Pteron Micro Shuttle and rescue vehicle Beta download available(9/9/2014)

[Fladder]

Sweet mother of G....

Kerb.Gasm Can't wait to fire KSP up and try this little gem. Complements for sticking with it and seeing it through!

[Fladder]

I think you should keep it as-is, there is the procedural fairing pack that can take care of the fairing issues. Besides, it fits fine in a 2,5m expanded fairingbase.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Fladder

[Sage Sagan]

I think you should keep it as-is, there is the procedural fairing pack that can take care of the fairing issues.

Yeah I have made some cute looking launchers for this with PF, eventually I would like a custom fairing that fits around the bottom of the shuttle during launch

[blackheart612]

License up in the OP, thanks Blackheart I was being dumb last night...it was very late.

I also noticed that the little ship is just too wide for a 2.5m bay, damn Kerbal fabricators. Not sure what to do about that, the winglets really can't get any narrower.

I guess a very slight re-scale of the whole ship might do the trick, as I showed earlier in the thread 1.25m diameter hulls leave plenty of room for kerbals. However, the whole point of a 1.25m diameter was that the standard docking port can be used on the back so hmmmm

You don't need to make any changes as of now, I PM'd nazari if I can get his unity project (if not well, I'll reimport). We'll all just change the way the ailerons work so that they actually move (It doesn't work for me)

Also I think the Engines are alright but it covers the RCS ports if I attach them so I'm not comfortable with it + I'm gonna make some edits in the texture normals because I didn't really finish it as I planned.

[qnistNAMEERF]

This is awesome. I just noticed it's been released. I'll check it out after work. Great work, everyone!

[Fladder]

Okay, took it around the world once. Very cool, found a minor issue though where, eventhough it is manned, the crewwindows aren't shown. (screaming Bill and a smiling Jeb)

Having FAR, I can confirm the issue of flying perpendicular to the ground. My guess is that the left wing produces lift/drag while the right doens't. Going to look in to that now.

Fit's nice and snug in the expanded 2,5m KW rocketry fairing and combines very nicely with the IACBM from Fustek/Sum Dum for clean gapless connections.

Yeah I have made some cute looking launchers for this with PF, eventually I would like a custom fairing that fits around the bottom of the shuttle during launch

Very very cool idea!

[blackheart612]

Okay, took it around the world once. Very cool, found a minor issue though where, eventhough it is manned, the crewwindows aren't shown. (screaming Bill and a smiling Jeb)

http://i.imgur.com/TRhiViSl.png

Having FAR, I can confirm the issue of flying perpendicular to the ground. My guess is that the left wing produces lift/drag while the right doens't. Going to look in to that now.

Fit's nice and snug in the expanded 2,5m KW rocketry fairing and combines very nicely with the IACBM from Fustek/Sum Dum for clean gapless connections.

http://i.imgur.com/s4pau1ol.png

http://i.imgur.com/SavLvaEl.png

http://i.imgur.com/uk4HRMBl.png

Very very cool idea!

It's because it doesn't have an IVA yet (the reason for the not visible Kerbals on the bottom right)

[Sage Sagan]

Looks great in the KW fairing, I was thinking of the SDHI docking port with integral chutes...drogue for landings..On a separate note I am thinking of reducing the lift a little so that it has to be landed virtually empty of fuel, currently it glides a little too well when it is heavy. Reduce the lift or increase the dry weight or leave it as is? Thoughts please

[Fladder]

It's because it doesn't have an IVA yet (the reason for the not visible Kerbals on the bottom right)

Ok, then i didn't say anything:P

Looks great in the KW fairing, I was thinking of the SDHI docking port with integral chutes...drogue for landings..On a separate note I am thinking of reducing the lift a little so that it has to be landed virtually empty of fuel, currently it glides a little too well when it is heavy. Reduce the lift or increase the dry weight or leave it as is? Thoughts please

I'd say that you should reduce lift a little, can't imagine that a craft like this one generates a lot of it.

As for the FAR issue/Lift issue: I've been trying to get it of the runway, but as soon as i have lift-off it goes in a barrel roll. So I've been trying to invert the lift generated by the right wing, but so far have been unsuccesfull.

[SiliconPyro]

I think a custom fairing would be great because it could follow the outline nicely and even display some decals to advertise its contents. This project is one I've been watching for a while and I think it's pretty cool. Good work, guys.

[blackheart612]

I think a custom fairing would be great because it could follow the outline nicely and even display some decals to advertise its contents. This project is one I've been watching for a while and I think it's pretty cool. Good work, guys.

I plan on adding the flag decal it's the one I'll add first once I get to contact Nazari. Since his inbox is full. My message did not send.

Also Sage, don't worry about your plans on a custom fit adapter for the launcher it's a little bit too easy to do that I must say, I can model it for you.

[Sage Sagan]

I plan on adding the flag decal it's the one I'll add first once I get to contact Nazari. Since his inbox is full. My message did not send.

Also Sage, don't worry about your plans on a custom fit adapter for the launcher it's a little bit too easy to do that I must say, I can model it for you.

Nice one Blackheart, I owe you several beers if you are ever in London.

Also I had a look at the lift and reduced it from 1.0 to 0.8 on each wing,seems to fly much more as expected. I will try and update the download later today, although if you are flying at the moment try adjusting the lift values down a little. This is a lifting body return shuttle so if you try to fly and swoop gracefully around with it full of fuel it may crash!

[blackheart612]

Nice one Blackheart, I owe you several beers if you are ever in London.

Also I had a look at the lift and reduced it from 1.0 to 0.8 on each wing,seems to fly much more as expected. I will try and update the download later today, although if you are flying at the moment try adjusting the lift values down a little. This is a lifting body return shuttle so if you try to fly and swoop gracefully around with it full of fuel it may crash!

Not until I already have done it! But don't sweat it man

[Sage Sagan]

Tried it with SDHI paradock on the back instead of the stock docking port. Looks great, really fits plus you get lights for docking....problem is that the paradock weighs .495 tons!

This seems awfully heavy considering the stock is 0.05, Am I doing something wrong? All that weight on the back makes it very unstable

[blackheart612]

Tried it with SDHI paradock on the back instead of the stock docking port. Looks great, really fits plus you get lights for docking....problem is that the paradock weighs .495 tons!

This seems awfully heavy considering the stock is 0.05, Am I doing something wrong? All that weight on the back makes it very unstable

A tiny reminder first: It has parachutes (which still contributes to weight but Im not sure if it's that heavy). And I think that the stock paradock looks nice too

[passinglurker]

Tried it with SDHI paradock on the back instead of the stock docking port. Looks great, really fits plus you get lights for docking....problem is that the paradock weighs .495 tons!

This seems awfully heavy considering the stock is 0.05, Am I doing something wrong? All that weight on the back makes it very unstable

heavy parts are more stable the SDHI dock it made to stick a heavy pod and fuel tank to something that could be equally heavy if not more. if you used normal ports you would wobble a lot more than it may already do. Perhaps the Pteron should incorporate a built in docking port like the whimchaser? that would you give it the full weight of the pod for stability yet it will still let you decouple the attached parts for reentry

[blackheart612]

heavy parts are more stable the SDHI dock it made to stick a heavy pod and fuel tank to something that could be equally heavy if not more. if you used normal ports you would wobble a lot more than it may already do. Perhaps the Pteron should incorporate a built in docking port like the whimchaser? that would you give it the full weight of the pod for stability yet it will still let you decouple the attached parts for reentry

It is true that a designated docking port would look good, I agree.

[Sage Sagan]

OK This was just for kicks

[BrianMcNett]

I can confirm the lift issues in NEAR as well as in FAR. What I'm seeing is that the Right wing is adding lift to the LEFT rather than the right, and the left wing is adding lift further to the left as well, placing the center of lift well off the center of the craft to the left. I will test again without NEAR installed. Lift for each wing needs to be centered on the wing. Neither wing currently does this in FAR/NEAR. This suggests that FARWingAerodynamicModel, for both parts needs work.

Here's the right wing attached.

and here's the left.

Finally, here's both wings.

[Sage Sagan]

I have been looking at the FAR configs that are in the wing files, they are identical to each other. Should they be different for left and right wings?

name = FARWingAerodynamicModel

MAC = 2.264

e = 0.75

MidChordSweep = 22.16

b_2 = 3.601

TaperRatio = 0.188

This is the config, which variable governs direction of lift?

[BrianMcNett]

Follow up: Without NEAR:

Center of Lift and Center of Mass are perfectly aligned with stock physics. This is slightly less than ideal, although I note that the CoL and CoM remain aligned when monopropellant is exhausted. If you could put CoL just slightly being CoM (but still inside it), the craft would be more stable in flight, and even have the tendency to pitch downward (useful in a stall).

Hope this is helpful! Great mod!

[BrianMcNett]

I have been looking at the FAR configs that are in the wing files, they are identical to each other. Should they be different for left and right wings?

name = FARWingAerodynamicModel

MAC = 2.264

e = 0.75

MidChordSweep = 22.16

b_2 = 3.601

TaperRatio = 0.188

This is the config, which variable governs direction of lift?

The lift value is implicit in the design of the wing, since FAR will model this from the wing shape you've defined in the config. For normal wings, which are identical in rotation, the values can be identical, but for wings with a set orientation they'll probably need to be reversed. I'd recommend looking at the documentation in the FAR wiki (updated mere hours ago):

https://github.com/ferram4/Ferram-Aerospace-Research/wiki/Deriving-FAR-values-for-a-wing-using-Blender-2.7

And then look at other mods which do wings such as yours, such as the Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter System:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/68429-0-24-2-Kerbin-Shuttle-Orbiter-System-v4-09

Hope I'm still being helpful here.

[montyben101]

Much better!

My next shuttle mission will actually bring one up to test landing and stuff! XD

[Sage Sagan]

You could have a squadron in there!

[Sage Sagan]

The lift value is implicit in the design of the wing, since FAR will model this from the wing shape you've defined in the config. For normal wings, which are identical in rotation, the values can be identical, but for wings with a set orientation they'll probably need to be reversed. I'd recommend looking at the documentation in the FAR wiki (updated mere hours ago):

https://github.com/ferram4/Ferram-Aerospace-Research/wiki/Deriving-FAR-values-for-a-wing-using-Blender-2.7

And then look at other mods which do wings such as yours, such as the Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter System:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/68429-0-24-2-Kerbin-Shuttle-Orbiter-System-v4-09

Hope I'm still being helpful here.

You are being helpful firstly. So I checked out the KSO wing FAR configs they are identical to each other and, in fact they are identical to the Pteron wing configs. Now I am really confused as to where FAR finds the lift direction.

The custom docking collar is a nice idea but to be honest one of the prime drivers of this project was simplicity and light RAM usage so any extra parts pain me slightly.