[WIP] B9 S2 Crew Tank IVAs

[K3-Chris]

I really love the B9 pack but one thing about it always bothered me, it's huge, but contains very few kerbals, even in parts meant to hold nothing but kerbals.

Sneak peek at S2 Crew Tank scale evaluation:

I copied the rear of the S2 cockpit's IVA, doubled it, and made the internal walls fit with some room to spare inside the S2 2m model, this is just a rough first pass to figure out the scale, the S2 cockpit IVa is only the upper half of the model, not sure what uses 50% of the volume of the cockpit but fair enough, but I figure the crew tanks should use more of the available internal space, perhaps almost all of it with some space left bellow the floor for piping etc, this means the internal volume will be almost as tall as it is long at least in the 2m version, to fit an optimal amount of crew I'd need to arrange them vertically, which gives rise to other problems, like how did they get up there, how do they get down, etc. One solution would be two floors with stairs/ladder between them, another one big floor with the chairs stacked along the walls or similar with ladders to the top ones, I think 2 floors and some stairs is the best solution.

Only real problem is that I'm dreadfully bad at 3d modeling, like only started doing it to any great degree this week, I can re-use some of Bac9's assets but it only gets me so far, you can see the weird seam between the 2 sections in the picture above caused by stretching them out and them having baked shadows from connecting to objects/walls/bellow the pilot chairs etc.

The modeling part isn't the hard part though, to make a 2 floor version of that picture I could just copy the top part, flip it vertically, edit out the doors (the top floor's doors lie up with the doors on the S2 Cockpit's IVA and on the external model of the S2 Crew Tank parts) make a cut-out in the top floor, add some stairs, the hardest part is getting anywhere near close to b9's awesome textures, I think I can get away with fairly extensive copy-paste of his textures but I need to learn how to apply textures to models in a manner that makes the texture line up with the model.

Somewhat annoying that 6 kerbals could fit nicely in that picture especially if they sat with their backs against the wall, problem is that the window of the crew tank is in the middle (not visible in the picture), and it would look really weird to block the window with a kerbal right in front of it, 8/4 per side fits just barely, it looks too cramped imo. Any better ideas?

Edited March 24, 2014 by K3|Chris

[schoff123]

Very nice!! Im sure bac9 would approve of your additions. Regardless, my KSP game certainly does!

[Audiopulse]

Nice addition. Personally I wouldnt add more seats to the crew-tank than necessary. You also need some room to store stuff like food/water or equipment in. Some simple boxes for that could already do if youre able to make some

[K3-Chris]

Yeah I won't pack in kerbals like sardines, they'll need some snacks storage, still consider the internal volume of the 2m part is more than twice the space pictured above, and it holds 2 kerbals... It's pretty ridiculous. 4-6 should fit comfortably across 2 floors even taking the stairs into account.

[HerrGeneral]

Oh wow, this looks great.

Thoughts on the crew tank: Windows are an obvious must-have- but to fill the empty space without blocking the windows, maybe have some basic instrument panels (but no controls), or cargo boxes bolted to the floor. At first I was thinking about tables like on a train, but then I realized that they wouldn't work too well in space. Looking forward to seeing how this improves!

[6.forty]

I considered giving the rear 2 kerbals something to look at/use but there isn't really room for it, unless they're on something that folds away they couldn't get into their chairs if something was in front of them.

Fold out table with laptops so they can look up "How to KSP" videos on youtube?

[likke_A_boss]

Awesome! This has bugged me for a long time for a while too, I'm glad someone more qualified made something cool!

[Armchair Rocket Scientist]

Oh wow, this looks great.

Thoughts on the crew tank: Windows are an obvious must-have- but to fill the empty space without blocking the windows, maybe have some basic instrument panels (but no controls), or cargo boxes bolted to the floor. At first I was thinking about tables like on a train, but then I realized that they wouldn't work too well in space. Looking forward to seeing how this improves!

Tables seem to work fine in space. You just need to hold everything in place with magnets, velcro, or something similar. The crew tanks are often used in rovers or bases anyway, so there's sometimes gravity.

I definitely think this could be a really cool addition to the B9 pack, and I'm interested in seeing how it turns out.

Regarding the two floors idea: what if you had the upper deck be where the crew sits during launch/atmospheric flight, and have a hatch to the lower deck - which would contain things like bunks/sleeping bags and space showers. Don't forget, the cabin of a spaceplane may be the crew's home for weeks!

[K3-Chris]

Regarding the two floors idea: what if you had the upper deck be where the crew sits during launch/atmospheric flight, and have a hatch to the lower deck - which would contain things like bunks/sleeping bags and space showers. Don't forget, the cabin of a spaceplane may be the crew's home for weeks!

Very nice idea, upper floor has all the chairs facing the same way in that case, though problem is if you want chairs on both floors you end up with double capacity, unless you make half "fake" but then you have half your crew in the living area during launch... hmm...

[How2FoldSoup]

I have to say I love you. This makes my normal 4 person shuttle an 8 person and makes it do exactly the job I wanted it to. Thank you so much for this awesome mod!

[K3-Chris]

The crew tank isn't in there yet, need to make it non-hideous first

[NQMT]

If I were you, I'd a) redo the instrument panel and raise the pilot's and copilot's chairs so that they can see out of the cockpit.

[K3-Chris]

The instruments aren't modified by me, they're good as-is imo, they're a bit low I agree, but I can't modify that without adjusting the original IVA files, which is pretty tricky to do, and frankly they see as much as a normal airplane pilot normally sees:

Which is why I put a RPM camera with this view:

You can also double-click the ceiling or the windows to shift your view.

[Read have Read]

I love what you are doing here!

Regarding the crew tanks, maybe have both floors be the same with two chairs at a table, then two bunks with nice rocket ship bedding.

Other things you could add would be a computer, lab bench or equipment, shelf of bags from ALCOR, ect. The big thing is both levels could be the same, with the crew seats split evenly between them.

[spudcosmic]

Man this is awesome! Great mods keeps appearing all the time.

[Taki117]

OOOO I like. Once you get that crew tank finished (the 2m holding 4 kerbals) I can shorten my SSTO by a crew tank and have even more dV! You sir are awesome! Have some Rep.

[rhoark]

the S2 cockpit IVa is only the upper half of the model, not sure what uses 50% of the volume of the cockpit but fair enough

[K3-Chris]

What is that the US shuttle? Comes up when I google for space shuttle internal layout etc, Can't find any good pictures of the actual internal layout of the real shuttle but it seems it had at least 2 floors people could use in the front, but I have no idea where they were during launch etc, there are 4 seats on the flight deck while Wikipedia says a mission could range from 5 to 7 people but 2 the pilot and commander were enough for minimal flight, meaning there are 3 seats elsewhere in the shuttle, some pictures show at least one person seated on the "mid deck" bellow the flight deck, the S2 cockpit should in theory be two floors as well I suppose.

[K3-Chris]

I'm making progress, I'm learning a lot about 3d modeling, I've done some game maps back in the olden days so I'm not completely unfamiliar with this stuff, Unreal Editor was pretty similar.

I've reached a bit of an impasse, I knew this might be an issue but I didn't try it out until now, the window in vertical middle on the S2 parts isn't that inductive to giving it 2 floors:

(not suggesting 8 seats, just there for scale, and to show they fit)

Orange outline a column the same shape size and location as the actual window in the external mode, the black outline is the external model, as you can see the window is pretty much at the same level as the floor, normally windows go at head-height, so you can see out of them, if we move the chairs and floor down to make the kerbals able to see out there isn't enough room on the bottom floor for chairs let alone kerbals, and there will be a huge void up top.

Not sure what the best solution is so I've come here asking for suggestions.

I can personally only come up with 2 "solutions"

Ditch the 2 floor idea and make it a single floor with the floor the right height to make the kerbals in the chairs attached to the floor look out, and use the big empty volume above for something, will also need stairs to get up to the doors, the doors line up with the external model and the S2 cockpit, can't move them down.

Keep the 2 floor idea and somehow work around that window placement, either putting a staircase or ladder there to give a cut-out in the floor that makes the window somewhat visible, or stagger the internal floor into several sections, one as high as the current top floor, one as low as the current bottom floor, and one in the middle that lets kerbals on seats there look out the window

Edited March 19, 2014 by K3|Chris

[Taki117]

I like option A. Make a single floor with the bottom being pipes and stuff, and the top being overhead bins for storage (Similar to passenger liners of today)

Included is a diagram of how it might look.

[K3-Chris]

Yeah, only issue is this:

Very quick mockup, as you can see the scale is quite different, remember kerbals are about 0.5m tall, the S2 hull is 2m high and wide, humans are 1.8m~ so lets say 3x as big roughly, a 737's cabin is about 3.8m wide, 2m x 3 = 6m, the S2 parts in scale with kerbals are basically twice the size of a 737.

You're loosing a ton of volume up there to air, and we need steps to get up to the door.

[CattyNebulart]

I like what you are doing with this.

Hmm mabye make a table/floor that is atdoor hight, but then the kerbals are seated it is a table? put a boardgame or something on it.

[K3-Chris]

Came up with this while trying stuff:

Kerbal View

Can see "the window" (black outline again)

4 seats on the bottom, walkway between the doors, a non-added yet ladder would connect the bottom floor with the walkway, and in the 4 corners a suspended room so to speak fits, one can be a toilet/shower, the other 3 storage for snacks etc. The walkway would obviously have a higher part on the edge not a slope to stop unwary feet from stepping into thin air, and a handrail open where the ladder would be, and could connect to handholds for the ladder, the 4 corner nitches are just blocked out in pure volumes, would obviously be textured properly etc, The walkway could be a grate to afford better view of the top half from bellow, and the walkway would obviously connect edge to edge with the 4 corner niches, it's all very rough just to figure out the layout, none of the details are final. Bottom floor would obviously have tables/trays etc for the kerbals to eat from, and scattered random stuff a kerbal might need/want for a long mission.

Edited March 19, 2014 by K3|Chris

[Armchair Rocket Scientist]

Yeah, only issue is this:

http://imgur.com/3kYAVtK

http://i.imgur.com/3kYAVtK.png

Very quick mockup, as you can see the scale is quite different, remember kerbals are about 0.5m tall, the S2 hull is 2m high and wide, humans are 1.8m~ so lets say 3x as big roughly, a 737's cabin is about 3.8m wide, 2m x 3 = 6m, the S2 parts in scale with kerbals are basically twice the size of a 737.

You're loosing a ton of volume up there to air, and we need steps to get up to the door.

I was under the impression that kerbals are just under 1 meter tall, so the scale works out pretty well.

Are the windows on the S2 crew tanks part of the model, or are they part of the texture? If it's the latter, what if you just moved them upwards so they're at the right height for the two-deck model?

[K3-Chris]

Those seats and the external model are 1:1 scale with the game assets, so the scale is right, so standing they might be about 0.75m

What do you think about the walkway concept?