Airplane doesnt fly well

[Alshain]

2. What do you mean by "any mass off of your thrust"?

Turn on the Center of Mass and Center of Trust indicators. The center of thrust should be DIRECTLY behind the center of mass. If it's higher lower, or worse too far left or right, then your going to have rotation issues.

[Clockwork_werewolf]

What do you mean by "any mass off of your thrust"?

Your thrust should be in line with your center of mass, if it is off by even a little without control surfaces, RCS thrusters or control wheels the craft will spin. I may have been a little confusing on that point.

4. How to prevent that? Jet engines dont work optimally anyway in high altitude.

A: You can turn down your thrust, 2 jet engines at 50% thrust use the air of one jet engine. Or...

B: You can cut the side engines leaving only one central jet engine. This will be along the center of mass so not a problem. You can even shut down pairs of engines in an order so that air is spread between 7 then 5 then 3 engines till one is left. In high atmopshere there is less drag so one engine can still accellerate you when before you needed 7.

C: You can switch to Rapier engines. These use air then switch to rocket fuel when air runs out. They will auto switch to rocket fuel when air runs low. This can be turned off and they still distribute air better than jets so spin craft less.

D: Add more air intakes. Some people have been known to use 15 ram intakes PER Engine. You can get an apoapsis above 70k this way but you still need some rockets to get you periapsis above that.

[Jetsim]

Thrust is behind CoM but in line. Also, what could cause engines to shutdown right after takeoff? They can be reactivated though.

Why does plane pitch up endlessly if I dont activelly control plane? CoL is behind CoM so it shouldnt be issue.

Edited July 23, 2014 by Jetsim

[Clockwork_werewolf]

Thrust is behind CoM but in line. Also, what could cause engines to shutdown right after takeoff? They can be reactivated though.

When not moving air intakes can fluctuate. If you have less than one intake per engine it could be that they are "stalling". This is only a theory though as I have never had it in practice.

Why does plane pitch up endlessly if I dont activelly control plane? CoL is behind CoM so it shouldnt be issue.

Planes are never truly balanced. Fuel is usually used from the front of a plane causing the COM to move backwards as fuel is used. If the plane is pointing anywhere but the direction marker (and it will need to be even to stay level) then this can make it try to turn. The auto pilot is also not perfect and can under adjust for problems (it was worse when it over adjusted as it could make planes wobble). Lastly if it is still doing this it could be that the visual COM and Lift are not quite where the REAL COM and lift are, things like landing gear have Mass in the design building but are mass-less when flown.

[Hodo]

Main wings are long, so it should get lift from the outer edges of the wings.

Unless you are running FAR, forget everything you think you know about how an aircraft works in KSP.

[Voculus]

Thrust is behind CoM but in line. Also, what could cause engines to shutdown right after takeoff? They can be reactivated though.

Why does plane pitch up endlessly if I dont activelly control plane? CoL is behind CoM so it shouldnt be issue.

It's the procedural wings. The larger they get, the less cooperative they become. I'm also convinced the CoL is shown in the wrong spot when using them.

[Jetsim]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/20451-0-24-Ferram-Aerospace-Research-v0-14-0-2-7-19-14

Should I install this?

[Hodo]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/20451-0-24-Ferram-Aerospace-Research-v0-14-0-2-7-19-14

Should I install this?

If you like building aircraft that actually use real aerodynamic forces, then yes. If you like flying in soup no.

[Jetsim]

Does it work with procedural wing?

[Hodo]

Does it work with procedural wing?

Yes very much so, I use FAR and Pwing. And that is really all I use to make wings is Procedural Wings.

[Jetsim]

What additional mods do you recommend for realistic engineering and flying/space venturing?

[Hodo]

What additional mods do you recommend for realistic engineering and flying/space venturing?

Depends on how realistic you want to get.

I have two installs, Real Solar System with Realism Overhaul and it is full realism. And I have my normal install which has the mods listed in my sig.

[Aethon]

If you're new, you may find all the info provided by FAR a little overwhelming. Ferram has a new simpler aerodynamic model out now called NEAR.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/86419-0-24-NEAR-A-Simpler-Aerodynamics-Model-v1-0-3-7-19-14

Be advised. You'll never be able to go back to stock drag again.

You might also try Kerbal Engineer Redux (KER), must have :

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/18230-0-24-Kerbal-Engineer-Redux-v0-6-2-7-and-v1-0-0-0

These days I also can't play without Kerbal Alarm Clock ( invaluable for running multiple missions ):

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/24786-0-24-0-Kerbal-Alarm-Clock-v2-7-7-0-%28July-18%29

Finally, Chatterer is just fun, and makes space less lonely.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/25367-0-23-Chatterer-v-0-5-9-2?highlight=chatterer

[Tortoise]

Woah that's a big long thing.

Anyways you should install FAR btw.

And settle for something smarter, and use jet engines.

[MarvinKitFox]

I removed controllers from main wings, and plane couldnt lift up or flipper around so those big controllers must be main lift force.

Guys, no-one is this dense.

You are being trolled.

[Clockwork_werewolf]

Guys, no-one is this dense.

I think you are confusing what is easy to know with what YOU already know. It is a very dangerous affect and I have never met someone who hasn't done it (myself included). He noticed that if he made a change (removing controllers) there was an affect (no lift or control). This is a logical conclusion. The fact that it doesn't show the whole set of underlying problems and affects is not a sign of stupidity just of lack of knowledge. There is now a lot to learn with KSP when it come to aircraft and a lot of it is not equatable to real life aircraft, which (to his cost) is what he is trying to do.

[O-Doc]

The real question is, have you made orbit with the Ares IV? Given that you are unaware of flameout means that you should probably leanr to get into space with a proven design. You're currently trying to write a novel without fully understanding spelling and grammar.

[Aethon]

Ooooo. This might help everyone fly within more acceptable parameters.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/80112-0-24-Improved-Chase-Camera-v1-4-0-%287-23%29

[Alshain]

Ooooo. This might help everyone fly within more acceptable parameters.

Not everyone, that would drive me insane.

[Jetsim]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures

I dont understand whats the difference between elevon and aileron? It just looks like wider aileron, and how is the plane supposed to pitch without canard in front? I have tried small plane with delta wings as only wings and it cant turn.

[Hodo]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures

I dont understand whats the difference between elevon and aileron? It just looks like wider aileron, and how is the plane supposed to pitch without canard in front? I have tried small plane with delta wings as only wings and it cant turn.

Elevron does the job of both the Elevator and the Aileron. Usually found on delta-wing aircraft and on some modern fighter aircraft like the F-16, F-15, Su-27 and Mig-29.

[Jetsim]

Elevron does the job of both the Elevator and the Aileron. Usually found on delta-wing aircraft and on some modern fighter aircraft like the F-16, F-15, Su-27 and Mig-29.

How does that work? Its just wider aileron, how can aileron width make it act as elevator?

[Hodo]

How does that work? Its just wider aileron, how can aileron width make it act as elevator?

It can be wide it can be thin, it really depends on the craft.

Let me see if I can find a picture of one on one of my craft.

[Hodo]

Ok not the best picture but here is one of my aircraft from my Real Solar System + Realism Overhaul.

It is a swing wing design, but uses a Eleron setup.

The tail section the two small wings that stick out to the sides, are the Elerons. They do both pitch and roll.

[Clockwork_werewolf]

I dont understand whats the difference between elevon and aileron?

Elevons/canards are for tilting up and down. They should be as far forward and backwards as possible because they want maximum leverage for turning up and down.

Ailerons are for rolling a craft. They should be as far sideways as possible because they want maximum leverage for rolling the craft.

how is the plane supposed to pitch without canard in front

I almost always have a canard in front, I'm not sure what is telling you not to. They do need to be balanced with the center of lift though.

How does that work? Its just wider aileron, how can aileron width make it act as elevator?

In KSP the name of the part (aileron, elevator, canard ect) is just a suggestion as to its use. Canards can be used on wing ends as ailerons. Ailerons can be used on the back of a craft as rudders or elevators or on the front as canards.

Their size affects their force, their position denotes their use, their name is just a suggestion.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Clockwork_werewolf