[1.0.x] [V1.9f] Kerbal Foundries wheels, anti-grav repulsors and tracks

[lo-fi]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/98672-WIN-KSP-to-DDS-texture-converter

[Gaalidas]

Be careful when converting to DDS though, I've had a lot of trouble with textures suddenly being unreadable by KSP and ending up with pure white parts. For the time being, I've had to convert all the DDS textures from most of the mods I use back into PNG to get them to load properly.

In other news, I just got a ton of new inspiration for rover design thanks to a heavy dose of off-road mayhem. My father and I just went to see Mad Max. There are really no applicable words for the whacky stuff I've just seen.

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And I'm really enjoying the fact that 1.0.x seems to have redesigned parachutes so you can actually use them as drag chutes on the ground. Rocket powered dragsters are fun now.

That is what we need screenshots of. Rocket powered dragsters with parachutes. The only thing that could be done with that, to make it more "Kerbal" is to have rocket power dragsters with rocket powered brakes, and no parachutes.

Edited May 26, 2015 by Gaalidas

[B-STRK]

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A few notes on what lo-fi has said here:

The wheel sounds mod, last I checked, still relies on the stock wheel module to determine what pitch/volume to play the sounds at. So, while KF wheels and the stock conversions will behave alongside the sound mod, the sounds will only actually react to wheels still using the stock module. Anything running the KF module would rely on the way lo-fi implemented the sounds himself and not the way the other mod handles them. So, as lo-fi said, you'll have no problems, unless you consider the wheel sound mod not actually working on the KF-configured wheels a problem... in that case you'll have tons of problems. It's all a matter of perspective really.

The good thing is that since you guys plugged in your own sound files to the plugin, I've decided not to go with the rover wheels sound mod. I guess it's enough for me to have any audio feedback, or the immersion to hear a motor running, even if it's not the electric whine more associated with the other mod. (Plus, I assume that on a non-atmo Mun, where I am primarily taking the KF conversions, these sounds would be quite muted, which I feel might be closer to your motor sounds anyway. )

[riocrokite]

during researching planetary mining I stumbled upon interesting stuff;

large tracks concept:

also new movie take on Mars vehicle wheels is coming soon (looks like weird mock-up and mix of ideas though):

[DeepOdyssey]

Texture extension such as .tga .png is embedded in a .mu file[model file]. You just can't convert texture to .dds and expect it to work. You can reopen model though, and change texture, or use HEX editor to edit model file.

[lo-fi]

Absolutely incorrect. As long as the texture name is correct and the texture is in a format KSP will load, it doesn't care about the extension.

Thanks, Riocrokite, they're pretty cool.

[Gaalidas]

Texture extension such as .tga .png is embedded in a .mu file[model file]. You just can't convert texture to .dds and expect it to work. You can reopen model though, and change texture, or use HEX editor to edit model file.

Yeah, so... at one time in the far past this actually made a difference and there was even a tool to convert all those extensions to to correct the textures. However, I joiend the KSP bandwagon around when .18 was released, and at that time the extension in the .mu file no longer made a difference. However, I will say that the stock DDS support is rather buggy and so I would still suggest that the mod author make up their own mind about DDS and if they don't do it, then it is up to the end user to convert them if they wish. DDS presents a number of issues related to quality (mip-maps may increase performance, but often times you will see a blurry mip-level even when the camera is pressed against the part) and, as I have experienced (along with several others, though we are a minority at this time), KSP will sometimes be unable to load a particular DDS image for unknown reasons leading to pure white parts. Because of this, I have had to, quite annoyingly, manually re-convert most textures back into PNG to avoid "missing texture syndrome."

[lo-fi]

Honestly, I think I'd rather set up the texture sharing for the parts. I still can't get DDS textures to look acceptable.

[AntiMatter001]

hate to bring up something that was sortof fixed in the previous version (i think) but the turning... on the tracks...

i have a tank with just two of the inverted medium tracks (one either side) and when i turn initially it goes right when i press right and goes left when i press right...

normal tanks have two tracks (left and right) and when your trying to turn you slow one side down so you turn in the intended direction.

BUT

when i speed up and i press right i go left. as if instead of the track slowing down on the right it's speeding up making it swerve left.

once again if you need a better explanation I’d be happy to recompile my english into some sort of diagram or more blabering.

[Gaalidas]

well, lo-fi, you've got my post a few pages back which explains what I've found in the area of texture sharing. I've even done it to a few parts using config bash methods to save ram locally, but in the end you'll have to choose one of the options available and do some reorganizing of the assets. It's mostly easy to do, just a bit of a pain in the brain to keep track of. Of course, it'll be completely pointless for the parts that have dedicated textures.

[smjjames]

hate to bring up something that was sortof fixed in the previous version (i think) but the turning... on the tracks...

i have a tank with just two of the inverted medium tracks (one either side) and when i turn initially it goes right when i press right and goes left when i press right...

normal tanks have two tracks (left and right) and when your trying to turn you slow one side down so you turn in the intended direction.

BUT

when i speed up and i press right i go left. as if instead of the track slowing down on the right it's speeding up making it swerve left.

once again if you need a better explanation I’d be happy to recompile my english into some sort of diagram or more blabering.

Did you check to be sure that the tracks are set to the correct side? Ie, left side tracks are set to left. Sometimes it works normally, but symmetry can do funky things with it sometimes.

[lo-fi]

hate to bring up something that was sortof fixed in the previous version (i think) but the turning... on the tracks...

i have a tank with just two of the inverted medium tracks (one either side) and when i turn initially it goes right when i press right and goes left when i press right...

normal tanks have two tracks (left and right) and when your trying to turn you slow one side down so you turn in the intended direction.

BUT

when i speed up and i press right i go left. as if instead of the track slowing down on the right it's speeding up making it swerve left.

once again if you need a better explanation I’d be happy to recompile my english into some sort of diagram or more blabering.

Do you mean the RBI inverting tracks? In which case, try putting them the other way up. The tracks have two steering modes: low speed is handled by differential motor action, but this is ineffective at high speed, which is achieved by braking the inside track. Mounting the tracks upside down confuses the orientation routine and leads to what you're describing. Unless you're using something else, in which case it could be a bug.

well, lo-fi, you've got my post a few pages back which explains what I've found in the area of texture sharing. I've even done it to a few parts using config bash methods to save ram locally, but in the end you'll have to choose one of the options available and do some reorganizing of the assets. It's mostly easy to do, just a bit of a pain in the brain to keep track of. Of course, it'll be completely pointless for the parts that have dedicated textures.

Yeah, thanks for that. I'll look at converting and exporting some models to see how it goes.

[Gaalidas]

Do you mean the RBI inverting tracks? In which case, try putting them the other way up. The tracks have two steering modes: low speed is handled by differential motor action, but this is ineffective at high speed, which is achieved by braking the inside track. Mounting the tracks upside down confuses the orientation routine and leads to what you're describing. Unless you're using something else, in which case it could be a bug.

Perhaps a note in the part description should read: "Warranty void if inverted."

Either way, I'd think that inverting the inverting tracks would cause the tracks to behave normal, except that they're inverted. Guess we need to investigate into some form of check to see if the tracked part itself (as well as the craft so we can track pre-inverted tracks being put right-side up by an inverted craft) is inverted and thus invert all the controls to compensate. Hmm... I think I just confused myself. Which way is up again?

On another note, I messed about with the ERS wheel implementation last night, and it's interesting at the very least. Having the issue where the wheel treads seem to be doubled (either that or it's showing both the forward and reversed tread model at the same time), but otherwise not too bad.

I have no idea what that other wheel is that you posted a config for, nor where it's available.

Edited May 26, 2015 by Gaalidas

[lo-fi]

I can't actually get the ERS wheel to work properly with the latest release. The orientation is all screwed up :/

The other wheel is from Wayland something - it was requested a few pages back. Quite a nice looking wheel.

I know think there is a "this way up" on the inverting track. Adding a check seemed a bit redundant, as they work fine if attached to the craft the correct way up, then its flipped over. For a game about rockets, KSP has an interesting way of defining up

[ZodiusInfuser]

I can't actually get the ERS wheel to work properly with the latest release. The orientation is all screwed up :/

Is it 90 degrees offset like my wheels by any chance?

[Hookswords]

I just wanted to share this and say thank you. I couldnt have made this without this mod and many others. Thanks you!

[rabidninjawombat]

I just wanted to share this and say thank you. I couldnt have made this without this mod and many others. Thanks you!

All i gotta say is wow! epic video

[S1000RRHP4]

Nicely done!

I love your war-truck

[lo-fi]

That's incredible, Hookswords! Thank you!

[riocrokite]

interesting development on Squad front;

"The one thing that is giving me a run for it are the wheels. The new wheels in Unity5 apparently still have a few issues of their own, which makes them very much unsuitable for their job of being wheels… They become unstable if other rigidbodies are attached to the wheeled body, which in our case means the other 100+ parts that make up the ship. Needless to say, that was a problem.

There is a solution, however, and this is why I love Unity (I don’t even get paid to say this). If something doesn’t fit your needs, there is in 99% of cases something you can get that will do the job as you need it done, and once more we turned to the Asset Store and found a very cool package that handles vehicle/wheel physics in not only a very realistic way, but that is also module-based and fits right in with our own part modules scheme. I’m very much looking forward to starting work on it."

Now I looked what this package might be; the only thing I've found is this:

https://www.assetstore.unity3d.com/en/#!/content/403

Now this guy seems to know a bit about new unity stuff, I wonder whether he plays KSP . Still this model is much simpler than KF stuff

http://www.edy.es/dev/vehicle-physics/user-guide/

also physx 3.3 fails simulating vehicle on 2 wheels:

Edited May 27, 2015 by riocrokite

[lo-fi]

Bad times ahead :/

I've run into that unity package during my own research - he does seem to know his stuff. The problem here will be that everything will get tied into the stock modules to implement the workarounds in that package. Now, I would either have to implement the same sort of fixes myself (if I'm even able) or just use the stock modules. Which means none of the more advanced KF features any more. Neither way will allow the tracks to survive

Thanks for the info, I'll be keeping a close eye.

[smjjames]

I hope that they do plenty of testing with wheels XD

[ZodiusInfuser]

I hope that they do plenty of testing with wheels XD

They're SQUAD, they won't

[smjjames]

They're SQUAD, they won't

Yeah I know

[AntiMatter001]

Did you check to be sure that the tracks are set to the correct side? Ie, left side tracks are set to left. Sometimes it works normally, but symmetry can do funky things with it sometimes.

ho hum... fine back to the drawing board but having the probodyne probe upside down might not help....

forgot to mention that the tank i'm working on uses the probodyne body flipped 180 degrees... AND scaled up