High Altitue Flight on stock wings + FAR (Ferram)

[DailyFrankPeter]

Hi Everybody!

So I'd like your opinion to see what I'm missing. I'm not after such a high altitude flight, I just want to get through the "second atmosphere bar" or survive in it long enough for speed to build up. This almost works on even one of these turbojets + Nerva, AS LONG AS I DONT touch the steering while over 13,000m (well, in the second layer). As soon as touch the heading or even sneeze, my craft aligns perpendicular to the airflow like a leaf

Now what I don't get is:

a) how this is supposed to be possible on just ram intakes and turbojets? (according to KSPs part description) - I'm having to entirely turn to rocket motor around 15,000m (as I lose intake air)

how the stock turbojets are designed to work with stock delta wings? (in order to get more lift and intake air, I go faster but my own thrust bends, twists them and almost tears them off - as I said, like a leaf)

Also I have a feeling that when I install B9 I will instantly have a long wing part which both provides lift from its aerofoil (not requiring high angles) in stratosphere and does not go crazy under it's own bending moment. Can anyone confirm?

Thanks!

Edited March 5, 2014 by DailyFrankPeter

[Streetwind]

This should probably go into the Addon Support subforum...

But for starters, click the FAR button in your toolbar while in the SPH. You'll get a complex interface that can be used to tell you how various performance and stability parameters change as your craft accelerates or changes its angle of attack. From your description, it looks like your plane develops an instability as it goes supersonic.

[Starstrider42]

As soon as touch the heading them or even sneeze, my craft aligns perpendicular to the airflow like a leaf

I'm just starting with FAR aircraft, but this sounds like too much control authority. Click the FAR button while in flight, then click "DCA". This will lower the sensitivity of your control surfaces to compensate for your speed / air density. I've also found a lot of control stability problems can be fixed by tweaking the control authority in the SPH (right click on the control surface).

[DailyFrankPeter]

This should probably go into the Addon Support subforum....

I presume I can't move it there myself?

[DailyFrankPeter]

I'm just starting with FAR aircraft, but this sounds like too much control authority. Click the FAR button while in flight, then click "DCA". This will lower the sensitivity of your control surfaces to compensate for your speed / air density. I've also found a lot of control stability problems can be fixed by tweaking the control authority in the SPH (right click on the control surface).

Well... I'm pretty sure I tested this with DCA on.

If anything I would say there is too little aerodynamic control at high altitude (the ailerons are too small to bite into the air any more - so I'm having to throw in SAS... hmm, which may in fact be too strong as you say and be the cause of the problem).

There's plenty of wing area though to promptly turn the aircraft into one giant airbrake. And this is kinda frustrating, if only I could use all this surface area to steer out of trouble not cause trouble (CoL is behind CoM so in theory it should help yeah? but noo..).

[DailyFrankPeter]

Take 2:

Stock Swept Wings. It's starting to look unsurprisingly U2-ish (delta wings look cooler I think).

Despite what people say (1 pair of swept wings per 6 tonnes of mass) doesn't have enough lift to take off before the runway runs out.

[Nemrav]

to me looks like you have several problems with your engines :

1 : the advanced jet is on-top but not angled to point down a little, this means that it is wrenching your plane downwards and if that doesnt kill you, its not fuel efficient.

2: you need 2 of them minimum, maybe with your setup with the nuke engine, 3-4..

3: you aren't intake spamming

but im probly wrong considering how good some people get at this stuff

[DailyFrankPeter]

to me looks like you have several problems with your engines :

1 : the advanced jet is on-top but not angled to point down a little, this means that it is wrenching your plane downwards and if that doesnt kill you, its not fuel efficient.

2: you need 2 of them minimum, maybe with your setup with the nuke engine, 3-4..

3: you aren't intake spamming

but im probly wrong considering how good some people get at this stuff

Thanks.

I think I was contradicting myself a bit and those are actually two problems: a) using the turbojets in stratosphere, using the rocket stage in stratosphere and jets for just reaching it. And the engine alignment, while OK for the b-scenario is utterly rubbish for the a-scenario.

I'll have to think and re-test this.

EDIT: Shame 'cause I thought it was a nice-looking plane.

Edited March 5, 2014 by DailyFrankPeter

[DailyFrankPeter]

Hah! Thanks for help Nemrav, especially the hint about turbojet alignment.

2: you need 2 of them minimum, maybe with your setup with the nuke engine, 3-4..

Actually, the new design gets into orbit just fine on 1 (and Nerva for the last leg). But I'd hate to see what 4 turbojets do to the wings! Just look at it, it's apalling. I think the devs could buff the rigidity of the wings a bit.

Edited March 6, 2014 by DailyFrankPeter