Madrias Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Gaalidas, that's the easy way. I want the science lab behind the machine, yet not jamming up my EVA hatch... After all, I really don't like tippy rovers on places like Eve where it's next to impossible for me to get my kerbals back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Still messing around with the DSR2, and about the only thing I can really think of that would be really nice to have is a matching design of science lab. Well, that, and some method to mount it that doesn't block up the rear door. I know, I know, you're not supposed to drag science labs with you while using a rover, but I always want to do things like that.A trailer is on my wish list. I'll come up with something! Latest build: External components are now modular We could rig some sort of truss mount so you could carry the thing on the roof. Yeah, it'd be really top heavy and hard to use, but I'm sure you could find some way of making it work, right? After all, Kerbals do things the hard way because... well... Science! And physics... and all that crazy stuff.Just got those two new configs set up as patches. I realized that if you wanted to simply add new parts made out of stock models, you wouldn't need to use a patch to do it really. So, I'm focusing on replacement patches. Still haven't had a chance to do any personal testing of things since my major fail earlier. I guess that'll have to wait for tomorrow.Cool, let me know what you think. I've tried tweakscaling various tracks and whatnot, and had a question. Sorry if this has already been addressed. Thinking of the alpha tracks or mole tracks as an example:- Scaled up (like to 200 or 400%), the force of the tracks seems to increase way more than it should - at 400% and mashing W for forward, they're powerful enough to fling a 20,000-ton ship up off the ground (4 pairs, 8 total tracks). Is there some tweakscale exponent controlling this that can be adjusted? Didn't see one in the scaleexponents cfg...- Same is more or less true for the springiness of the tracks - they tend to be pretty bouncy for their apparent size.Any others experience this?I think it'll be to do with how the colliders scale, so there probably needs to be a variable that TS changes. Their 'torque' is measured in force, not force over radius, which should go some way to explain it I'll get to it soon, it's been on the list for ages! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madrias Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Modular components are always good. I suppose that means the box on the roof, those bottles, and any other things can move around. As for the idea of a trailer, major kudos if you manage that! I'd love to have a trailer. Wouldn't mind a themed science lab and maybe, just maybe, a cargo bay. I can do wicked things with cargo bays (like hiding my KSP Interstellar Fusion Reactors), and I love having a portable science lab. It's just something I do, I carry a porta-lab on any long-distance, long duration mission where I know either the Kerbals aren't coming home (for a long time) or where transmitting the science is necessary due to distance constraints.I do love the DSR2, though, as it's a very beautiful piece of moving machinery. I love the fact that, while it doesn't fit with any hardware I have in KSP (in either color or design), it looks visually stunning. Combine that with an industry leading crash tolerance and you have a rover that becomes useful on any world, any terrain. The onboard generator is sufficient for running wheels, though is just underpowered enough that running repulsors requires an additional power supply, which I like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 There's a time and a place for 'stock-a-like', but sometimes you've got to break with that and do your own thing IMHO. All good to hear though, that's precisely what we're aiming for yep, the tanks and box are now separate parts, and more will follow. The trailer I have one or two ideas for, and I need to look into what a science lab actually is and does cargo pod is a definite, all details tba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Initial tests are good for the stock wheels, except for that first one you did. I still need to test it on its own, but I experienced it clipping half-way into the ground when suspension was tuned to 0%. I was testing all three wheels on a single craft though, so I'll test individually later. All together, however, still performed amazingly well. Not quite as nicely as your custom wheels however. Those still hand the stock wheels their rear ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hmm, I thought I'd broken the suspension adjustments and I haven't had a chance to look at it yet. Nice to give the stock models a new lease of life; I even had to adjust the CoM on the TR-2L. Maybe my aim of setting the gold standard for KSP wheels isn't too far off though Still mulling over how to do a trailer hitch. I know it's possible with KAS, but maybe there is a better way... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpannerMonkey(smce) Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Hi all, I do have a pair of IR joints that couple to make trailer hitches, you may remember the replusor train vid from a while back, it's what connects the trailers ofc:). The snag of course is that a real hitch requires several degrees of freedom to be suitable for uneven terrain, otherwise bad things happen either to the tow vehicle or the towed part. Sadly due to ksp's core this isn't anywhere near possible with standard parts. So it's got to be plugin powered. We can get away with two joints , one pivoting vertically and one horizontally , similar to a universal joint, this design does have limitations. the best solution would be a ball and socket affair, but accomplishing that well.. A cargo bay/trailer is a must really, want to do one anyway, I do feel though that a DSR3C, C for cargo would be a neater solution, keep the DSR3 as CnC (command and control) and the C to feature a flatbed rear with a detachable cargo module and or science module , if these are attached by docking ports and some funky clampage then fitted with animated legs, they could be deployed on station allowing the vehicle to carry more stuff to the location . This doesn't mean no trailers, they'll still be done I'm awaiting a very special plugin that will allow some truly amazing animated deploy-ables to be created, sample collectors, drills etcCheersSpanner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Yeah, I could see pod idea working well actually. Marce has some genius new struts which attach in flight that will make perfect tie down points to stabilise the whole lot. Are you thinking remove the rear compartment, keep the front as is and build a docking port into the flat bed at the rear? I suppose if you're doing that, you end up with a thunderbird 2 type affair, in which you just pick which pod you want. Would be neat! I forgot about you repulsor train, that was cool! The trailer has to happen, even if I have to rip the IR plugin to pieces and change what joint options you can make. Getting on that right after the next KF release Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 So, I forget what mod exactly added this, but I know there's this sort of docking port that i have which consists of two parts which are meant to fit together to create what looks like a truck connection to something like a boat hauler (I don't think I'm using the right names for these things.) It's like one side has a ball and the other side sorta snaps onto the ball to create a rather free-moving joint. I'm sure it's just taking advantage of the stock docking mounts' flexibility in their stock connection strength. Either way, I've been able to connect some trailers that way. Unfortunately, like normal docking parts, it also had the tendency to try and straighten out whenever possible, so the connection is far from free-moving. Otherwise you could connect a free-moving docking plate with an unpowered hinge to create a hitch that would be able to move around freely without trying to re-center itself. However, that would not create the prettiest of solutions unless you tried to combine those functions into a single set of docking ports. I've heard that putting docking ports on the ends of IR parts can have some weird effects, so I wouldn't go that route.You may just have to make one yourself from scratch. Wonder if you could hack up the wheel code to handle something like that? An omni-wheel type movement on a docking-port with the appearance of a truck hitch? hmm... Now, to get it to work with rear hatches like in the DSR pods, you'd need to develop an arm that extends to the side a bit and back to the center a ways back to give the vertical-opening door room to unfold... or have a way of extending a trailer-hitch boom outwards when opening the door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Thanks, you've given me a couple of ideas. I'll see what I can do when I have some time. Not really sure about the door issue, it also creates problems for doing a stack launch :/ Not sure how to get around that one.I've created a GitHub repo for the 3rd party wheel configs. Only stock squad wheels are in there for the moment, but I'll have a look at the Rollcage ones too when I get a chance. Anyone wishing to install and try just needs to copy the WheelConfigs folder into Gamedata. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpannerMonkey(smce) Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 And because you mentioned it( totally off thread) and because it finally flies thanks to the new lifting hull module, an almost scale thunderbird2 my all time favourite scifi craft ( i have a love of stuff that works for a living not just looks pretty see)Very interesting regarding the docking port hitch, G, I'll look into that for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Only you, Spanner! One of my favourites too, and what a workhorse she was Nice work, looks really good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren9 Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 If you could achieve what a KAS winch does when its reeled in to 1cm that would be special, there's no option to to be un-docked from the trailer with IR and if you put a docking port after a floppy joint it flops down and can't easily be re-docked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 I'm code diving IR for the joint stuff, will be doing the same with KAS shortly... I think I've seen some of your vids where you've used the KAS stuff for trailer towing? I am indeed looking for the 'undocked' behaviour you can specify with KAS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Actually, creating a configurable joint in KSP is trivial. Thanks, Sirkut! I got concept code working in about an hour; now I need to read up on getting the joint configured correctly to give the right amount of angular movement in each axis. It already gives me the KAS type 'attached but not docked' situation I'm looking for. This is going to be cool!The hitching procedure is going to be the hard part to figure out here. I'm going to need to write a routine similar to the way the docking ports attract to each other, then only lock and create the joint when they are lined up within limits. I don't need to care so much about rotation, as we're looking at a ball hitch type affair, but position is going to be critical or it'll all look weird and out of kilter. Unless someone has a better idea for how to hitch up?Thought I'd see if I could make a docking port you can't undock... Yup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpannerMonkey(smce) Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 You never cease to amaze me, here's a little challenge as you like that kind of thing, the one thing missing for the repulsor craft is Steerable engine mounts, gimbals are horribly snappy, IR is too slow even when fast, not a fan of a thousand rcs nozzles(like the repluso train) so a dedicated steerable engine mount must be added to the list, lunch time tomorrow will be ok Re flexijointIs it possible to have the range of movement within set limits? would a fifth wheel fork and pin arrangement be feasible? if so this could deal with misalignment by guiding the pin to position? snag is it all gets a bit long. Just thought are we making this overly complicated, what about a simple pin and eye , gives all the floppyness( technical term) you need without all the complication, not saying your solution isn't more elegant, as i mentioned amazed at how fast you've got a working out how stuff works. I do like the simplicity of a pin and eye, wont take long to test see if it'd work and it's just models.Just tested the revised collider, all's good , DSR3revF is on it's way, don't want to talk about rev E:rolleyes:..... On it's way v soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Yeah, I think I can see a way to do the steerable mounts. Ought to be as simple as breaking the joint that ksp creates between the root of the mount and the engine part attached to it, and creating a new one between the GO that gets rotated and the engine. Yes and no on the joint. You can configure limits, but the hard part is getting the darn things to line up in the first place. I take it you mean use pin and eye with standard colliders, though? It will sort of work, but you'll get odd points where the collision fails and they will skip right through each other the same way you can fire parts through each other if you shoot them fast enough. We don't have anywhere near a small enough physics time step unfortunately - it's why anything that matters tends to use raycasts.Great stuff, looking forward to the next revision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) If, by the steering mounts, you are talking about tying in a gimbal-like mount into the same steering controls as you would get with a wheel, then I'm all for it. One thing that's irritated me about gimbals on standard engines is that it's very easy to get an engine that gimbals the wrong direction and have to manually invert the behavior on every launch. Very annoying.Also, I'd like to see another pass at allowing more of the wheel settings to be incremented/decremented by action groups. The repulsors have height-change actions on them, but having that for adjusting the suspension on the wheels would be great, along with auto-updating the rest of their numbered group when using the action in that way. I don't really know why, but having to right click on a wheel, especially when the craft is moving and considering it's hard to click on the wheels themselves unless your camera is oriented just right, and all that just really annoys me. Sorta like when I learned how to control my computer from the command line. Now, I just can't do some things using the windows GUI without feeling ill.Oh, by the way, love that we're getting the stock configs up, and I continue to update a MM patch to apply all those settings to the originals. Are we likely to get a config for those ASET wheels? Edited October 31, 2014 by Gaalidas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Yep, thats what we're looking at Haha, I'll see what I can do with the AG's. There is such a disconnect between how the gui action and the action group behaves you can wind yourself into a major muddle if not being very careful. And forgetting action groups and being stuck with only stuff on the left hand side being in the groups after moving a part still pisses me off... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaalidas Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 That's why I always do my action groups last. Heck, I'll even test the thing in the world before going back and assigning action groups, just to be sure. However, I have not yet encountered that specific ....-off-able situation.EDIT: what the... so it lets you enter the word "pisses" but won't let me use the word with the last "es" cut off? Eesh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 I didn't even realise we had censorship going on!I'll get the ASET wheel config added too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madrias Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Hmm... I'm not so sure on what type of hitch would work best, but I'll surely enjoy hooking a trailer to a DSR unit and carrying some science and a micro rover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Well, I never imagined I'd be the one to do it, but it's going to happen I'll be honest, I've dreamed up about 100 other cool things I can do with joints since breakfast... Bye bye sleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drtedastro Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Have two more doughnuts and then it will be easy.....LoL....Looking forward to see what you come up with.I have been needing some sort of trailer hitch / connection for awhile... Yours will be FAR greater than mine...Cheers...Sleep is highly over-rated... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo-fi Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Well that remains to be seen! I have a feeling it's going to take more than two donuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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