Renaissance0321 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I've got almost 200 hours into KSP and I'm just now considering Mechjeb because I'm at the point where I can come in for a landing hot and sideways with one hand on my keyboard and the other drinking a cup of coffee. I can screw it all up but still recover, slam on the brakes and land softly at 1m/s all while in IVA because I like the immersion. I've watched countless tutorials and fiddled with maneuver nodes for hours to get it just right. I've watched tediously built rockets get stuck on far away planets because they were short a couple dV which I probably would have had if I'd flown better. I'm at the point where I feel like I've earned the right to sit back and let my "autopilot" make the trip I've done hundred times now and could probably do in my sleep. I guess I don't get why some people would START with Mechjeb. Where's the fun in that? It seems to me KSP is about building things and testing stuff and generally learning the game for yourself. I'll never forget watching my rockets doing backflips when I first started. Now I have an entire fleet of rovers/landers/satellites etc. I get this game has a steep learning curve but why would I want an easy mode instant gratification autopilot that ruins the feeling of accomplishment? There's other games out there for that... Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stengord Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I fully agree.I normally play with full vanilla, and have only just started with mods. To add a bit more depth (remote tech, scansat).The only thing I'd like to pull from MechJeb is the ship statistics.Other than that it's like playing Minecraft in creative and not actually making anything jaw dropping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othuyeg Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Some people do not have so much time to invest in video games and I think MJ allows them an easier way of enjoying their Kerbal experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kerbart Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Wait, other players get to decide how someone should enjoy the game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xetalim Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Please not this discussion again, there are players who like using mechjeb.This is entirely based on someone's opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainKipard Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I don't get it either. It's like letting the game play itself. I'm in over 1000 hours and I've never even downloaded MJ, but I got kOS a few months ago instead, and I'm writing my own maneuver scripts. It's much more fun this way. I only write scripts for things that get really repetitive and I already know how to do well, like executing a maneuver node or cancelling relative velocity at a rendezvous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skorpychan Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I only use it for rendezvouses, because they're a pain in the ass to crunch numbers on. Beyond that, landing, docking, ascent, and setting up maneuvers is fairly simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Mort Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I've got almost 200 hours into KSP and I'm just now considering Mechjeb because I'm at the point where I can come in for a landing hot and sideways with one hand on my keyboard and the other drinking a cup of coffee. I can screw it all up but still recover, slam on the brakes and land softly at 1m/s all while in IVA because I like the immersion. Thoughts?Well hurrah for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Crunch numbers? You only have to align the little chevrons on the map. Select you target and mess around with orbit until the markers appear.I rarely use MechJeb for anything but stats, kOS is a much better, more interesting alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasuha Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I guess I don't get why some people would START with Mechjeb. Where's the fun in that?There are people who don't really want to explore the game via trial and error and learn on the course. They just want to have fun playing the game and sending things flying, sending out missions and building their space stations.Plus there are many people who, when asked, will tell you that MechJeb is essential and you cannot play the game without it. If you're a newbie, you're likely to believe that.I don't use MechJeb, I have not installed a single mod ever since I started playing this. But I understand that different people can have fun different ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSSPutnik Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I have not installed a single mod ever since I started playing this. But I understand that different people can have fun different ways.Not even tempted by the different structural parts on offer? I can understand eschewing mods that alter game physics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macegee Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 When I started playing KSP (August 2012), I figured how to get into orbit without any mods. But since UI in KSP is, well, lets just say "bad", I started using MJ for information panels. Got to use Smart A.S.S. in the process.Don't even remember if there were any automation functions (other than Smart ASS) in MJ at that time, but even in MJ 2.0, I've never used them. The most important thing MJ brough to me was delta-v calculator. I was able to calculate craft's parameters since like day 1 by hand, but it was too tedious.If it wasn't for MJ, I probably would've end up in "MOAR BOOSTERS" camp with more casual players, or just stopped playing. I'm glad I didn't, but now I hate SQUAD for their game design decisions (lack of informational panels in flight view, delta-v/twr/mass/etc in VAB, etc). Shame on them.I switched to Engineer quite a while ago, btw, but that's another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaveFunctionP Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 KSP isn't a contest, there are no winners or losers in the game. Just pure fun, however you choose to define it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Random Tank Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I do agree that everyone should play the game however they want, but I think everyone should at least play without MJ for a while to practice; because MJ isn't perfect, it does make mistakes, so if the player has some experience they can try to sort the problem out themselves when MJ mucks it up (like landing or docking for example).I myself play without MJ, because I like doing everything myself, and I wouldn't trust some dirty AI to do it for me! But if people want to use MJ, that's fine with me; Its your save file, do what you want, everyone is covered by freedom of speech and decision and all that malarkey! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pondafarr Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Coffee should be banned and you should only drink distilled water from guru approved mountain springs. Pushing your own bias against others is morally reprehensible. Let people play the way they want. The holier than thou attitude against legitimate play tools does nothing to advance the fun and community spirit of this game.Live and let live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Crunch numbers? You only have to align the little chevrons on the map. Select you target and mess around with orbit until the markers appear.I rarely use MechJeb for anything but stats, kOS is a much better, more interesting alternative.Not if you want the most fuel efficient rendezvous, you'd have do do a lot of trial and error to get it dead on just by twiddling manoeuvre nodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas988 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I don't use MechJeb at all. Doing everything manually just feels so much more rewarding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macegee Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I also forgot to mention that I'm laughing at the stereotype that "MJ = autopilot". MJ was always the most reliable, better supported and capable mod. Engineer and others appeared much later, and were not as popular/reliable (better supported) as MJ. Things changed a bit nowadays, but my point is still standing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levelord Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I've got almost 200 hours into KSP and I'm just now considering Mechjeb because I'm at the point where I can come in for a landing hot and sideways with one hand on my keyboard and the other drinking a cup of coffee. I can screw it all up but still recover, slam on the brakes and land softly at 1m/s all while in IVA because I like the immersion. I've watched countless tutorials and fiddled with maneuver nodes for hours to get it just right. I've watched tediously built rockets get stuck on far away planets because they were short a couple dV which I probably would have had if I'd flown better. I'm at the point where I feel like I've earned the right to sit back and let my "autopilot" make the trip I've done hundred times now and could probably do in my sleep. I guess I don't get why some people would START with Mechjeb. Where's the fun in that? It seems to me KSP is about building things and testing stuff and generally learning the game for yourself. I'll never forget watching my rockets doing backflips when I first started. Now I have an entire fleet of rovers/landers/satellites etc. I get this game has a steep learning curve but why would I want an easy mode instant gratification autopilot that ruins the feeling of accomplishment? There's other games out there for that... Thoughts?You forget that even hardened veterans like myself use MechJeb. We can fly into orbits and do interplanetary transfers with our eyes closed, but eventually these tasks get repetitive and boring. So we put MJ in charge of tasks we've already mastered and leave other more complex and interesting tasks (like SSTO flight, aerobraking, easter egg spotting) for ourselves to handle.It's similar to real life where astronauts are well trained enough to pilot without computer assistance, but also use computer auto-pilots to handle tedious tasks that are boring and time consuming, freeing them up to do other more interesting tasks. This doesn't mean that we are reliant on MJ, because just like in real life we can easily and quickly respond to AI malfunctions using our innate knowledge and experience. When you're in my position launching several hundred identical flights manually, it gets boring real fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirrobert Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) -snip-You'd be suprised how extremely good Mechjeb is as a learning tool.I used to be absolutly horribly CRAP at landing, and docking? HA, didn't even need to bother.So I let mechjeb do it. After a few times of watching how mechjeb lands, I figured I could do it faster. Now I'm pritty damn good at landing.Same with docking. Even now that I do it myself, the smart ASS takes away alot of annoying fiddling around to get the alignment just right.And watch Mechjeb auto takeoff a few times, and you quickly learn that 'tilt 45 degrees at 10km up' can be much improved.And than offcourse there are the readouts, that you'd be pritty stupid NOT to want Edited March 23, 2014 by KasperVld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levelord Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Dude what is the sense in quoting the OP when you're not even addressing their point.Elitism accusation. I think we have a winner!Dodgey, pass the popcorn to the left hand side. I know I shouldn't be responding to obvious bait, but...The OP's point is that they don't understand why anyone would use MJ, I answered that point with reasons why people like myself would use it.My post is about using MJ when we're bored, is because we've mastered something and not being bored in the sense that we couldn't be bothered to learn a task. Your (self edited) 'quote' of my post simply lacks these important details about what I said which is why you're obviously not seeing the point I'm trying to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainKipard Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The OP's point is that they don't understand why anyone would use MJNo this topic is about MJ being used by beginners. It's in the title...Also I use kOS the same way you use MJ, but that's not the issue in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daze Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 You forget that even hardened veterans like myself use MechJeb. We can fly into orbits and do interplanetary transfers with our eyes closed, but eventually these tasks get repetitive and boring. So we put MJ in charge of tasks we've already mastered and leave other more complex and interesting tasks (like SSTO flight, aerobraking, easter egg spotting) for ourselves to handle.It's similar to real life where astronauts are well trained enough to pilot without computer assistance, but also use computer auto-pilots to handle tedious tasks that are boring and time consuming, freeing them up to do other more interesting tasks. This doesn't mean that we are reliant on MJ, because just like in real life we can easily and quickly respond to AI malfunctions using our innate knowledge and experience. When you're in my position launching several hundred identical flights manually, it gets boring real fast.Quote all and i add that it gets boring real real fast when you nave a family of launcher lauched billions of times.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levelord Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 No this topic is about MJ being used by beginners. It's in the title...Also I use kOS the same way you use MJ, but that's not the issue in this thread.Ah I see where the OP is coming from now, but the last part of his post was steering away from the original point he was making to encompass why anyone would use MJ at all. I was responding to that. I could make another post explaining why newbies would use MJ as a learning tool, but I'll finish up my coffee until then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KasperVld Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) A kind reminder to focus on discussing the topic at hand, and not make off-topic remarks or revert to argumentum ad hominem.Also: thread moved to the Add-ons discussion forum Edited March 23, 2014 by KasperVld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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