[0.90.0] Fine Print vSTOCK'D - BETA RELEASE!!! (December 15)

[T.Lancer]

Hi, awesome mod. I have a quesion though.

I have a contract that wants a probe in a certain orbit. The craft should have number of sensors. I have a part that contains many sensors including the ones the contract wants. But the contract doesn't see that as being checked. Is it possible for Fine Print to recognize the modules rather that the parts? That way it would work with any part that contains the needed module.

[Arsonide]

Hi, awesome mod. I have a quesion though.

I have a contract that wants a probe in a certain orbit. The craft should have number of sensors. I have a part that contains many sensors including the ones the contract wants. But the contract doesn't see that as being checked. Is it possible for Fine Print to recognize the modules rather that the parts? That way it would work with any part that contains the needed module.

I add support for modded parts when I can, but the contract is asking you for specific stock parts for now.

For the people saying that more than two contracts can pop up for any particular type of contract in Fine Print, I want screenshots, or it didn't happen. The only time I can think of that this might happen is immediately after a patch when the refresh happens. The refresh leaves "ghost" contracts sometimes, so it may appear as if there are more than two, but there are not. If you see more than two, and can go to the VAB and back, and there are still more than two, that's an issue. Changing scenes clears ghost contracts.

As for the lack of rescue contracts, I assure you that they are there, and that they pop up just as frequently as anything else...but the more missions you add to the pool, the less chance you get for any particular one of them to show up. It's RNG, any perceived patterns are coincidences of RNG.

[cttw]

Hi, lovely mod. When a mission requires a station to be built that supports 5 Kerbals, do I need to hire 5 astronauts and put them there or does it only need the habitable spaces for 5?

Thanks!

[juanml82]

Hi, lovely mod. When a mission requires a station to be built that supports 5 Kerbals, do I need to hire 5 astronauts and put them there or does it only need the habitable spaces for 5?

Thanks!

Habitable spaces only. Right now, I'm trying to pass an unmanned larger attempt of an SSTO as both a Kerbin Space Station and a satellite.

[Renegrade]

or were you implying that it's not possible on a stock parts only game?

The latter part (quoted). Also see below.

So? If you're running FAR, you can't claim that 'stock only' is allowed. Would it make you feel better if I put stock adapters, fuel tanks and batteries on it instead? Or are the crew parts annoying you?

SuperStock only permits physics/gameplay/info mods, and physics mods that require a SMALL number of parts. Basically any parts introduced by a mod kinda have to be justified by the physics. Ex: DREC can bring heat shields, and AJE can bring extra jet engines, but KW or SPP are major part overhauls/additions with no physics or gameplay plugin so aren't allowed there. Hence "SuperStock" and not "StockOnly" or "BogStock" or "PureStock" etc. I play under a variety of different modes with varying rulesets, and SuperStock has been the mode for the last two weeks or so..

(the 'The only stock parts I see are struts' was a joke, in case that wasn't made clear with the statement that followed)

By the way, why did you TweakScale up those panels? For aesthetic reasons I assume? It does look nice, but I don't see it needing any more power than an ox-stat (like 99.999999% of the bloody game #buffpowerrequirementsdammit).

In any case, Arsonide said that orbital assembly works, so I can just do a multi-launch. (Or just make a bigger rocket and use a steeper ascent)

Because that could easily be solved with command chairs which are small and lighter and way more cheaty.

Do the command chairs count as actual seats (they're something of a special case in normal circumstances, ex. you can't load kerbals into chairs from the Launch menu)? I thought they wouldn't, and yeah, that would indeed be crazy cheaty.

As for the lack of rescue contracts, I assure you that they are there, and that they pop up just as frequently as anything else...but the more missions you add to the pool, the less chance you get for any particular one of them to show up. It's RNG, any perceived patterns are coincidences of RNG.

I see them pop up, but it's extremely rare. If we increased the pool size, it should show up more often, should it not? Is that a doable thing? (I know Squad has put some technical limits on what can be modded, but I don't know the actual details of what their modding API exposes and what it doesn't etc)

[Arsonide]

Command chairs have no crew capacity, unfortunately.

[BudgetHedgehog]

SuperStock only permits physics/gameplay/info mods, and physics mods that require a SMALL number of parts. Basically any parts introduced by a mod kinda have to be justified by the physics. Ex: DREC can bring heat shields, and AJE can bring extra jet engines, but KW or SPP are major part overhauls/additions with no physics or gameplay plugin so aren't allowed there. Hence "SuperStock" and not "StockOnly" or "BogStock" or "PureStock" etc. I play under a variety of different modes with varying rulesets, and SuperStock has been the mode for the last two weeks or so..

(the 'The only stock parts I see are struts' was a joke, in case that wasn't made clear with the statement that followed)

By the way, why did you TweakScale up those panels? For aesthetic reasons I assume? It does look nice, but I don't see it needing any more power than an ox-stat (like 99.999999% of the bloody game #buffpowerrequirementsdammit).

Do the command chairs count as actual seats (they're something of a special case in normal circumstances, ex. you can't load kerbals into chairs from the Launch menu)? I thought they wouldn't, and yeah, that would indeed be crazy cheaty.)

1, Eh, I just see stock/modded. You got your rules, I got mine - my station was built with my rules so I'm counting it

2, Yep, they're purely aesthetic. I like NearFuture and would've put some of those solar panels on but I don't have it installed right now. You're right, it could get by perfectly fine with just a couple of OX-STAT planels

3, I haven't tried it, but I'd assume they do - granted, you can't fill them in the VAB, but if you add them to a craft, that craft can now seat one more kerbal. Arsonide, what's the official word on them? EDIT: Ooh, Arsonide is a time traveller! And I assumed wrong - good to know.

[Renegrade]

1, Eh, I just see stock/modded. You got your rules, I got mine - my station was built with my rules so I'm counting it

Actually I take what I said back.

SPP is acceptable to my SuperStock rules due to the most recent Dev Notes, lol.

And your rules are fine too.. I was just commenting that SPP was formerly against my current ruleset.

(by the way, Glow Strips and Procedural Fairings managed to wiggle past my rules for aesthetic reasons hehe)

2, Yep, they're purely aesthetic. I like NearFuture and would've put some of those solar panels on but I don't have it installed right now. You're right, it could get by perfectly fine with just a couple of OX-STAT planels

Well, it's a good aesthetic, you have a nice touch.

It's a cool looking mini-station. I'll dredge up some screenies of my own stations, they're ah, a bit bigger.

- good to know.

I was going to test, but Arsonide's post makes that unnecessary now hehe.

I'm cool actually with them not being seats, that would make space station construction way too easy.. I could just imagine a "space station" made out of a mk1 pod, an antenna, an FL-T800 tank, a LV-909, and twelve radially attached external seats.. haha..

[Arsonide]

I was going to test, but Arsonide's post makes that unnecessary now hehe.

I'm cool actually with them not being seats, that would make space station construction way too easy.. I could just imagine a "space station" made out of a mk1 pod, an antenna, an FL-T800 tank, a LV-909, and twelve radially attached external seats.. haha..

This wasn't really a decision of mine. Crew capacity is actually a Squad decision, all I did was check the part configuration, which shows that it has no capacity.

[veryinky]

This wasn't really a decision of mine. Crew capacity is actually a Squad decision, all I did was check the part configuration, which shows that it has no capacity.

I'm curious as to how the mod reacts to parts with variable crew capacity, like Porkjet's Inflatable Habitats.

Usually I just send up "space stations" that are just stacks of hitchhiker cans.

[BudgetHedgehog]

Well, it's a good aesthetic, you have a nice touch.

It's a cool looking mini-station. I'll dredge up some screenies of my own stations, they're ah, a bit bigger.

Thanks I would've added a Sr docking port on the bottom, but I hadn't unlocked it at the time. And this kind of thing is also possible in stock - you just need to not mind part clipping.

I'm cool actually with them not being seats, that would make space station construction way too easy.. I could just imagine a "space station" made out of a mk1 pod, an antenna, an FL-T800 tank, a LV-909, and twelve radially attached external seats.. haha..

Me too - would be too easy otherwise. My thanks to Arsonide for making it so.

[Renegrade]

This wasn't really a decision of mine. Crew capacity is actually a Squad decision, all I did was check the part configuration, which shows that it has no capacity.

Well, it works out well in the end. The space station contracts are one of the more fun aspects of Fine Print, and having the EAS seat count would make it way too easy, in my opinion.

Thanks for making those station contracts, btw

[vardicd]

Thats exactly what I need! Thanks so much. How do I go about adding the fineprint waypoints? Do I just click on them and it adds it or do I have to enter lat/long values?

Just use Mechjeb's rover autopilot, and set rover waypoints, click near each fineprint marker you want to visit, make sure you have stability control on, make sure your path to travel isn't going across water or mountains, and let your rover rove, while you: sleep, go to work, or do other stuff, 'cause it can take a loooooooong time to get there. {Airdropping the rover from a plane to get close is encouraged.}

[Brucey]

Question: one of those waypoint circles has appeared in my tracking station. Though I currently have no active contracts. Is that normal?

[Arsonide]

Yes, it's showing you a contract that is on the contract board.

[cartmen180]

the problem i am having is that satellite contract cannot be completed. I used mechjeb to set the the ap and pb exactly as required but it won't complete. The other requirements are no problem.

[GFBones]

What version of FinePrint are you running? Have you upgraded FinePrint since you accepted the contract?

There was an issue with detecting the cupola that was fixed a few versions ago. If the cupola objective continues failing in contracts generated by the current version, post a log and a save file.

You were right : From 0.55a to .57b makes now the cupola detectable.

...at last I guess, since all my contracts are gone, I have to accept new ones and test them.

[m_j_lyons]

Satellite contracts question - I'm still in my first day of using this fine mod...and thank you for the labor that went into it - I think it will become a staple for those that love to put things in oribit as it now gives us a real reason to build stuff.

Anyway - I got my first satellite contract and it was a pretty easy orbit to get into roughly 3500km x 2188km with an inclination of 3.8 degrees. No big deal. But it specified a longitude of ascending node (LAN) of 353 degrees. Not knowing how to "set" a LAN my orbit didn't match the target orbit...it was perhaps out of phase.?. How do you fix that? And better yet, how do you do it correctly the first time. I have MechJeb 2 which can change the LAN but it does so in degrees/minutes/seconds. I understand the concept of what LAN is - where the ascending node (AN) crosses the reference plane (the Kerbin equator in this case). But how do you change it?

My first guess is that you have to go back to an inclination of 0 (zero) and then reset the inclination when the AN is matches the desired LAN. If true - how do you convert a LAN of say 353 degrees to a longitude? (does that mean it's 7 degrees W of the prime meridian?)

Sorry for what might be a relatively basic question but I'm a poli sci major...not a rocket scientist.

- - - Updated - - -

[m_j_lyons]

the problem i am having is that satellite contract cannot be completed. I used mechjeb to set the the ap and pb exactly as required but it won't complete. The other requirements are no problem.

What is not showing completed (not turning green)?

[undercoveryankee]

Satellite contracts question - I'm still in my first day of using this fine mod...and thank you for the labor that went into it - I think it will become a staple for those that love to put things in oribit as it now gives us a real reason to build stuff.

Anyway - I got my first satellite contract and it was a pretty easy orbit to get into roughly 3500km x 2188km with an inclination of 3.8 degrees. No big deal. But it specified a longitude of ascending node (LAN) of 353 degrees. Not knowing how to "set" a LAN my orbit didn't match the target orbit...it was perhaps out of phase.?. How do you fix that? And better yet, how do you do it correctly the first time. I have MechJeb 2 which can change the LAN but it does so in degrees/minutes/seconds. I understand the concept of what LAN is - where the ascending node (AN) crosses the reference plane (the Kerbin equator in this case). But how do you change it?

My first guess is that you have to go back to an inclination of 0 (zero) and then reset the inclination when the AN is matches the desired LAN. If true - how do you convert a LAN of say 353 degrees to a longitude? (does that mean it's 7 degrees W of the prime meridian?)

Sorry for what might be a relatively basic question but I'm a poli sci major...not a rocket scientist.

- - - Updated - - -

The longitude of the ascending node changes any time you make a plane change at any location except where you cross the reference plane. If you match the target plane by burning at the marked ascending and descending nodes, that will be enough to put you at the correct LAN. (It can be hard to see how close you are to the nodes since the markers appear on the target orbit and not yours. A trick that I've found is to focus the map-view camera on the planet, rotate your view so the points of both node markers line up, then stick a maneuver node on your orbit where it crosses the markers.)

If you would rather use MechJeb to set your LAN, converting from FinePrint's decimal degrees to MechJeb's degrees-minutes-seconds is pretty easy. Multiply the fractional part of the degrees by 60 to get minutes, then multiply the fractional part of the minutes by 60 to get seconds.

And you're right: a LAN of 353 degrees east is equal to 7 degrees west. Since the planet is rotating and the orbit isn't, LAN is measured from a particular direction relative to the background stars. On Earth, the zero is the vernal equinox: one of the points where the plane of the ecliptic and Earth's equator intersect. In KSP, where Kerbin's equator is exactly in line with its orbital plane, that type of reference doesn't work, so there's no clear visual reference for the zero. It may just be the direction Kerbin's prime meridian is pointing at the epoch.

Edited August 20, 2014 by undercoveryankee

[Dingbat1967]

Two things (Maybe it was because I was running an older version of "Fine Print") ...

1) Plant flag missions seem to dissapear. Probably because there's a numerical limit on the number of missions available?

2) I noticed that there were many missions that I never accepted from Fine Print show up in my accepted list ... is this a bug?

[Threadsinger]

the problem i am having is that satellite contract cannot be completed. I used mechjeb to set the the ap and pb exactly as required but it won't complete. The other requirements are no problem.

I admit I had a similar problem. Put the satellite up, placed in the same orbit (in BOTH directions, as a test), but it wouldn't complete.

I uninstalled the mod until I get the patience to test variables, but if there is an obvious solution, I'm all ears!

(really neat mod though!!)

[JeffreyCor]

Same boat as others, the new detection for if the satellite orbit matches is far different than it used to be making it extremely difficult to complete. They used to be one of my favorite missions but now.... While I like the idea of the actual numbers showing I'd rather the contracts be completable as they used to be.

[vardicd]

I'm loving the numbers on the sat contracts, I'm just not liking the match longitude of ascending node (LAN) specifications, if you match the periapsis and apoapsis and the inclination, what does the longitude of ascending node (LAN) matter? I mean I get that it's probably important in real life for sats, but for those who have difficulty matching the first 3 requirements, getting that 4th one there, that seems like the purview of wizards.

[Crater]

I'm loving the numbers on the sat contracts, I'm just not liking the match longitude of ascending node (LAN) specifications, if you match the periapsis and apoapsis and the inclination, what does the longitude of ascending node (LAN) matter? I mean I get that it's probably important in real life for sats, but for those who have difficulty matching the first 3 requirements, getting that 4th one there, that seems like the purview of wizards.

It's at least as important as the others, I'm afraid.

Imagine two orbits. Both about circular, but about geosynchronous, both inclined at 45 degrees. One has it's northernmost point over North America, and its southernmost point over China-ish. The other has it's Northernmost point over Russia, and its southermost somewhere in Brazil. And yet.... both have the same AP, the same PE, and the same inclination. The only difference is that the America/China one has an LAN of about 180deg and the Brazil/Russia one has a LAN of about 0deg.

So for even slightly inclined orbits, LAN differences put you on wildly different paths.