Kerbal Construction Time/StageRecovery Dev Thread

[JeffreyCor]

I'll have things ready to go after release. Real sticky part with be compatibility with other mods, as those can't be effectively tested until those are updated. I imagine the new experience system will also be interesting for StageRecovery.

I agree if you're listening Squad, give him an early release!

[magico13]

I haven't considered the uses of xp with StageRecovery. I'm curious as to what you were considering. Off the top of my head I could imagine greater returns for better pilots (kerbal or probe).

[JeffreyCor]

I was thinking since it recovers Kerbals and science, it may need something to apply experience gain for kerbals that are recovered as well. Or at least something they added isn't going to good up the recovery system, they do seem to like to change things

[magico13]

Could someone please check StageRecovery and KCT with 0.90? I wasn't expecting the release today and won't be home to work on updating for up to several hours.

[NihilRex]

Could someone please check StageRecovery and KCT with 0.90? I wasn't expecting the release today and won't be home to work on updating for up to several hours.

I'll do it, I have no mods atm here.

Edit 1:

Stage recovery works straight off. KCT appears to require the toolbar still.

Edit 2:

Even with Toolbar reinstalled, KCT does not appear in the game in any way shape or form.

Edited December 16, 2014 by NihilRex

[magico13]

Working on an SR update anyway, I'll get a KCT recompile later tonight. Definitely gonna have issues in KCT based on some of the changes I've seen. Will post link to updated SR for testing as well in a few minutes (up to half hour).

Edit: Wait. Running into issues with kerbals losing experience and need to transfer some fixed from KCT. It might be a while.

Development version of StageRecovery: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/25340912/StageRecovery.dll

Changelog:

1.5.2 - (12/15/2014)

- Compatibility update for KSP 0.90

- Automatic recovery of launch clamps when they are unloaded.

- Right clicking on a stage in the flight GUI will now delete it.

- Several bug fixes.

- Contains a bug where kerbals will lose experience if they are in the craft when it's "recovered". Will be fixed soon.

Edit: BTW, there's also a 0.90 version of KCT in existence now, ready for testing.

Edited December 16, 2014 by magico13

[JeffreyCor]

Clicking the SR icon in the SPH I get a failed recovery for each click. Extra weird, there was nothing out there to be recovered. Getting the KCT for testing now but wanted to let you know about these strange SR item.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/op8wet35yyfrha3/output_log.txt?dl=0

[magico13]

Clicking the SR icon in the SPH I get a failed recovery for each click.

Not seeing any issue here. In the editor, the SR icon runs the check on the editor vessel so you can see if it will be recovered. Worked fine for me in the SPH just now.

[JeffreyCor]

Build 29, every launch brings up an "not clear" window and asking about recovery of whatever might be out there.

Launches from both SPH and VAB have no crew. Confirmed crew was indicated in the crew selection GUI. Simulations do add crew to command pods.

Suggestion on crew selection GUI, adding what the Kerbal's skill is along with the courage and stupidity so users know what the selected crew member(s) know how to do.

On the SR issue, it is very possible the ship I built wouldn't be recoverable as configured which would result in the part not recovered message. In such case it would be working right

https://www.dropbox.com/s/myknve7ec4ln8no/output_log.txt?dl=0

[magico13]

Gonna release SR as official then, KCT will need some work that I might just save for after I get home tomorrow. 0.90 changed a non-trivial amount of things internally that has gummed up things. I'll keep you posted, but I might just play 0.90 tonight and have some fun (shock and awe!)

[WuphonsReach]

One idea would be to tie the number of simultaneous construction projects to the size of the SPH/VAB. i.e. you can't unlock the 2nd slot rate until you have upgraded the SPH/VAB to tier 2.

[JeffreyCor]

That sounds like a really interesting idea, maximum number of lines limited by building level.

[CatastrophicFailure]

Hey since this is going to require an extensive rewrite anyway, would there be any way to incorporate reduced part cost via economy of scale? Like the same way parts build quicker the more you build them?

[magico13]

Hey since this is going to require an extensive rewrite anyway, would there be any way to incorporate reduced part cost via economy of scale? Like the same way parts build quicker the more you build them?

But when you recover them they will still return the same amount, which is not easy to override. So doing this would be pretty nontrivial like doing it with build times is (not that that's trivial, but I at least have exclusive control over that and don't have to fight with KSP [much] to get it to work)

[magico13]

Ok, fixed the issues with launching ships so it should be at roughly the same state it was at before 0.90 came out.

This is really important! The file structure has changed! Delete the Kerbal_Construction_Time.dll file, add a "plugins" folder under the normal GameData/KerbalConstructionTime folder and put the KerbalConstructionTime.dll into GameData/KerbalConstructionTime/plugins

I need to ensure KCT respects the editor max sizes, fix some bugs, and figure out what's going on with procedural parts before I'm ok with releasing. Then I'll see about adding time requirements to upgrades and repair.

[JeffreyCor]

I haven't been able to get a lot of testing in but so far nothing has horribly destroyed things I'll do a bit more tonight and hope to get in more tomorrow to really run it through its paces. Hopefully there will be other reports coming in as well, but at least no big problems straight off which is always encouraging

[NathanKell]

Still on .25, but it seems to work ok with RealFuels again.

(Need to test a bit more.)

It's an issue on both our ends--I sure as heck shouldn't be firing that event when not in the editor...

[Kitworks]

Edit: Nevermind, I'm pretty sure I'm wrongy wrong wrong. Carry on.

Maybe this is a dumb question, but does the part inventory/stage recovery element of KCT only work in career mode? Just tried it in 0.90 sandbox, and everything in KCT seems to work perfectly except for that.

Thanks! Very cool mod.

Edited December 17, 2014 by Kitworks
Correction

[magico13]

Still on .25, but it seems to work ok with RealFuels again.

(Need to test a bit more.)

It's an issue on both our ends--I sure as heck shouldn't be firing that event when not in the editor...

In the last 0.25 build I added a check on my side to make sure the event listener only acts when in the editor, so that *should* take care of it.

Maybe this is a dumb question, but does the part inventory/stage recovery element of KCT only work in career mode? Just tried it in 0.90 sandbox, and everything in KCT seems to work perfectly except for that.

There's a fix I need to do to make sure parachute based recovery works outside of the flight scene (fixed it in StageRecovery but forgot to transfer it back here), but the normal recovery mechanics and parachute based recovery while still in flight should be working correctly. If you've got StageRecovery installed as well then you shouldn't be seeing any issues with parachute based recovery, since the fix exists there.

Also, I've decided that since everyone will be starting new saves for 0.90 anyway (most likely) then now would be a good time to revamp the part inventory. It'll push the release back, but I'd rather not break the inventory after release. I'm going to be saving more information per part (such as the part cost, and for tweakscale and procedural parts I'll be saving relevant module info), so the current system will be incompatible. I likely won't take the time to make the current system compatible.

If you download the betas now, you will definitely lose any inventory parts when I make this change. There is a good chance the inventory system will be unstable for several builds. I won't be starting this process until Thursday though, so if there's a build tonight it won't include these changes.

Edited December 17, 2014 by magico13

[karamazovnew]

KCT is one of my main mods so until it's updated I'll be putting any career thoughts on hold (not a problem, as many other mods need testing and tweaking for my taste). But maybe this is a good time to share something I wrote on the KebinSide thread:

Just a request. I play extensively with Kerbal Construction Time and Stage Recovery (well, not now, no update yet) and I'd like to see some clever integration with that. What I mean is, in the long term, not sure if this is possible I'd like to see something like this:

- Each site has a base cost for opening (appearing on the map). Recovering outside the range of these bases should COST money. A small interface to allow you to recover just crew and science and destroy the vessel (again, at small cost) would help. However, this merely allows you to use the basic non upgraded site. At each launch you still have to pay extra for the transport, and loose more time in KCT. Worse, you are limited as to how much mass you can actually move to a site and the refunds for landing near get diminishing returns. "Recover Vessel" still means shifting the thing back to KSC and that costs money. Planes have the alternative to be left at the alternate sites until needed again.

- Now for upgrades:

- Fuel depot. Ignores the fuel mass during transport and gives money back for the fuel remaining at the end of a mission if landed near.

- Hangar. Allow you to Refuel, reservice (reset failure times for Dang it) and recrew any aircraft landed or left near the airport. Not sure if possible to STORE the craft "in the hangar", that seems difficult, but you can always just park your craft and recover the crew only. Although will need a very small "bus" to be able to launch crew at that site (nice as it also simulates crew transport costs to the site). Will need an interface to recover science back to KSC tho.

- Data Link. Allows a link between the site and KSC. Signal travel time still applies. Quite expensive might I add. Alternatively, build a sort of network, only allowing you to connect to nearby sites (so that you don't just buy the one site at the other end of the planet).

- Mega Antenna Array. Since some arrays already are implemented, a humongous range that covers the entire Kerbol System would be fun, but veeeeeery expensive. Maybe just one for the entire planet. This would be able to create a link to any antenna, but at cost, so that you can unfold that forgotten solar panel.

- Basic Assembly. Greatly reduces costs of launching at the site, as it mimics breaking the rocket into parts for transport and reassembly on site.

- Full blown mega launch site. Works normally, as an extension to KSC.

P.S yes, I am a masochist.

The thing is, I believe that Stage Recovery in particular should work a bit differently. The KCT "revert button" should allow you to:

-destroy the vessel, for a tiny bit of money, only if landed and on Kerbin of course.

-recover crew and science, again for a tiny bit of money, depending how far you are from KSC (although the closest KerbinSide site should reduce the cost).

-recover the craft. This should COST money, the further away you are from KSC. KerbinSide sites should reduce the cost, but not nullify it.

-at the end of this, the parts would be reconditioned and allowed further use (meaning you get some money back). I'm not sure if KCT keeps track of existing part in the inventory for cost, or only for build time. An utopia would be to have some label on the parts in the VAB (such as the *Experimental* label) that shows how many of that part you have.

-moving on my utopian view, every part should have a "durability" resource, hidden, influenced by G's, heat, time in use, that decides how much the reconditioning costs. The upside would be to give a bit of science in return (the boys at the labs would love the radiated melted parts).

- KerbinSide does open up the possibility of an interesting "HARD mode" option, where landing outside your base areas might mean that your "time to recovery" might take days, killing your stranded kerbals at sea or starve on land. Or die of cold in the mountains. Hehehehe.

Enough wishful thinking, KCT has been a great mod for a long time, a MUST in any stock career. I'm just suggesting ways to make it even more awesome.

Edited December 18, 2014 by karamazovnew

[JeffreyCor]

So far so good. Only problem I've hit is occasionally when selecting to build a ship the notification does not come up and the window with the build options remain as if nothing happened, but the ship is in fact added to the build list. It does not happen all the time and does not seem to have any consistency.

[magico13]

Only problem I've hit is occasionally when selecting to build a ship the notification does not come up and the window with the build options remain as if nothing happened, but the ship is in fact added to the build list.

You've mentioned this a few times now but I haven't seen it yet in my limited testing. I'm curious if anyone else has seen this? Could you grab me a log next time you see it, right after it happens? Looking at the code there's not many points of failure between the ship being added to the list and the window closing. The two main ones are recounting the inventory and recalculating the build time displayed in the editor (which each have their own possible failure points).

@karamazovnew I'll have to re-read through that again to try to fully grasp your suggestions, but I am planning on some more tight-knit Kerbal Konstructs support in the near future, so I'll be keeping them in the back of my mind while I do that.

Edited December 18, 2014 by magico13

[JeffreyCor]

I sure will, today's runs will exit right after it hits and shoot the log to you. Naturally that will likely mean I'll go the entire day without it happening

[joebopie]

I cant quite see where to get the Dev version in full, i can only see the .DLL on github.

do i just download the old version of KCT and replace the dll or am i just missing it?

EDIT: yup, i should have read the first post more clearly.

Edited December 18, 2014 by joebopie

[magico13]

I cant quite see where to get the Dev version in full, i can only see the .DLL on github.

do i just download the old version of KCT and replace the dll or am i just missing it?

EDIT: yup, i should have read the first post more clearly.

Glad you got it figured out For posterity's sake, I'll still answer this, because I'm weird like that. Normally all you have to do is download the last official release, then replace the .dll with the one from the build server linked on the first post. With recent changes, you're actually supposed to create a plugins folder and then put the .dll in there, while also deleting the .dll from the old release. There was a slight change in the file name and it will need to be organized like that later.

The betas are purposefully a little complicated to set up to deter people from installing them without fully comprehending that they are, more often than not, totally broken or missing features. Since they build automatically whenever I make a github commit, many builds may be when I'm half way through a feature and everything is broken