what they are doing. So I said "Fine! I'll make my OWN rotors! With blackjack! And Kerbals!"

Unfortunately, kerbals are a poor building material, and I didn't have any cards around. Only infernal robotics parts. So I naturally did what most infernal robotics people do at some point, and try to make a helicopter with that.

Presenting: The Failcopter! Capable of getting a fraction of a millimeter off the ground, and moving at a whopping 3 meters a second, this wonder of kerbal engineering can scare the crap out of its pilots even if they include Jebediah himself! And it can do so for almost a minute at full throttle before something crashes into the ground, sending the poor souls aboard hurtling across the spaceport in a wobbly (but now actually flying!), free-wheeling disaster with surprisingly good survival odds! Therefor allowing you to make them pilot it AGAIN!

Notice: warranty void if it actually manages to get airborne. Or if you turn on the engines. Or if you even get in it.

.

[Northstar1989]

I plugged the HELO: A in, and gave it my best shot:

But after at least 16 or 17 tries, and a few too many scenes that looked like this:

I decided there was simply no feasible way to lift a 40-ton payload with that chopper. It's simply too light, and doesn't have enough SAS force.

So, I've decided to throw in the towel on the HELO: A, since I'm going for the Da Vinci prize, and it's impossible with that chopper.

In the meantime, please enter me on the scoreboard with my HELO: A entry. You can always update it later if I do better with my next chopper....

Regards,

Northstar

[Northstar1989]

I decided to build it bigger, for heavy lifting stability, and so I present: the HELO (High-Electricity Large Ornithopter) Model B:

I also present completion of the Precision Landing Challenge- the one I was most worried about with a craft of this size:

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Also, I'm up to my old tricks again. This time, my new victim, errr, I mean volunteer, is Gusbrett Kerman:

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Unfortunately, dropping from above still didn't work. The HELO B is incredibly stable (more so than the HELO A)- and can easily stay within range while in hover mode for Gusbrett to reach the ladder- but hover mode only apparently works when the craft is actively selected, and the stock ASAS isn't good enough to keep the craft steady for long anyways (*cough* MechJeb, please)- so there's no way to have the pilot basically keep the craft relatively steady while another Kerbal climbs a ladder- which is entirely unrealistic... I ended up having to land- something I was avoiding due to the legs clipping into the ground and often causing me to lose the radial winch on the bottom as a result- which has relatively little clearance (a rather annoying bug- but not a design flaw- there *IS* clearance when the legs don't sink a couple meters into the ground...).

Regards,

Northstar

Edited February 1, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Darren9]

^ I think the legs sink because you have too much mass on them, I had it happen to me earlier - may need some bigger ones. You could also land next to the weight, pay out a load of winch and walk over and attach it, personally I don't think I'd even try 40T on a rope actually no, I am going to try 40T on a rope.

[Fengist]

I decided to build it bigger, for heavy lifting stability, and so I present: the HELO (High-Electricity Large Ornithopter) Model B:

http://i.imgur.com/7giAZfo.png

I also present completion of the Precision Landing Challenge- the one I was most worried about with a craft of this size:

http://imgur.com/a/Zrprm

Also, I'm up to my old tricks again. This time, my new victim, errr, I mean volunteer, is Gusbrett Kerman:

http://imgur.com/a/yEu4j

Unfortunately, dropping from above still didn't work. The HELO B is incredibly stable (more so than the HELO A)- and can easily stay within range while in hover mode for Gusbrett to reach the ladder- but hover mode only apparently works when the craft is actively selected, and the stock ASAS isn't good enough to keep the craft steady for long anyways (*cough* MechJeb, please)- so there's no way to have the pilot basically keep the craft relatively steady while another Kerbal climbs a ladder- which is entirely unrealistic... I ended up having to land- something I was avoiding due to the legs clipping into the ground and often causing me to lose the radial winch on the bottom as a result- which has relatively little clearance (a rather annoying bug- but not a design flaw- there *IS* clearance when the legs don't sink a couple meters into the ground...).

Regards,

Northstar

And, when it goes into hover mode it switches OUT of Cargo throttle and back to Normal throttle... which sucks.

[Fengist]

VICTORY!

http://i.imgur.com/BnQfWSt.png

Strangely, the HELO's landing legs sank into the Helipad a little, and the Kerbals in the Odin command pod weren't able to exit (if this happens again at the KSCII, you'll have to allow me to count the challenge anyways. That's a LONG flight just to be unable to count the challenge just because the craft clipped into the ground a little... The HELO holds exactly 6 Kerbals, including the pilot/co-pilot)

The passengers were able to exit, however.

http://i.imgur.com/XRSO3un.png

More sub-challenges coming up next. Oh, and if I figure out some way to make the Navball not flip upside-down if I flip the cockpit hatch-up, you'll have to allow me to still count it as the same craft. After all, the only reason I didn't build it that way in the first place is because the Navball flips. You would think Kerbals would still be able to calibrate a Navball correctly no matter which way the cockpit hatch was facing, right?

Regards,

Northstar

Ummm wow. Interesting craft. You may want to put it in the VTOL challenge I have going on.

[Fengist]

Well, since last night I was tired and didn't notice this thread was by the same person as the VTOL challenge thread, I decided that for the sake of not just dumping the same thing into both threads I ought to appologize by at least testing out the Science Train as it would be with pure helicopter-style. That is to say, I tore off the jet engines, threw a counterbalance on the back, and took it up to see what it did.

Max altitude it can go with the firespitter VTOLs alone: About 6600ish.

I considered making a dedicated copter, but then I read some of this thread and realized that these people actually know what they are doing. So I said "Fine! I'll make my OWN rotors! With blackjack! And Kerbals!"

Unfortunately, kerbals are a poor building material, and I didn't have any cards around. Only infernal robotics parts. So I naturally did what most infernal robotics people do at some point, and try to make a helicopter with that.

Presenting: The Failcopter! Capable of getting a fraction of a millimeter off the ground, and moving at a whopping 3 meters a second, this wonder of kerbal engineering can scare the crap out of its pilots even if they include Jebediah himself! And it can do so for almost a minute at full throttle before something crashes into the ground, sending the poor souls aboard hurtling across the spaceport in a wobbly (but now actually flying!), free-wheeling disaster with surprisingly good survival odds! Therefor allowing you to make them pilot it AGAIN!

http://i.imgur.com/x2QBfWs.jpg

Notice: warranty void if it actually manages to get airborne. Or if you turn on the engines. Or if you even get in it.

.

Somewhere on the spaceport is a craft file you can download of a stock, sorta working, helicopter. The guy built his own bearing from stock parts. Might wanna take a look at it for some ideas.

[Northstar1989]

And, when it goes into hover mode it switches OUT of Cargo throttle and back to Normal throttle... which sucks.

Actually, the HELO B is so powerful that it can carry the cargo at about 800m altitude on Hover Throttle. I've been sticking with that mode because it means that any increment in the throttle represents less of a tug on the cargo. I've had a LOT of problems with the winch pulling off the body of the helicopter itself (it's clearly not very firmly attached- maybe I should have used a radial attachment node and a stack winch for the better attachment...) The steel cable itself seems a lot less likely to break than the attachment of the winch and your helicopter...

I'm currently crossing the ocean with the cargo slung below, having finally gotten it off the Launchpad...

Looks kind of like one of those military choppers carrying a huge payload (like a Humvee), except that the copter is about 4 times as large- and the cargo is a bunch of fuel...

Regards,

Northstar

[Fengist]

I decided to build it bigger, for heavy lifting stability, and so I present: the HELO (High-Electricity Large Ornithopter) Model B:

Regards,

Northstar

That's... a lot of rotors. Leaderboard updated for Model B. You may want to do the 40 tons the way I did. If you'll notice on the first post, I just used a decoupler from Anvil. I understand why you're trying it with KAS and hope you succeed. But it'll be wobbly.

[Northstar1989]

ARGHHH!

This thing is moving at an average of between 42 and 45 m/s, and it keeps trying to tip the copter's nose up back into the level position!

Why can't I just use MechJeb? This is taking forever!

CORRECTION: It appears if I let off the "W" key, it stabilizes at between 10 and 12 degrees below the horizon with stock ASAS on. But it only moves at between 38 and 40 m/s then- so I'd really prefer just to hold a greater angle automaticall with Mechjeb ASAS!

Regards,

Northstar

Edited February 1, 2014 by Northstar1989

[Northstar1989]

That's... a lot of rotors. Leaderboard updated for Model B. You may want to do the 40 tons the way I did. If you'll notice on the first post, I just used a decoupler from Anvil. I understand why you're trying it with KAS and hope you succeed. But it'll be wobbly.

What about the HELO Model A? That was the one I really wanted on the Leaderboard right now- it already made 4 of the awards... (Precision, Eggington, and both the altitude challenges)

About the desire for MechJeb on the cargo run- I should explain: I'm not using physics warp, because I'm afraid it would probably break the KAS winch (which is very close to breaking with that cargo load), and I'm also experiencing VERY low FPS due to ocean-lag (surprisingly, the helicopter itself is no laggier than the Model A- probably because there is no lift to simulate anywhere on it)

Regards,

Northstar

Edited February 1, 2014 by Northstar1989