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[WIP] NASA SLS - Released: Orion MPCV Core Module 1.0 [4/18/2015]

noonespecial

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ethan829

ethan829

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Not to stir up trouble, but recent official documentation in anticipation of CDR has portrayed Space Launch System with an unpainted core.

Yep, it's been all but confirmed for quite a while now that the core will be orange. They learned their lesson about unnecessary paint from the shuttle ET.

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noonespecial

noonespecial

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Not to stir up trouble, but recent official documentation in anticipation of CDR has portrayed Space Launch System with an unpainted core.
Yep, it's been all but confirmed for quite a while now that the core will be orange. They learned their lesson about unnecessary paint from the shuttle ET.

Hopefully this will be the last time this issue is address, because it is nothing more than highly annoying at this point. Kibble, if you have some "recent official documentation", then please provide it. Otherwise, I have ever single piece of official source material from white papers, presentations, brochures, photographs, videos... you name it, I have it. My most recent official document is dated May 12th 2015 and it still shows SLS with a painted core. ehtan829, it has been speculated for a while that the core will be orange. Confirmed as entirely the wrong word and it would be incorrect if it were the right word.

Beyond that, you have to understand WHY a rocket is painted or unpainted, you have to understand that rationale. Why was the Mercury painted? Why was the Saturn painted? Why was the Gemini painted? Why was the Shuttle ET NOT painted? Why WILL the SLS be painted? Many people, scattered all over the internet, have debated whether the SLS will be painted or not. All of the people debating this have one thing in common. They don't know WHY a rocket is painted in the first place. If they knew why a rocket is painted, then there would be no discussion.

Some people state "thermal control". The paint is used to help control temperature and it was found in the Shuttle ET that the orange insulation was adequate for thermal control, so why not save the weight? If thermal control were the ONLY reason, then yeah, the SLS would probably be orange. However, thermal control is not the only reason to paint a rocket, it is also not the most important reason or it's primary purpose, a purpose that was not actually needed with the shuttle ET for obvious reasons. The primary purpose for painting a rocket, especially in high contrast black and white stripes/checker patterns is quite simply: ground control. The people on the ground NEED to be able to see if and when a rocket rolls during flight and by how much. That is the purpose of painted stripes and patterns, visible confirmation of rocket orientation during flight. This was not needed with the Shuttle because.... well, the ET has a giant shuttle attached to it's belly so you could easily see the orientation, it was asymmetrical.

However, all of this is irrelevant. Completely, 100%, totally, irrelevant. I have stated time and time and time again that I will adhere to the official documentation. ALL of the official documentation shows a painted core.

Even if, for some reason, SLS is left unpainted, it wouldn't be orange. If I were a betting man, I would say it will look like that Atlas V. I.E. completely unpainted.

Atlas-5-OTV-3-ULA.jpg

IMG_5925a_JUNO_Atlas_Ken-Kremer1.jpg

But again, and for the last time: Painted, Orange, or Unpainted? Which do I think it will be? Irrelevant. Which do you think it will be? Irrelevant. The Officially official documentation (as opposed to the unofficially "official" documentation that people keep PMing me) all show a painted core. Until such times as I see an officially press release from NASA, it will remain painted. Speculation, your personal desire for aesthetics, opinions, are completely irrelevant on this topic.

Thusly, any future speculation or statements in this thread on this topic will be promptly ignore and unacknowledged unless accompanied by said "recent official documentation" that states a change in the SLS design.

So is this 1.0 Compatible? Just wondering.

IS this 1.0 compatible. No, it's unreleased ;). WILL it be 1.0 compatible when I release it? Most certainly.

Edited by noonespecial
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ethan829

ethan829

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Hopefully this will be the last time this issue is address, because it is nothing more than highly annoying at this point. Kibble, if you have some "recent official documentation", then please provide it. Otherwise, I have ever single piece of official source material from white papers, presentations, brochures, photographs, videos... you name it, I have it. My most recent official document is dated May 12th 2015 and it still shows SLS with a painted core. ehtan829, it has been speculated for a while that the core will be orange. Confirmed as entirely the wrong word and it would be incorrect if it were the right word.

Beyond that, you have to understand WHY a rocket is painted or unpainted, you have to understand that rationale. Why was the Mercury painted? Why was the Saturn painted? Why was the Gemini painted? Why was the Shuttle ET NOT painted? Why WILL the SLS be painted? Many people, scattered all over the internet, have debated whether the SLS will be painted or not. All of the people debating this have one thing in common. They don't know WHY a rocket is painted in the first place. If they knew why a rocket is painted, then there would be no discussion.

Some people state "thermal control". The paint is used to help control temperature and it was found in the Shuttle ET that the orange insulation was adequate for thermal control, so why not save the weight? If thermal control were the ONLY reason, then yeah, the SLS would probably be orange. However, thermal control is not the only reason to paint a rocket, it is also not the most important reason or it's primary purpose, a purpose that was not actually needed with the shuttle ET for obvious reasons. The primary purpose for painting a rocket, especially in high contrast black and white stripes/checker patterns is quite simply: ground control. The people on the ground NEED to be able to see if and when a rocket rolls during flight and by how much. That is the purpose of painted stripes and patterns, visible confirmation of rocket orientation during flight. This was not needed with the Shuttle because.... well, the ET has a giant shuttle attached to it's belly so you could easily see the orientation, it was asymmetrical.

However, all of this is irrelevant. Completely, 100%, totally, irrelevant. I have stated time and time and time again that I will adhere to the official documentation. ALL of the official documentation shows a painted core.

Even if, for some reason, SLS is left unpainted, it wouldn't be orange. If I were a betting man, I would say it will look like that Atlas V. I.E. completely unpainted.

But again, and for the last time: Painted, Orange, or Unpainted? Which do I think it will be? Irrelevant. Which do you think it will be? Irrelevant. The Officially official documentation (as opposed to the unofficially "official" documentation that people keep PMing me) all show a painted core. Until such times as I see an officially press release from NASA, it will remain painted. Speculation, your personal desire for aesthetics, opinions, are completely irrelevant on this topic.

Thusly, any future speculation or statements in this thread on this topic will be promptly ignore and unacknowledged unless accompanied by said "recent official documentation" that states a change in the SLS design.\

Let me start by saying I'm not trying to start a big argument over this. You're definitely right about the fact that all official documentation so far has shown a painted tank, and there are no official sources stating otherwise (unless you count L2 as an official source). I tried to clarify this by saying it was "all but confirmed," but I can see the room for confusion there. I think it's a bit presumptuous to claim that no one speculating about this knows that many previous rockets were painted to provide visual confirmation of orientation. It's also sort of silly to make the claim that the shuttle didn't need painting because it was asymmetric, but to then post images of the symmetrical, unpainted, Atlas V. Modern rockets don't need to rely on painted stripes or patterns to provide ground controllers with the necessary flight data. There are countless examples of this.

There is also a precedent here set by Ares V, the Delta IV series, the H-IIA, and many other LH2/LOX rockets, just about all of which had (or were planned to have, in the case of Ares V) unpainted, insulated tanks. An unpainted SLS definitely wouldn't look like the Atlas V, because the liquid hydrogen tanks require insulation, just like you see on the Delta IV, et al.

All that being said, I love the work you're doing here and I'm sure this mod will turn out great whether the core tank is white, orange, or leopard-print. I apologize if I've come across as antagonistic; that's not my intention at all. Keep up the great work!

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Kibble

Kibble

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Posted (edited)

I could debate alot of what you said there (you're really not claiming to know better than professionals are you?), but I will just attach this image of Block IB, purportedly from CDR documentation. Honestly, I have not seen the full document, because it is only accessible to people who can afford the full L2 NSF account, but I trust the author of the article this was posted on to not just lie about it!

ezimba11112773415900.png

As you can see, it looks like Space Shuttle because it's based directly on Space Shuttle, and uses the same insulation, and even if ground controllers needed extra confirmation that the rocket wasn't rolling other than modern avionics and telemetry, it has those big white boosters, doesn't it!

Edited by Kibble
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noonespecial

noonespecial

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Whenever this topic comes back up I get really excited about the orange foam texture set that I'm gonna make for it lol

Warm up your photoshop, you'll be receiving the pre-release files soon :D

- - - Updated - - -

Just an FYI.

You may or may not have noticed that this is the second time that YANFRET has mentioned "orange SLS" and you'll also notice it's the second time I replied to him in a friendly manner. You may or may not have noticed that this was the second time parties-unnamed have mentioned "orange SLS" and noticed that my reply was a bit smart.

Right now, you may or may not be wondering, "Well, what's the difference? Why do YANFRET and I talk about the same thing yet get completely opposite responses?"

The answer would be:

One party is coming here and saying, "You're doing it wrong! Do it my way!"

The other party is coming here and saying, "I like what you're doing, but when you're done, can I make an alternate texture?"

Just an FYI. ;)

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  • 2 weeks later...
Noah_Blade

Noah_Blade

Posted
Posted
Presenting: (Updated 4/18/2015)

http://i.imgur.com/h1EQmYK.png?1

The core module of the Orion MPCV system.

Orion Black Final by noonespecial on Sketchfab

Downloads for the Orion (DDSLoader required for DDS versions, not included)

1k Resolution Textures (Normal / DDS)

2k Resolution Textures (Normal / DDS)

HD 4k Resolution Textures (DDS)

http://i.imgur.com/uvNjDum.gif

http://i.creativecommons.org/l/by-nc-sa/3.0/88x31.png

Credits

Greys - For initial hand holding that got my started on the correct path.

Starwaster - For his Reflection Plugin Continued.

http://i.imgur.com/XDvaE87.gif

http://i.imgur.com/mnWKYnb.gif

The MPCV may already exist in game in the form of simghai's SDHI, I haven't checked yet to see if the scale matches the SLS. If it does match, then one less part(s) to make. Otherwise SDHI doesn't match, I will make a matching version.

http://i.imgur.com/cBN3egw.gif

One of the more remarkable aspects of this long distance deployable space station is "...provides deep space vehicle assembly...". Sounds like there is an existing mod to compliment that no? Also, did you notice the central component?

http://i.imgur.com/G6SPRgy.gif

This part screams "SCIENCE!". Although, coding is my weakness and I'm not confident in my skills to be able to code a new science device. But I'm willing to give it a try. Can't be that hard, can it?

http://i.imgur.com/hkVwqix.gif

Not to much to say about these. I recall seeing pretty much these exact same components in other mods. I don't recall which off the top of my head though... I'll find them later.

http://i.imgur.com/AjaX01V.gif

Mars? They mean... Duna... right?

http://i.imgur.com/Xhu5APt.gif

While there is already ARM in stock KSP (since 23.5), the components in this Boeing concept art look uniquely different...

http://i.imgur.com/8hM7O6c.gif

Not to much details about this one. I'll do some research to see if I can find more information about this Europa probe.

http://i.imgur.com/pLGJHFI.gif

Another probe, but smaller than the Europa Clipper. But then again, it is just an orbiter. (Please, no tissue paper jokes)

http://i.imgur.com/L4cvvLr.gif

Another part that screams "SCIENCE". But, just looking at that thing makes my want to break out blender and start modeling.

http://i.imgur.com/4SAiuNN.gif

200 AU... another science related probe I'm thinking. Are those..... strange solar panels or almost stock RTGs on that thing?

http://i.imgur.com/ooIxil5.gif

Another probe... another opportunity for SCIENCE.

http://i.imgur.com/R9eyRR4.gif

ARM and ADM? Hmmmm.

http://i.imgur.com/GEFbeNG.gif

This looks like a type of inflatable habitat? Didn't I see one of those already available? ;)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Over the next few weeks, I will be digging up more information and dissecting the components of this system to more fully plan out it's possible future implementation.

I found video of what the redirect payload my look like in this article For you ARM

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299792458 m/s

299792458 m/s

Posted
Posted
Presenting: (Updated 4/18/2015)

http://i.imgur.com/h1EQmYK.png?1

The core module of the Orion MPCV system.

Orion Black Final by noonespecial on Sketchfab

Downloads for the Orion (DDSLoader required for DDS versions, not included)

1k Resolution Textures (Normal / DDS)

2k Resolution Textures (Normal / DDS)

HD 4k Resolution Textures (DDS)

http://i.imgur.com/uvNjDum.gif

http://i.creativecommons.org/l/by-nc-sa/3.0/88x31.png

Credits

Greys - For initial hand holding that got my started on the correct path.

Starwaster - For his Reflection Plugin Continued.

http://i.imgur.com/XDvaE87.gif

http://i.imgur.com/mnWKYnb.gif

The MPCV may already exist in game in the form of simghai's SDHI, I haven't checked yet to see if the scale matches the SLS. If it does match, then one less part(s) to make. Otherwise SDHI doesn't match, I will make a matching version.

http://i.imgur.com/cBN3egw.gif

One of the more remarkable aspects of this long distance deployable space station is "...provides deep space vehicle assembly...". Sounds like there is an existing mod to compliment that no? Also, did you notice the central component?

http://i.imgur.com/G6SPRgy.gif

This part screams "SCIENCE!". Although, coding is my weakness and I'm not confident in my skills to be able to code a new science device. But I'm willing to give it a try. Can't be that hard, can it?

http://i.imgur.com/hkVwqix.gif

Not to much to say about these. I recall seeing pretty much these exact same components in other mods. I don't recall which off the top of my head though... I'll find them later.

http://i.imgur.com/AjaX01V.gif

Mars? They mean... Duna... right?

http://i.imgur.com/Xhu5APt.gif

While there is already ARM in stock KSP (since 23.5), the components in this Boeing concept art look uniquely different...

http://i.imgur.com/8hM7O6c.gif

Not to much details about this one. I'll do some research to see if I can find more information about this Europa probe.

http://i.imgur.com/pLGJHFI.gif

Another probe, but smaller than the Europa Clipper. But then again, it is just an orbiter. (Please, no tissue paper jokes)

http://i.imgur.com/L4cvvLr.gif

Another part that screams "SCIENCE". But, just looking at that thing makes my want to break out blender and start modeling.

http://i.imgur.com/4SAiuNN.gif

200 AU... another science related probe I'm thinking. Are those..... strange solar panels or almost stock RTGs on that thing?

http://i.imgur.com/ooIxil5.gif

Another probe... another opportunity for SCIENCE.

http://i.imgur.com/R9eyRR4.gif

ARM and ADM? Hmmmm.

http://i.imgur.com/GEFbeNG.gif

This looks like a type of inflatable habitat? Didn't I see one of those already available? ;)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Over the next few weeks, I will be digging up more information and dissecting the components of this system to more fully plan out it's possible future implementation.

AU= Astronomical Unit= Distance from Earth to the Sun= 93 million miles, and yes, those are RTG's on that thing.

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wasmic

wasmic

Posted
Posted
Leopard skin? Pshaw, obviously the solution is tiger stripes, with both black and white over orange. Everybody wins!:sticktongue:
The zebra’s stripes are lacking hues,

so they don’t compare to you-know-whose.

Orange, black, and white is what to wear!

It’s haute couture for those who dare!

It’s camouflage, and stylish, too!

Yes, tigers look the best, it’s true!

I found this to be pretty fitting

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  • 2 weeks later...
noonespecial

noonespecial

Posted
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Posted

Update

A spot of bad news guys. About four months ago, I announced that I had to take a break due to health reasons. Well, my treatment is on going but recently I've taken a turn for the worse. Don't worry, it's nothing life threatening. I haven't touched a model in about two weeks because currently I find it uncomfortable to sit in any one position for any length of time. So instead of leaving you guys wondering what's up with no status updates, I'm leaving this note. I'm not sure how long it will be, but I probably won't be doing any modeling in the near future.

Best case scenario would be a few weeks, I'm seeing my doctor again tomorrow to see about having my treatment adjusted. Worst case scenario will be two or three months. Don't worry though, this mod is close to 90% completion and I plan to take it that last 10% under any circumstances.

I apologize for the delay. I know many of you are eagerly waiting for this.

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